Track times are these good?

Brady91 GT · 04-22-2001, 02:38 PM

ok i went to the track for my fist time, i have an 91 AOD GT (114k miles) with flows just welded on the stock flow tubes and i have a k&N cone on the mass air meter. Other than that its all stock. Well I ran 6 times at the track (test and tune). I live in Las Vegas not sure of the elvation. this is what the slip says: R/T---.950
60'---2.504
330---6.882
1/8---10.386
mph---70.87
1000--13.360
1/4---15.862
mph---90.20
So i was wondering if these are allright times ? and what do i need to do to get them down? Thanks alot for your help.

Mr 5 0 · 04-22-2001, 03:51 PM

Kind of slow times, even for a high-mileage AOD Mustang. I'll just state a few very obvious points here, since you're seeking advice.

Your 60' is high - you need better traction.

Your et is a good half-second higher than it should be on a stock AOD and the mph is a bit lower than it should be.

I suggest better rear rubber, a complete tune-up, including timing advance. Removing the cat converters would be a good move.
Then; a set of 4.11 rear gears, a shift kit and finally, a higher-stall-speed converter.

Since the gears, shift kit and converter cost some real money and may not happen immediately, you can improve things with some track practice which will sharpen your skills and hopefully lower your et. Play with tuning and tire pressures as well, as these are all free and can lower et a little bit.

Once these have been taken care of, get some gears and a shift kit. These will do you more good than a loud exhaust and fancy air cleaners that do little for performance, in most cases. For real power, you'll need better heads but get the basics lined up, first.

Good luck.

Unit 5302 · 04-22-2001, 08:43 PM

Definately give that thing a tuneup.

I'd say you are nearly a full second slower than you should be, definately 4mph slow too.

Bump timing to 14*, run 93oct. Get some underdrive pullies, good rear tires, and gears.

The gears will be the most expensive part of the equation, at about $400 for install. Ice the intake with a package of store bought ice before you make your run. If that can't get you into the 14's something is very very wrong.

QuantumMotorsports · 04-22-2001, 09:18 PM

You need better traction!!! 2.5 60' times? With your 90 mph you should hit 15.0 The 8 tenths can be made up by getting that 60' time down to 2.1 or 2.0 where they should be. Get some traction and you'll run a 15.0 Bump the timing and do a few other minor mods and hit high 14s. But seriously, get the 60' time down to 2.1 or 2 flat and you'll be fine. You get 2 tenths off of your ET for every tenth off of your 60 time. No kidding. I ran a 15.4 with a 60' of 2.54 and all I did was get traction and ran a 14.6 with a 2.1 60'. Good luck!!

------------------
Michael Black
Quantum Motorsports
Norman, Oklahoma

1988 Merc Cougar 5.0 HO, Ported and Polished E7TEs, 2.25" duals w/ 2 chamber flowmasters, T5 tranny
New E/T!!!
14.626 @ 94.94mph, 2.194 60' time, a little better than last time. Keep in mind this thang is heavy (3590lbs) Finally 14s!!!!

Brady91 GT · 04-22-2001, 09:48 PM

thanks alot for all of the advice!! im going to the track on friday so im gonna do new plugs, wires, cap, rotor, new tranny fluid & filter, 100 oct., ice intake, air down tires, advance timming to 14, and try not to stall it as much off the line. if i did all that hopefully get into 14's . do you think i should take out my spare tire and rear seat? if i have forgot anything please remind me. oh ya , thanks again.

Dark Knight · 04-22-2001, 10:59 PM

save the money on the 100 octane.. it'll slow you down. you only need enough octane to keep from having detonation..

------------------
84 convt,'95 302,AFR's, performer
3.55's, underdrives stock shorties
stock cam, 1.7's
14.06@100.21, 255RWHP on a hot day
265 on the mph/weight chart

04-23-2001, 05:27 AM

Quote:

air down tires

Over-inflate your Front tires to around 40-45 for less rolling resistance.

Quote:

do you think I should take out my spare tire and rear seat?

Take and remove your jack,spare tire,that cover that goes over the spare tire itself,anything that you do not need while driving down the 1/4,get rid of--within reason of course

------------------

Paxton Blown 87GT
ICQ#112698436

fiveohpatrol · 04-23-2001, 05:59 PM

im willing to bet that your 60ft times are NOT because of traction, when i had my stock gears and converter i could barely spin them trying hard to powerbrake it, 2.73's and an AOD result in a very bad 60ft time, as well as 1/4 et and mph, stock sucks but stock gears as well as everything else in an AOD really blows, do the gears, then a h-pipe, just these 2 will definately put you in the 14s

------------------
88 Notchback 5.0, 3.73's, Explorer intake, pulleys, Crane 1.7's, BBK headers, off-road H-pipe, flowmasters, subframe connectors, 65mm TB, shift kit, March ram air kit, motorsport wires, MSD coil, upper and lower control arms, 155lph fuel pump, cheap 2800 stall, Crane Adj.FPR, best time- 13.99@99.75, not yet tested times after rocker and intake install

Brady91 GT · 04-23-2001, 09:44 PM

I would spin a little and get a 15.8, when i wouldnt spin i would still get a 15.8 so i think i really really need gears. but im going on friday so ill see what i can do . Ill be sure to post my times.

silver_pilate · 04-24-2001, 10:39 AM

ET corrected for that elevation (~2200 feet at Las Vegas Motor Speedway) will put you around 15.455 @ 92.626. That's a little closer to expected.

fiveohpatrol is right in saying that it's pretty hard to get an AOD to spin. They are absolute dogs off the line.

My guess is that your car will surge fairly strong right off the line, then fall on its face, only to come back into power around 2500 rpms. Am I right?

This is because the stock torque converter locks up at around 1500 rpms...well below the powerband for a stock 5.0. Also, the gears aren't letting your engine get its revs up into the powerband quickly enough.

In order to drop et, you need a set of 3.73 gears and a 2500-2800 converter. Do the gears first, and get the converter when you can afford it. These two mods will help you the most on an AOD car, and it'll be much more fun to drive.

All of the other mods mentioned will also help you out...do the freebies right away, and keep adding on as you can afford to. You may consider just hollowing out the cats...the front two can be crushed and dumped out with a peice of re-bar and a sledge. The back two you need someone who can weld....cut off the heat sheilds and then cut a seam like an H in the top and fold the two flaps out and remove the cats. Fold 'em back down, weld 'em up, and weld on the heat sheild. If you do it on top...no one can tell that they've been modified...especially with the heat sheild in place.

--nathan

------------------
--silver_pilate

'91 GT, Built 306, Wolverine 1087 cam, ported Windsor Jr. Irons, and all the goodies...click the link to the left to see a full list of my mods...

Tried and True 302 Being Built to Outrun You! heh heh heh...
--Texas Panhandle--
Check out my site

Brady91 GT · 04-25-2001, 01:23 AM

silver_pilate-I think what you said is very true. It is a dog off the line until 2500 rpm, so im gonna buy gears next and then a stall. I just need the cash. Im gonna lighten it up as much as possible then try to get down to at least 15.50, im gonna try to get my R/t down real low, and try to make my auto ashifts at about 4500 instead of 5000. Im just gonna try a couple of diff things until i get the best times.

FivepointOH · 04-25-2001, 12:18 PM

Ok, I have to agree, your crappy 60' times have NOTHING to do with spinning they are from lack of off the line umph. Even with my mods and the 4:10's if I just floor it off the line it will hardly spin at all, and when I powerbrake I just sit in one place. The 15.4@92 is a little closer to where you should be but still on the slow side, I imagine you should pick up 1mph and probably 1.5 or 2 tenths with your tuneup depending on how badly your car needs it. When you launch make sure and powerbrake as high as you can without spinning and use the 1-d-1 shuffle if you want(Some people say it kills the tranny faster). If you do use the 1-d-1 I wouldn't shift at 4500, probably shift more around 5000. As for mods, go with pulleys, 4:10's(I wouldn't get anything lower)shift kit, converter, exhaust, etc etc. Oh and if you want to drop a little time at the track you could get a short belt.

------------------
92 AOD GT, K&N, ram air, pulleys, 2 ch. flowmasters, 4:10's, shift kit, 1 5/8 mac longtubes and offroad hpipe 14.249 @ 97.34 mph before the headers and hpipe

silver_pilate · 04-25-2001, 01:43 PM

In order to get your reaction times down, you're going to need to get the timing of the lights down. Go down to the track some day and sit and watch the tree. Time it so that you know exactly when the green hits. Actually, you'll probably need to stage shallow and then go on the second yellow. Play with it until you figure it out.

Also, Load up your suspension some by doing a break stand. Just make sure you don't give it too much gas and start to creep. Even trying to hold the revs at 1000-1200 rpm's will help load up the transmission. This takes up some of the slack and lets you leave quicker.

Good luck, and let me know how it turns out. Don't get too frustrated with the AOD. I always wanted a 5 speed (maybe my next car...no wait, that's going to have to be a built C-4 in order to hold that 650 hp from my next motor

), but I got an AOD and after building it up, I am very pleased. I can take almost any 5 or 6 speed off the line on street radials simply because I don't spin. My car skips the tires perfectly all the way through 1st (that fine line between spinning and not spinning), and then it hooks completely at the end of 1st and is gone. I've raced couple of Z28's and I've pulled at least two car lengths almost immediately off the line. After that, it's up to their motor to catch me.

Good luck and just have fun with it. As far as converters go, Precision Industries is the best out there. Don't settle for cheap crap when you get a converter. The money you pay is definately worth it here (read...no breakage). Lentech and PA also make a good converter.

--nathan

------------------
--silver_pilate

'91 GT, Built 306, Wolverine 1087 cam, ported Windsor Jr. Irons, and all the goodies...click the link to the left to see a full list of my mods...

Tried and True 302 Being Built to Outrun You! heh heh heh...
--Texas Panhandle--
Check out my site

Brady91 GT · 04-29-2001, 10:18 PM

ok new time is- 15.55. I took out back seat, tire and jack. Also over-inflated front tires and iced the intake. So hopefully get the tune-up done and run again. I was only a little behind a grand national so i was happy. Also some guy said i need to take a half a second off my time because of the elevation????? Is that true?? Thanks alot

93GTDIN · 04-29-2001, 11:29 PM

I'm a little confused... My tires have a good 50 % tread on them, and on my AOD stock GT (93), if i stomp it from a dead stop, the back wheels will spin until i let up on the gas. I find this odd cause it goes against what has been said here. Also, i have a vert, and i heard some of the verts came with 3.08's when special ordered. Would that affect it? How can i check this stuff?

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04-22-2001, 02:38 PM	#1
Brady91 GT Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Las Vegas NV Posts: 68	Track times are these good? ok i went to the track for my fist time, i have an 91 AOD GT (114k miles) with flows just welded on the stock flow tubes and i have a k&N cone on the mass air meter. Other than that its all stock. Well I ran 6 times at the track (test and tune). I live in Las Vegas not sure of the elvation. this is what the slip says: R/T---.950 60'---2.504 330---6.882 1/8---10.386 mph---70.87 1000--13.360 1/4---15.862 mph---90.20 So i was wondering if these are allright times ? and what do i need to do to get them down? Thanks alot for your help.

04-22-2001, 03:51 PM	#2
Mr 5 0 Conservative Individualist Join Date: May 1997 Location: Wherever I need to be Posts: 7,487	Kind of slow times, even for a high-mileage AOD Mustang. I'll just state a few very obvious points here, since you're seeking advice. Your 60' is high - you need better traction. Your et is a good half-second higher than it should be on a stock AOD and the mph is a bit lower than it should be. I suggest better rear rubber, a complete tune-up, including timing advance. Removing the cat converters would be a good move. Then; a set of 4.11 rear gears, a shift kit and finally, a higher-stall-speed converter. Since the gears, shift kit and converter cost some real money and may not happen immediately, you can improve things with some track practice which will sharpen your skills and hopefully lower your et. Play with tuning and tire pressures as well, as these are all free and can lower et a little bit. Once these have been taken care of, get some gears and a shift kit. These will do you more good than a loud exhaust and fancy air cleaners that do little for performance, in most cases. For real power, you'll need better heads but get the basics lined up, first. Good luck.

04-22-2001, 08:43 PM	#3
Unit 5302 Registered Member Join Date: May 1999 Posts: 5,246	Definately give that thing a tuneup. I'd say you are nearly a full second slower than you should be, definately 4mph slow too. Bump timing to 14*, run 93oct. Get some underdrive pullies, good rear tires, and gears. The gears will be the most expensive part of the equation, at about $400 for install. Ice the intake with a package of store bought ice before you make your run. If that can't get you into the 14's something is very very wrong.

04-22-2001, 09:18 PM	#4
QuantumMotorsports Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Norman, Oklahoma, USA Posts: 597	You need better traction!!! 2.5 60' times? With your 90 mph you should hit 15.0 The 8 tenths can be made up by getting that 60' time down to 2.1 or 2.0 where they should be. Get some traction and you'll run a 15.0 Bump the timing and do a few other minor mods and hit high 14s. But seriously, get the 60' time down to 2.1 or 2 flat and you'll be fine. You get 2 tenths off of your ET for every tenth off of your 60 time. No kidding. I ran a 15.4 with a 60' of 2.54 and all I did was get traction and ran a 14.6 with a 2.1 60'. Good luck!! ------------------ Michael Black Quantum Motorsports Norman, Oklahoma 1988 Merc Cougar 5.0 HO, Ported and Polished E7TEs, 2.25" duals w/ 2 chamber flowmasters, T5 tranny New E/T!!! 14.626 @ 94.94mph, 2.194 60' time, a little better than last time. Keep in mind this thang is heavy (3590lbs) Finally 14s!!!!

04-22-2001, 09:48 PM	#5
Brady91 GT Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Las Vegas NV Posts: 68	thanks alot for all of the advice!! im going to the track on friday so im gonna do new plugs, wires, cap, rotor, new tranny fluid & filter, 100 oct., ice intake, air down tires, advance timming to 14, and try not to stall it as much off the line. if i did all that hopefully get into 14's . do you think i should take out my spare tire and rear seat? if i have forgot anything please remind me. oh ya , thanks again.

04-22-2001, 10:59 PM	#6
Dark Knight Registered Member Join Date: Oct 1998 Location: Az Posts: 854	save the money on the 100 octane.. it'll slow you down. you only need enough octane to keep from having detonation.. ------------------ 84 convt,'95 302,AFR's, performer 3.55's, underdrives stock shorties stock cam, 1.7's 14.06@100.21, 255RWHP on a hot day 265 on the mph/weight chart

04-23-2001, 05:59 PM	#8
fiveohpatrol I'd rather be basketweaving Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 2,551	im willing to bet that your 60ft times are NOT because of traction, when i had my stock gears and converter i could barely spin them trying hard to powerbrake it, 2.73's and an AOD result in a very bad 60ft time, as well as 1/4 et and mph, stock sucks but stock gears as well as everything else in an AOD really blows, do the gears, then a h-pipe, just these 2 will definately put you in the 14s ------------------ 88 Notchback 5.0, 3.73's, Explorer intake, pulleys, Crane 1.7's, BBK headers, off-road H-pipe, flowmasters, subframe connectors, 65mm TB, shift kit, March ram air kit, motorsport wires, MSD coil, upper and lower control arms, 155lph fuel pump, cheap 2800 stall, Crane Adj.FPR, best time- 13.99@99.75, not yet tested times after rocker and intake install

04-23-2001, 09:44 PM	#9
Brady91 GT Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Las Vegas NV Posts: 68	I would spin a little and get a 15.8, when i wouldnt spin i would still get a 15.8 so i think i really really need gears. but im going on friday so ill see what i can do . Ill be sure to post my times.

04-24-2001, 10:39 AM	#10
silver_pilate DURKA DURKA!! Join Date: Sep 1997 Location: Lubbock, TX...(TX panhandle) Posts: 1,418	ET corrected for that elevation (~2200 feet at Las Vegas Motor Speedway) will put you around 15.455 @ 92.626. That's a little closer to expected. fiveohpatrol is right in saying that it's pretty hard to get an AOD to spin. They are absolute dogs off the line. My guess is that your car will surge fairly strong right off the line, then fall on its face, only to come back into power around 2500 rpms. Am I right? This is because the stock torque converter locks up at around 1500 rpms...well below the powerband for a stock 5.0. Also, the gears aren't letting your engine get its revs up into the powerband quickly enough. In order to drop et, you need a set of 3.73 gears and a 2500-2800 converter. Do the gears first, and get the converter when you can afford it. These two mods will help you the most on an AOD car, and it'll be much more fun to drive. All of the other mods mentioned will also help you out...do the freebies right away, and keep adding on as you can afford to. You may consider just hollowing out the cats...the front two can be crushed and dumped out with a peice of re-bar and a sledge. The back two you need someone who can weld....cut off the heat sheilds and then cut a seam like an H in the top and fold the two flaps out and remove the cats. Fold 'em back down, weld 'em up, and weld on the heat sheild. If you do it on top...no one can tell that they've been modified...especially with the heat sheild in place. --nathan ------------------ --silver_pilate '91 GT, Built 306, Wolverine 1087 cam, ported Windsor Jr. Irons, and all the goodies...click the link to the left to see a full list of my mods... Tried and True 302 Being Built to Outrun You! heh heh heh... --Texas Panhandle-- Check out my site

04-25-2001, 01:23 AM	#11
Brady91 GT Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Las Vegas NV Posts: 68	silver_pilate-I think what you said is very true. It is a dog off the line until 2500 rpm, so im gonna buy gears next and then a stall. I just need the cash. Im gonna lighten it up as much as possible then try to get down to at least 15.50, im gonna try to get my R/t down real low, and try to make my auto ashifts at about 4500 instead of 5000. Im just gonna try a couple of diff things until i get the best times.

04-25-2001, 12:18 PM	#12
FivepointOH Registered Member Join Date: Jan 1999 Location: Sugar Land, Tx USA Posts: 478	Ok, I have to agree, your crappy 60' times have NOTHING to do with spinning they are from lack of off the line umph. Even with my mods and the 4:10's if I just floor it off the line it will hardly spin at all, and when I powerbrake I just sit in one place. The 15.4@92 is a little closer to where you should be but still on the slow side, I imagine you should pick up 1mph and probably 1.5 or 2 tenths with your tuneup depending on how badly your car needs it. When you launch make sure and powerbrake as high as you can without spinning and use the 1-d-1 shuffle if you want(Some people say it kills the tranny faster). If you do use the 1-d-1 I wouldn't shift at 4500, probably shift more around 5000. As for mods, go with pulleys, 4:10's(I wouldn't get anything lower)shift kit, converter, exhaust, etc etc. Oh and if you want to drop a little time at the track you could get a short belt. ------------------ 92 AOD GT, K&N, ram air, pulleys, 2 ch. flowmasters, 4:10's, shift kit, 1 5/8 mac longtubes and offroad hpipe 14.249 @ 97.34 mph before the headers and hpipe

04-25-2001, 01:43 PM	#13
silver_pilate DURKA DURKA!! Join Date: Sep 1997 Location: Lubbock, TX...(TX panhandle) Posts: 1,418	In order to get your reaction times down, you're going to need to get the timing of the lights down. Go down to the track some day and sit and watch the tree. Time it so that you know exactly when the green hits. Actually, you'll probably need to stage shallow and then go on the second yellow. Play with it until you figure it out. Also, Load up your suspension some by doing a break stand. Just make sure you don't give it too much gas and start to creep. Even trying to hold the revs at 1000-1200 rpm's will help load up the transmission. This takes up some of the slack and lets you leave quicker. Good luck, and let me know how it turns out. Don't get too frustrated with the AOD. I always wanted a 5 speed (maybe my next car...no wait, that's going to have to be a built C-4 in order to hold that 650 hp from my next motor ), but I got an AOD and after building it up, I am very pleased. I can take almost any 5 or 6 speed off the line on street radials simply because I don't spin. My car skips the tires perfectly all the way through 1st (that fine line between spinning and not spinning), and then it hooks completely at the end of 1st and is gone. I've raced couple of Z28's and I've pulled at least two car lengths almost immediately off the line. After that, it's up to their motor to catch me. Good luck and just have fun with it. As far as converters go, Precision Industries is the best out there. Don't settle for cheap crap when you get a converter. The money you pay is definately worth it here (read...no breakage). Lentech and PA also make a good converter. --nathan ------------------ --silver_pilate '91 GT, Built 306, Wolverine 1087 cam, ported Windsor Jr. Irons, and all the goodies...click the link to the left to see a full list of my mods... Tried and True 302 Being Built to Outrun You! heh heh heh... --Texas Panhandle-- Check out my site

04-29-2001, 10:18 PM	#14
Brady91 GT Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Las Vegas NV Posts: 68	ok new time is- 15.55. I took out back seat, tire and jack. Also over-inflated front tires and iced the intake. So hopefully get the tune-up done and run again. I was only a little behind a grand national so i was happy. Also some guy said i need to take a half a second off my time because of the elevation????? Is that true?? Thanks alot

04-29-2001, 11:29 PM	#15
93GTDIN Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Live music capital of the world, TX Posts: 324	I'm a little confused... My tires have a good 50 % tread on them, and on my AOD stock GT (93), if i stomp it from a dead stop, the back wheels will spin until i let up on the gas. I find this odd cause it goes against what has been said here. Also, i have a vert, and i heard some of the verts came with 3.08's when special ordered. Would that affect it? How can i check this stuff?