Need stall converter advice

Rev · 04-16-2000, 10:13 AM

May have fried the stock C-4 in my '66 coupe. If I have to remove/install a rebuild, I'm thinking maybe a B&M Hole Shot 2400 converter and a shift kit as well. If anyone is knowledgeable about automatics, I could use advice. (1) Does reving between 2-3 upshifts mean the high gear clutches are toast? (2) How will the 2400 Hole Shot act on the street; gas mileage, cruise, etc.? (3) How much good will this converter do at the drag strip 1/4 mile. Have about 300 hp @ 5100 / 340 lb-ft @ 3700 now and run 13.97 at 100.3 with the stock C-4 in a 3020 lb. "66 coupe (wt.is without me). Any input appreciated.

Rev

------------------
'66 Coupe, 306, windage
tray, TRW flat tops, 351W
heads,pocket ported, 268
CC hydraulic cam, R tip
R's, Edelbrock Performer,
600 CFM Holley vac. secs.,
Mallory Unilite, coil, fuel
pump, Tri-Y headers, 2 1/2 "
custom pipes, 3 chamber
Flows, stock C-4, 3.25
Currie built 8" rear,
March under drive pulleys,
13.97 e.t., 100.1 mph
1/4 mi.

Ron1 · 04-16-2000, 07:32 PM

Could be the clutches or bands. Might recommend Kevlar if you have to dig in anyway. A 2400 stall should have a minimal affect on mileage. I ran a 2400 in my coupe, for about a year and never had a problem. If you go racing which I see you do, I would also recommend a Manual Valve body, reverse pattern. Maybe an Art Carr. I run a 4000 stall in my FB, lauch at 4600 against the 3 step, so the HP actually overcomes the stall. Once you have the reverse pattern, you will never go back. Much quicker.

Ron

65 FB is at www.rfedd.bigstep.com

Rev · 04-16-2000, 09:24 PM

Ron, do you have any guesses as to E.T. improvement with just the 2400 stall converter and a shift kit. Probably can't afford an Art Carr valve body or anything very fancy. Thanks for the response.

Rev

------------------
'66 Coupe, 306, windage
tray, TRW flat tops, 351W
heads,pocket ported, 268
CC hydraulic cam, R tip
R's, Edelbrock Performer,
600 CFM Holley vac. secs.,
Mallory Unilite, coil, fuel
pump, Tri-Y headers, 2 1/2 "
custom pipes, 3 chamber
Flows, stock C-4, 3.25
Currie built 8" rear,
March under drive pulleys,
13.97 e.t., 100.1 mph
1/4 mi.

Ron1 · 04-17-2000, 08:57 AM

Before I answer that, what are your 60 foot times, and what kind of tire do you use at the strip? Also I do have access to a valve body. Guy is going a Manual reverse pattern to one with a transbrake. I could ask how much...I have been racing with him for years, so I know him and his car quite weell.

Ron

Rev · 04-17-2000, 08:39 PM

My '60' times are (best, 2.11 with 215/70/R/14's-Firestones)., Now run (235/60/R/15's-BFG Radial TA 15's). Niether spun too much at the track due to VHT, lots of rubber at the line etc. '60 times are a little worse with the better tires, while the ET and Mph are some better due to bolt on mods and better tuning. I think spinning a little more helped my '60 times as this acted like a little higher stall getting me in to my "sweet spot" a little sooner. With my now marginally better tires, and a proposed slightly higer stall converter and a shift kit, I'm hoping for a tenth or two. I'm only asking for a "gut" opinion, I know there are no guaratees. Thanks for the responses.

Rev

------------------
'66 Coupe, 306, windage
tray, TRW flat tops, 351W
heads,pocket ported, 268
CC hydraulic cam, R tip
R's, Edelbrock Performer,
600 CFM Holley vac. secs.,
Mallory Unilite, coil, fuel
pump, Tri-Y headers, 2 1/2 "
custom pipes, 3 chamber
Flows, stock C-4, 3.25
Currie built 8" rear,
March under drive pulleys,
13.97 e.t., 100.1 mph
1/4 mi.

Rev · 04-17-2000, 09:09 PM

Sorry, I didn't mention current '60 times. Now running 2.18-2.20 at '60 in the 13.97/100.3 runs.

Rev

------------------
'66 Coupe, 306, windage
tray, TRW flat tops, 351W
heads,pocket ported, 268
CC hydraulic cam, R tip
R's, Edelbrock Performer,
600 CFM Holley vac. secs.,
Mallory Unilite, coil, fuel
pump, Tri-Y headers, 2 1/2 "
custom pipes, 3 chamber
Flows, stock C-4, 3.25
Currie built 8" rear,
March under drive pulleys,
13.97 e.t., 100.1 mph
1/4 mi.

86LX5liter · 04-18-2000, 07:23 PM

i own an 86 LX (duh). but the drivetrain is 69. i just had my c-4 rebuilt. the stock tranny blew, too much power i guess. total price was 700. i got the 2800 stall converter, reverse manual valvebody, shift kit, kevlar clutches, input shaft, front drum. there is more, just can't remember. anyway, as far as mileage, i didn't see it get any worse with the converter. my car revs high at highway speed with the c-4, i have 3.27 gears, and at 70 i am just below 3000 RPM. but, when the tranny shifts now, the car launches. it is unbelievable. i am veeeeeery happy with my rebuilt ford unit, and didn't have to spend thousands. thopught i would put my two cents in.

------------------
86LX 306 out of a 69. c-4 auto with b&m shift kit. 3.27 gears
1 5/8" flowtech longtubes, 2 1/2" flowmasters, ported polished and shaved edelbrock performer intake
Holley 650 vacuum carb. ported, polished early casting heads.
11:1 compression, accel 300 race wires, stock duraspark ignition, with MSD blaster 2 coil.

12.6 @115 on GTech

86LX5liter · 04-18-2000, 07:24 PM

i own an 86 LX (duh). but the drivetrain is 69. i just had my c-4 rebuilt. the stock tranny blew, too much power i guess. total price was 700. i got the 2800 stall converter, reverse manual valvebody, shift kit, kevlar clutches, input shaft, front drum. there is more, just can't remember. anyway, as far as mileage, i didn't see it get any worse with the converter. my car revs high at highway speed with the c-4, i have 3.27 gears, and at 70 i am just below 3000 RPM. but, when the tranny shifts now, the car launches. it is unbelievable. i am veeeeeery happy with my rebuilt ford unit, and didn't have to spend thousands. thopught i would put my two cents in.

------------------
86LX 306 out of a 69. c-4 auto with b&m shift kit. 3.27 gears
1 5/8" flowtech longtubes, 2 1/2" flowmasters, ported polished and shaved edelbrock performer intake
Holley 650 vacuum carb. ported, polished early casting heads.
11:1 compression, accel 300 race wires, stock duraspark ignition, with MSD blaster 2 coil.

12.6 @115 on GTech

Ron1 · 04-18-2000, 10:31 PM

Rev, I would think 2 to 3 tenth is not unreasonable. You speed tells me it comes on real nice at the back end. So hooking it up is the problem. If ever you decide on slicks, let me know and I will pass along some horrors stories about using slicks for the first time. They hook up, but everything else lets go, so it will take some simple mods.

Ron

PS...The Art Carr is 240.00 new, $125.00 used.

Rev · 04-19-2000, 10:55 AM

Ron, thanks for the input. Car actully hooks pretty well with stock converter. Stalls at about 1800 with my extra torque. Suspension is really set up more for road race than drag. Stiff springs, 1 1/8" front sway bar and 3/4" rear. Weight distibution is good though with battery in trunk, al intake , water pump, etc. 53% front, 47% rear, with me in car. 2500 converter with street radials may cause a traction problem, but that's OK, just more future projects. I think I'll probably stick with automatic shifting with manual over ride as 99% is street driving. Track is only 3-4 times a year, with some street racing when I can get it. Thanks for the help.

Rev

86LX5liter, do you have any times before and after your rebuild, either track or G-Tech. Sounds like your car is really quick. Thanks for the response.

Rev

------------------
'66 Coupe, 306, windage
tray, TRW flat tops, 351W
heads,pocket ported, 268
CC hydraulic cam, R tip
R's, Edelbrock Performer,
600 CFM Holley vac. secs.,
Mallory Unilite, coil, fuel
pump, Tri-Y headers, 2 1/2 "
custom pipes, 3 chamber
Flows, stock C-4, 3.25
Currie built 8" rear,
March under drive pulleys,
13.97 e.t., 100.1 mph
1/4 mi.

04-16-2000, 10:13 AM	#1
Rev Registered Member Join Date: Nov 1998 Location: Houston, Tx. Posts: 3,887	Need stall converter advice May have fried the stock C-4 in my '66 coupe. If I have to remove/install a rebuild, I'm thinking maybe a B&M Hole Shot 2400 converter and a shift kit as well. If anyone is knowledgeable about automatics, I could use advice. (1) Does reving between 2-3 upshifts mean the high gear clutches are toast? (2) How will the 2400 Hole Shot act on the street; gas mileage, cruise, etc.? (3) How much good will this converter do at the drag strip 1/4 mile. Have about 300 hp @ 5100 / 340 lb-ft @ 3700 now and run 13.97 at 100.3 with the stock C-4 in a 3020 lb. "66 coupe (wt.is without me). Any input appreciated. Rev ------------------ '66 Coupe, 306, windage tray, TRW flat tops, 351W heads,pocket ported, 268 CC hydraulic cam, R tip R's, Edelbrock Performer, 600 CFM Holley vac. secs., Mallory Unilite, coil, fuel pump, Tri-Y headers, 2 1/2 " custom pipes, 3 chamber Flows, stock C-4, 3.25 Currie built 8" rear, March under drive pulleys, 13.97 e.t., 100.1 mph 1/4 mi.

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04-16-2000, 07:32 PM	#2
Ron1 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: Vancouver, WA USA Posts: 439	Could be the clutches or bands. Might recommend Kevlar if you have to dig in anyway. A 2400 stall should have a minimal affect on mileage. I ran a 2400 in my coupe, for about a year and never had a problem. If you go racing which I see you do, I would also recommend a Manual Valve body, reverse pattern. Maybe an Art Carr. I run a 4000 stall in my FB, lauch at 4600 against the 3 step, so the HP actually overcomes the stall. Once you have the reverse pattern, you will never go back. Much quicker. Ron 65 FB is at www.rfedd.bigstep.com

04-16-2000, 09:24 PM	#3
Rev Registered Member Join Date: Nov 1998 Location: Houston, Tx. Posts: 3,887	Ron, do you have any guesses as to E.T. improvement with just the 2400 stall converter and a shift kit. Probably can't afford an Art Carr valve body or anything very fancy. Thanks for the response. Rev ------------------ '66 Coupe, 306, windage tray, TRW flat tops, 351W heads,pocket ported, 268 CC hydraulic cam, R tip R's, Edelbrock Performer, 600 CFM Holley vac. secs., Mallory Unilite, coil, fuel pump, Tri-Y headers, 2 1/2 " custom pipes, 3 chamber Flows, stock C-4, 3.25 Currie built 8" rear, March under drive pulleys, 13.97 e.t., 100.1 mph 1/4 mi.

04-17-2000, 08:57 AM	#4
Ron1 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: Vancouver, WA USA Posts: 439	Before I answer that, what are your 60 foot times, and what kind of tire do you use at the strip? Also I do have access to a valve body. Guy is going a Manual reverse pattern to one with a transbrake. I could ask how much...I have been racing with him for years, so I know him and his car quite weell. Ron

04-17-2000, 08:39 PM	#5
Rev Registered Member Join Date: Nov 1998 Location: Houston, Tx. Posts: 3,887	My '60' times are (best, 2.11 with 215/70/R/14's-Firestones)., Now run (235/60/R/15's-BFG Radial TA 15's). Niether spun too much at the track due to VHT, lots of rubber at the line etc. '60 times are a little worse with the better tires, while the ET and Mph are some better due to bolt on mods and better tuning. I think spinning a little more helped my '60 times as this acted like a little higher stall getting me in to my "sweet spot" a little sooner. With my now marginally better tires, and a proposed slightly higer stall converter and a shift kit, I'm hoping for a tenth or two. I'm only asking for a "gut" opinion, I know there are no guaratees. Thanks for the responses. Rev ------------------ '66 Coupe, 306, windage tray, TRW flat tops, 351W heads,pocket ported, 268 CC hydraulic cam, R tip R's, Edelbrock Performer, 600 CFM Holley vac. secs., Mallory Unilite, coil, fuel pump, Tri-Y headers, 2 1/2 " custom pipes, 3 chamber Flows, stock C-4, 3.25 Currie built 8" rear, March under drive pulleys, 13.97 e.t., 100.1 mph 1/4 mi.

04-17-2000, 09:09 PM	#6
Rev Registered Member Join Date: Nov 1998 Location: Houston, Tx. Posts: 3,887	Sorry, I didn't mention current '60 times. Now running 2.18-2.20 at '60 in the 13.97/100.3 runs. Rev ------------------ '66 Coupe, 306, windage tray, TRW flat tops, 351W heads,pocket ported, 268 CC hydraulic cam, R tip R's, Edelbrock Performer, 600 CFM Holley vac. secs., Mallory Unilite, coil, fuel pump, Tri-Y headers, 2 1/2 " custom pipes, 3 chamber Flows, stock C-4, 3.25 Currie built 8" rear, March under drive pulleys, 13.97 e.t., 100.1 mph 1/4 mi.

04-18-2000, 07:23 PM	#7
86LX5liter Registered Member Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: NY Posts: 524	i own an 86 LX (duh). but the drivetrain is 69. i just had my c-4 rebuilt. the stock tranny blew, too much power i guess. total price was 700. i got the 2800 stall converter, reverse manual valvebody, shift kit, kevlar clutches, input shaft, front drum. there is more, just can't remember. anyway, as far as mileage, i didn't see it get any worse with the converter. my car revs high at highway speed with the c-4, i have 3.27 gears, and at 70 i am just below 3000 RPM. but, when the tranny shifts now, the car launches. it is unbelievable. i am veeeeeery happy with my rebuilt ford unit, and didn't have to spend thousands. thopught i would put my two cents in. ------------------ 86LX 306 out of a 69. c-4 auto with b&m shift kit. 3.27 gears 1 5/8" flowtech longtubes, 2 1/2" flowmasters, ported polished and shaved edelbrock performer intake Holley 650 vacuum carb. ported, polished early casting heads. 11:1 compression, accel 300 race wires, stock duraspark ignition, with MSD blaster 2 coil. 12.6 @115 on GTech

04-18-2000, 07:24 PM	#8
86LX5liter Registered Member Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: NY Posts: 524	i own an 86 LX (duh). but the drivetrain is 69. i just had my c-4 rebuilt. the stock tranny blew, too much power i guess. total price was 700. i got the 2800 stall converter, reverse manual valvebody, shift kit, kevlar clutches, input shaft, front drum. there is more, just can't remember. anyway, as far as mileage, i didn't see it get any worse with the converter. my car revs high at highway speed with the c-4, i have 3.27 gears, and at 70 i am just below 3000 RPM. but, when the tranny shifts now, the car launches. it is unbelievable. i am veeeeeery happy with my rebuilt ford unit, and didn't have to spend thousands. thopught i would put my two cents in. ------------------ 86LX 306 out of a 69. c-4 auto with b&m shift kit. 3.27 gears 1 5/8" flowtech longtubes, 2 1/2" flowmasters, ported polished and shaved edelbrock performer intake Holley 650 vacuum carb. ported, polished early casting heads. 11:1 compression, accel 300 race wires, stock duraspark ignition, with MSD blaster 2 coil. 12.6 @115 on GTech

04-18-2000, 10:31 PM	#9
Ron1 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: Vancouver, WA USA Posts: 439	Rev, I would think 2 to 3 tenth is not unreasonable. You speed tells me it comes on real nice at the back end. So hooking it up is the problem. If ever you decide on slicks, let me know and I will pass along some horrors stories about using slicks for the first time. They hook up, but everything else lets go, so it will take some simple mods. Ron PS...The Art Carr is 240.00 new, $125.00 used.

04-19-2000, 10:55 AM	#10
Rev Registered Member Join Date: Nov 1998 Location: Houston, Tx. Posts: 3,887	Ron, thanks for the input. Car actully hooks pretty well with stock converter. Stalls at about 1800 with my extra torque. Suspension is really set up more for road race than drag. Stiff springs, 1 1/8" front sway bar and 3/4" rear. Weight distibution is good though with battery in trunk, al intake , water pump, etc. 53% front, 47% rear, with me in car. 2500 converter with street radials may cause a traction problem, but that's OK, just more future projects. I think I'll probably stick with automatic shifting with manual over ride as 99% is street driving. Track is only 3-4 times a year, with some street racing when I can get it. Thanks for the help. Rev 86LX5liter, do you have any times before and after your rebuild, either track or G-Tech. Sounds like your car is really quick. Thanks for the response. Rev ------------------ '66 Coupe, 306, windage tray, TRW flat tops, 351W heads,pocket ported, 268 CC hydraulic cam, R tip R's, Edelbrock Performer, 600 CFM Holley vac. secs., Mallory Unilite, coil, fuel pump, Tri-Y headers, 2 1/2 " custom pipes, 3 chamber Flows, stock C-4, 3.25 Currie built 8" rear, March under drive pulleys, 13.97 e.t., 100.1 mph 1/4 mi.