Cylinder heads. Stock iron or aluminum?

[DeltaMustang65]

Guess I'm still on the fence about this after all. I'm trying to decide what to do when I rebuild the 289 in my '65 coupe. (Assuming it doesn't sell, which it probably won't by the end of this month)

I thought I wanted to keep the original iron heads and get them worked by a machine shop like www.powerheads.com. However...as far as cost goes, I know that if I use the original heads it'll run about $1,000 for the machine work. I'm not sure about the aluminum heads, though. Will they need $1,000 to get them worked similarly? I'm kinda assuming that any new aluminum heads will come with things like upgraded valves, chrome moly retainers, heavy duty locks, .550 lift high performance spring package, screw in studs with guide plate assemblies, and hardened chrome moly exhaust seat inserts. If not, at least something similar or at least built strong enough for my application, I'd hope. If they came with these, that'd cut down a lot of the cost since the machine shop wouldn't have to fool around with these things, right? If all I'd have to get done is a port and polish plus some bowl work, that'd be alright. I'm just trying to get an idea of what I can expect to pay and get out of each option before I get in over my head. Any help is much appreciated. Thanks in advance.

[Dark Knight]

My AFR's went straight on the car un-touched. As long as you buy complete heads, you dont need anything other than pushrods and rockers. Make sure you dont get pedestal mount heads. Most aluminum heads are such a step above stock that bowl work etc really isn't needed...

[DeltaMustang65]

I remember about pedestal mount heads being bad, but I can't remember exactly why.

Are new aluminum heads cast so precisely that they don't require port polish and bowl work? Or should I get this done mildly while the heads are off, instead of possibly wanting to get it done after I finish building the engine. What can I expect to invest in some mild machine work on aluminum heads?

[Rev]

AFR's come CNC ported. No work is necessary. I spent a whopping $150 getting my TFTW heads pocket ported. The TFTW heads come with 1/4" higher rails for the valve covers mounting surface allowing stock valve covers with roller rockers and no clearance problems. There really should not be much extra work needed with new Al. heads.

Rev

[Dark Knight]

FWIW, my point was that you can put a set of alum. heads on the car and see a big improvement of even a set of ported stock heads. I have a set of ported 66 289 heads, 1.94/1.50 valves etc, and they still dont flow as good as any alum. head out there. Just remember to get pistons with notches to match whatever head you use.

[Phillyfanfrombirth]

I picked up a set of complete, cast, Windsor Jr heads about 10 years ago for about $800. Bolt on and go. If you're after performance, I just don't see the point (outside of having original heads) in throwing the money into the machine work.

[mustangman65_79]

$1000 seems really high for head work, ask around, anything over $500 is just too much and would be better off with aluminum heads.

[DeltaMustang65]

Thanks guys.

The AFRs and TFTWs sound interesting, although I must admit I don't know anything about them. I like the idea of aluminum heads coming CNC ported out of the box, and also being able to use stock valve covers. Any chance of me being able to do both? (ie, AFRs being pre-ported AND able to use stock valve covers.) Or should I think about going with the TFTWs and pocket porting?

Also, try not to laugh, but what does AFR and TFTW stand for? What is pocket porting? Porting them yourself or what? I've never done machine work, myself.

Lastly, are there any similar options from Ford? I've heard that the GT-40 heads are good, but I don't know if they come CNC ported or let you use stock covers or any nifty stuff like that.

(I want to say "air flow research" and "trick flow twisted wedge", but I'm not sure. I looked for AFR heads on summit.com and couldn't find anything, so...)

[Rev]

[QUOTE=mattgoveiagt]Thanks guys.

The AFRs and TFTWs sound interesting, although I must admit I don't know anything about them. I like the idea of aluminum heads coming CNC ported out of the box, and also being able to use stock valve covers. Any chance of me being able to do both? (ie, AFRs being pre-ported AND able to use stock valve covers.) Or should I think about going with the TFTWs and pocket porting?

That was my dilemma in choosing between the AFR 165's and TFTW. The TFTW are about $200 cheaper and you don't need the tall valve covers saving about $300 or so. The TFTW also comes with 2.02/1.6 valves. The AFR's (Air Flow Research) come completely CNC ported but with 1.94/1.6 valves.

Also, try not to laugh, but what does AFR and TFTW stand for? What is pocket porting? Porting them yourself or what? I've never done machine work, myself.

I bought the TFTW (TrickFlow Twisted Wedge) heads and spent $150 getting them pocket ported. Thats just blending and smoothing the bowl area where the runners meet the valves. Get a pro to do that. Shouldn't cost a whole lot for that.

Lastly, are there any similar options from Ford? I've heard that the GT-40 heads are good, but I don't know if they come CNC ported or let you use stock covers or any nifty stuff like that.

The GT-40X heads are said to be good. I would prefer either the AFR or TFTW over them. They are a little more expensive also (I think - not really sure on that).

(I want to say "air flow research" and "trick flow twisted wedge", but I'm not sure. I looked for AFR heads on summit.com and couldn't find anything, so...)


That was my dilemma as well. I finally did choose the pocket ported TFTW heads. I really don't think you could tell the difference though between the AFR and TFTW heads if you compared their performance side by side.

BTW, I think Summit owns TrickFlow now (not completely sure), so no AFR's there. [\Quote]

Rev

[69fastback]

alum is the way to go. I ending up spending 900 bucks getting head work done on my CJ. Bowl work, springs couple new valves and stuff like that. I was pissed when I found out edelbrock alum heads where only 1100 with everything already to bolt to car. Even the springs where good enough for my cam.

AFR is air flow research. The best ford head are the gt-40x turbo swills I think that is what they are called. Probably a little to much head for what you are doing. I have purchased trick flow products for my 91 and was very impressed with them. Workmanship was excellent. I really don't know anything about AFR 165s other than your normal magazine and internet articles. Everyone says how good they are. I would defenitly recomend the Trick flow heads.

[DeltaMustang65]

Hmmm...that's another thing I have to consider, not getting too much "head" (GT40-X) for what I want to do with the engine. But wouldn't AFR or TFTW heads fall into that category, too?

I'm kinda leaning towards the TFTW heads right now, since I'd like to keep the original valve covers and be extra sneaky.

[Rev]

AFR 165's or 185's and TFTW are "street" heads. They each make (as well as many other companies) racing type heads that wouldn't be appropriate for your application. The AFR 165 and TFTW are made for street use and are not dedicated racing heads, and so are not too much head for you.

Rev

[DeltaMustang65]

Ah, I see what you're saying now. For a second, I was wondering if these heads would be too much for my little 289, even though they are street heads. I'm looking into these, but if anyone has any other suggestions, feel free to let me know.

[69fastback]

You defenitly don't have to worry about the standard TFTW heads being to much for your car. They are a basic entry level street head as are the AFR 165s. Sorry if I caused any confussion. If you buy either one of these heads you can't go wrong.