Mustang engine I.D. Help

[hotrod5125]

I have been trying to retime my ford 302 Mustang-motor in my 51 F-1 with no luck .The person i bought the truck from said the engine came out of a 1978 mustang.A guy at my local speed shop told me i might have a different engine than i think and the firing order is diferent on some of the small block fords??? The engine ID number is D8V8-6015-A3AZ.I have the firing order on the distributor cap clockwise rotation 1-8-4-5-6-2-7-3. With the rotor button piont at #1 on "TDC"piston (pass side forward most cylinder).I have the pistons in this order pass side front as 1 then 2 -3 -4. Driver side front as 5 then 6 -7-8 ??? I'am a welder/fabricator not a engine guy and i think i'am proving it trying to make this truck run with this motor out of a Mustang. Thanks for any help please.
Steve

[hunting4bear]

cant help you totally on the engine block codes but i can tell you this the very first 2 digits ( letters combo ) D8 is production of 1978-1979 model year the v8 i am not sure on appilcation v tells the model vehickle it was used in and the 8 the engineering group. next set of numbers 60156 tells you its a motor block casting. last 4 digits tel the revisions or modifications.

as for firing orders i do know some camshaft applications as example if you have after market cams say in a 351 and but a replacement cam the firing order can be different versus say a 302 cam grind so you may have a different camshaft then original. but if i remember off top of head passengers side bank front to rear is 1 2 3 4 drivers side front to rear 5 6 7 8 with a firing order on 302 of 1 5 4 2 6 3 7 8. and 1 3 7 2 6 5 4 8 for a 351. i may be wrong but those stick in head for some reason for correct position and fire orders. but the rotation is counter clock wise not clockwise and fireing order in reverse for what you show above is for a 351 v8 not a 302 .

Dave

[Rev]

[QUOTE=hotrod5125]I have the firing order on the distributor cap clockwise rotation 1-8-4-5-6-2-7-3.
[QUOTE]

You need to go counter clockwise and use 15426378 as hunting4bear suggested. I think that's right anyway. Try that and see what happens.

Rev

[hunting4bear]

one thing i didnt mention last post ... a buddy had same thing going on with a truck he had some one told him he had a 302 in it but turned out to be a 351 it would start and run rough with wires in position using 302 firing order ( go figure huh )

first find #1 position on dist cap this wire goes to passengers side front cylinder and going counter clock wisefor wires for firing order

if firing order of plugs ( mirror image of what you typed 1-8-4-5-6-2-7-3 ) 1-3-7-2-6-5-4-8 then motor is a 351 ( this all assumes motor runs fine )

if motor runs rough then try the following 302 firing order from #1 on cap again counter clockwise rotation 1-5-4-2-6-3-7-8

one other thing you can also check for on the motor for a number ... on the cyclinder heads themselves look for casting markings as follows if there is a cast number IE D5AE-A*-*** similar to these below then motor is a 351 or has 351 heads on it and the m series motors were used across alot of applications from 1971 to 1979 in midsize and full size cars and trucks and later 77 to 82 broncos

D5AE-AA ('77-later 351M/400, CF mark) 76.9cc chamber heads

D5AE-AA ('77-later 351M/400, MCC mark) 78.4cc chamber heads

D5AE-A2A ('77-later 351M/400) 74.5cc chamber heads

D5AE-A3A ('77-later 351M/400) 74.5cc chamber heads


ok i think thats tosses enough additional confusion out there for now good luck hotrod :-)

[PKRWUD]

Let me try and make this a little easier for you. Do this:

Forget everything you've read up to this point (they are correct, but I don't want it to confuse you).

Take the spark plug wire that goes to #3 on your cap, and the wire that goes to #5 on your cap, and switch them (on the cap).

Next, do the same thing with the wires that go to #4 and #7 (on the cap).

See what that does for you.

[hunting4bear]

quick easy point pkrwud those are only difference in firing order switching those 4 wires. but i am seeing some funky casting number pointing to maybe hotrod may have a 351 not a 302 as he was originally told

I did find out some more info also if those numbers off cast are correct

HOTROD you said first 4 numbers off block were D8V8 could this be D8VE maybe well anyways
D = 1970's
8 = 78 - 79 production year
V= lincoln car motor was original being built for
E would be engine group (i show no 8 for 4th digit used in cast numbers in my info i have here in a book)

6015 is engine block

and the last 4 digit are design change data info


atleast we can help him in firing orders both ways weather its 302 or 351 :-)

i'm placing my beating money on the 351 for possible motor tho

[Rev]

My 351W heads have 351 in the casting underneath the valve cover. Look there to see if you have a 351W or not.

Rev

[PKRWUD]

Well, it's one of two firing orders, and if the one he's using now doesn't work, it would be simple to just swap those 4 wires and try the other. It won't cause any damage, and more than likely will get it running right.

Just a thought.

[hotrod5125]

Thanks guys for all your help, i will take the valve covers off tonite and see if the heads are marked for a 351. Then i will try changing the wires around.I did notice the other day when i had it running BUT not very well it GAS fouled the #2 and #3 spark plug really quick, i quess if the timing is off it is easier to gas foul the plugs.

Thanks Again
Steve Rushing
Ocala Fl

[Ieatcamaros]

If the motor runs right with the firing order of 1-3-7-2-6-5-4-8, does not mean that it is a 351. A 302 cam will fit in a 351 block. The 302 firing order was 1-5-4-2-6-3-7-8 up until 85. Then, when they introduced the HO's they went with the 351 firing order. The easiest way to identify a 351 from a 302 is to measure the intake between the heads. Or look at the block where the timing cover bolts to it right next to the head. If the head/deck is directly above the bolt, it is a 302 block. If there is about 1 inch of space between the bolt and the head/deck, then it is a 351. I hope I have shed some light instead of confusing you.

The above information simply: Measure the intake between the heads and determine the firing order. Remember the distributor rotates ccw. Post the results.

FWIW, it is a 78 block you are working with.

[hunting4bear]

very good point ieatcamaros like i had mentioned on cam deferences in first post but duhhhhhh never gave it a thought of other way around for cam switches . and thanks from me for the little tid bit on head/deck bolts i will remember that and yup i agree the cast numbers telling the tail of a 78 block what what i see.
i wil file that little info away for future reference on quick telltail signs for 351

[PKRWUD]

Keep in mind that there were two very different 351 engines in use in 1978; the 351W and the 351M.

[~The Jester~]

351M had a dry intake manifold, ie thermostat is in the block, 351W has a wet intake, ie thermostat is in the intake.

351W has a 3/4" lip right behind the distributor (Taller deck, lip extends block up to the bottom of the intake) and a 302 has hardly any lip at all behind the distributor.

Go with what you've learned from the firing orders in this thread. Just cuz it's a 351 doesn't mean somone didn't throw a 302 cam in it, or vice versa. Like my Dad always told me, "NEVER assume the idiot that worked on it before you, knew what he was doing."

Good luck!

[PKRWUD]

Originally Posted by ~The Jester~

Like my Dad always told me, "NEVER assume the idiot that worked on it before you, knew what he was doing."

I like your Dad. Never met the man, but I already like him.

[Unit 5302]

You casting number is wrong.

It's D8VE. Punching the D8VE-6015 into google, there is a website I found that identified the engine as a 302.

http://www.dinlocker.com/StangRebuild/