what to do... 289,302, or 351

[Ron1]

Your 289 may be OK, but he mentioned N2O...lets say 100 or 150 shot. If he achieves 400 horse and ads 150 of N2O that would be 550 horse. That's walking a real fine line.

Just my opinion...having run N2O for about 6 years now, I have seen what it can do.

Ron

[DJs350H]

I am glad my reply could be of assistance to you!

I was thinking about your question regarding the roller rockers, and the cam suggestions. I've seen them install roller rockers by themselves on modern 5.0s (which have roller cams) that saw a worthwhile increase in horsepower, so alone the rockers must count for something with their decrease in friction. So I think roller rockers are a pretty safe bet. Plus, you can reuse the rockers if you get a roller cam down the line--that is what I did. I was running the rockers with a hydraulic cam.

As for straight bolt on, probably not the Crane rockers. The 1.73 Rockers (and probably similarly sized 1.6) are pretty big. They didn't fit under my open letter Cobra valve covers at all. So I bought a set of proper matching 1" spacers from Tony D. Branda Shelby and Mustangs (which looked ugly underneath the valvecovers) and the rockers seemed to fit fine underneath, but later on I discovered they were rubbing the edges. So check clearances if you go the spacer route, and grind the spacers accordingly (there was plenty of material to remove).

But what I ended up doing was springing the $$$ for the Raised open letter Cobra aluminum valve covers from Tony D. Branda (which looked great), and are made to clear roller rockers. But even if you go this route, check clearences as well to be safe. You don't want to see chunks taken out of your rockers--ask me how I know.

As for cam choices....I know edelbrock does a lot of R&D on their products--and its easy to find out from them what power levels you can from bolting on their specific components. If you want to go with Edelbrock heads, they've already gone through the trouble of designing cams and intakes to match them. So that would be one avenue to explore.

Other than that I would suggest getting a cam ground for your application. But if that is a bit pricey, I would sit down with some software or an engine builder with Ford PERFORMANCE experience to pick one--they usually have some good ideas as they've seen some pretty good examples. Crane, Comp Cams, and Lunati make some good products. And I know Crane makes a full roller coversion if your interested, and so does Lunati, but pricing is standard for a roller--$$$. But I think it's worth it...

.......As for the 0.060" overbore, Ron, I certainly understand and appreciate your concern. You are right to be cautiou! I had to do it to clean up the bores, and my engine guy said it would be fine--even though all the mags don't really agree. It should be fine with all the nauturally aspirated power that will be available, but you're right I may be pushing it a bit with a hefty shot of nitrous.

My engine guy gave me the green light to mess with the gass, but we haven't discussed how much yet. But all the internals are forged, and all the bolts are upgraded to ARP, and the bottom end is getting strengthened. The only thing I have to worry about is a block crack....which I will avoid smartly!

But I don't think I'll hit the nitrous for awhile after the block is back in, and the car is on the road. I'll probably only use it at the track too, or on some ego building dyno runs! I've got some serious suspension and drivetrain strengthening to do anyway. And I want this rebuild to last for awhile. So I'm going to get one of those tunable dual shot sytems, so I can take it easy....or poor it on if ever I get courageous enough

Oh, and I am making the proper cooling system upgrades too i.e. Edelbrock water pump, Aluminum radiator, and high flow thermo! Hopefully she'll run just right...

Dan

[Ron1]

Good idea on the tunable system for the N2O. I installed the NOS Progressive Controller that is not only time based, but level based as well. Since the motor is fairly new, so far I have tried only a 100 horse, and finally tuned it down to having the whole 100 on launch, and staying on 100 throughout the pass. Very favorable results. Next week...100 on launch, another 100 dialed in over 6 seconds (saves on a second set of solenoid, not only money but space). BTW... as far as power out of the 347, it made 604.6 HP at 7400 and 487 ft/lbs of torque at 5400...no power adders.

Ron

[DJs350H]

Wow Ron,

I am totally impressed with your power numbers. So what exactly do you have in your engine? I was wondering how my combo would compare, even though all the cam numbers and head flow numbers aren't determined yet. My engine guy has said an easy 350, but has said he'll find out more as he gets into it. I was hoping for some pretty impressive numbers (like mid to high 400s) with all that I've spent. Especially since he's setting it up with heads, intake, and a camshaft that will work well together.

I had some questions about N20 as well. I was thinking of a tunable dual shot....so are you saying if I get a progressive controller I won't have to buy two selenoids? I'm just starting to learn about this stuff.

How does the dual shot work without a controller? Just one shot, then another right by the driver? But the progressive controller does everyhting for you right in order to help fight traction problems and add power at the right times?

Also, I was thinking about getting the intake plumbed for a direct port shot, and the stealth look. Have you heard about the benifits of doing it this way as oppossed to a plate system? And is it easy to change jets this way? And how do you tune this way?

Thanks,
Dan

[Ron1]

Dan, Just a 302 (R302 block), 347 stroker kit from jds performance in Florida. Eagle H beams, forged crank, Ross domed pistons, Edelbrock Victor jr heads (stage II) and intake that is port matched to the heads. BG 850 carb. Cam is a solid roller. .702/.712 lift at 272/275 dur. @.050. MSD 6 AL, CSI elec w/p, Canton 7 quart pan, Taylor 10.4 mm wires, Jacobs Ultracoil, fuel system is a BG400 that feeds both the nitrous and n/a side thru a Magnaflow and BG 2 port regulator.
The controller I have works on a time base and level base, so if it is jetted for 200 horse, I can dial a 50 horse shot to start in 0.0 seconds (on launch) and go to 100 % over the next 5 seconds, or ask it to go to 75 % in 5 seconds. On a dual shot you can have stage 1 on launch, and using an RPM window switch, or a timer to trigger stage 2. You could plumb the intake for a nozzle at each runner, most intakes have N2O bosses.

Ron

[66 Racer]

Hey guys,

I was a little qurious to how a stroker kit works, is it simular to a long block conversion? Where you have a different crank, and longer conecting rods with shorter pistons? By the way how much do one of these kits cost, i imagine over $1500.

By the way, i have always wanted to know what it feels like to feel a shot of N2O. When you give it a 100 shot of N2O is it powerful enough to kick your head back? It must be nice having a N2O setup on a car. I think I'll stay away from it though.

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Under Construction 66 Coupe
-289 V8 - 600cfm Holley -Tri-Y Headers - Flowmaster 2.5 dual exaust, Centerforce Dual Friction

[Ron1]

Same bore, longer stroke, shorter piston. As far as pricing is concerned the kits start from $899.00 and with all the good stuff (forged pistons, forged crank, H or I beam rods) they go all the way up to $22/2300.00. Yea, you can definitely feel an extra 100 horse. If you have 300 HP today, and you ad a 100, that's a 33% increase in power. On a 600 HP motor you don't feel it as much. Only 16% increase in power.

Ron

[66 Racer]

Thanks ron1,

one thing though, did you mean that you do not bore, you that you still bore the engine. So basically that translates to "cubic inches" because you get the same stroke as the bigger engine do in the smaller package of a 289 or whatever you are stoking? Also what is the difference of making a long block conversion over stroking? To me it almost sounds the same, Unless it is.

Thanks

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Under Construction 66 Coupe
-289 V8 - 600cfm Holley -Tri-Y Headers - Flowmaster 2.5 dual exaust, Centerforce Dual Friction

[Ron1]

A long block (when you buy one) is usually a complete motor, with the exception of intake and carb. A short block is the block and the rotating assembly, that includes crank, rods and pistons. As far as bore is concerned...a 302 bored .030 over becomes a 306, so a gain of 4 cubic inches.

Ron

[66 Racer]

ron1,

I believe i understang it now, i thought long block was a term for the stroke.

Thanks for your help

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Under Construction 66 Coupe
-289 V8 - 600cfm Holley -Tri-Y Headers - Flowmaster 2.5 dual exaust, Centerforce Dual Friction

[ahitt64]

hey i was wondering what size cam i should put in my 351 windsor 4 barrel if i want quick take off and top end speed and about how much it would be?

[bmxmon]

Originally Posted by ahitt64

hey i was wondering what size cam i should put in my 351 windsor 4 barrel if i want quick take off and top end speed and about how much it would be?

That could vary a bunch depending on a ton of variables! Best to start a new thread in the "Windsor Power" forum.