LT1 & LS1 and the 5.0 &4.6

95mustanggt · 05-02-2001, 08:31 AM

Well I wanted to post on the LT1 debate in Sky's post there but I thought it was getting pretty long and thought that a new thread covering just this topic was better.

Quote:

Originally posted by 5.0KILLER:
All this talk about how slow the LT1's are when really the fact is stock vs. stock the LT1 is just plain faster. and I don't know where all you super fast stang guys are but I have yet to run into on that i didn't beat with my stock Z. long live the mighty 225hp 4.6 they are soooooo fast. hehe

I have to agree that a stock LT1 is faster than a [b/]stock[/b]SN 95 of the same year. I don't think there is any point argueing this, because it is backed up by numbers.

The stock LS1's are faster than the new GT too.

BUT we are not talking about a level field here. Take the money you saved on the purchase of the LT1 and put it into the SN95 and now lets talk.

There is more aftermarket support for the 5.0 for sure and I will be honest and say I don't know how the 4.6 compares. But I'm sure it's not far behind now.

Anyway, those are my thoughts right now.

Comments?

------------------
Driving: 1998 F-150
Far way in Edmonton==>

1995 Mustang GT

Lizard King · 05-02-2001, 09:21 AM

The difference in buy a LS1 TA or Camaro compared to a new Mustang GT with 4.6 is about $15K (CAN - 10K USD) ...

For 15K CAN the 4.6 GT can be modded to run 11.8 second quarter mile (based on MMFF article)... the mods needed are:

Exaust, Supercharger kit(complete), gears, tires, suspension.

With those mods, screw hunting down Camaros, let's go for Vipers and Porches 911TT.

------------------
Lizard King, Bone Stock; 13.69 at 101MPH
• Extreme Burnout
•2000GT VS LS1
• Quartermile run
•2000GT vs LX Stang

GONZO99TA · 05-02-2001, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lizard King:
The difference in buy a LS1 TA or Camaro compared to a new Mustang GT with 4.6 is about $15K (CAN - 10K USD) ...

i hope you made a mistake somewhere in there.
because a new ls1 compared to a new gt like you stated is not $10k. my wife sold a new ta the other day for only $24k, and the ta had all the options except ws6. you can buy a formula much cheaper. just thought i would give you some facts

------------------
99 30th annv. Trans am
79 Trans am black se

Mercury · 05-02-2001, 01:24 PM

I dont know about where you live Gonzo, but here in Fayetteville a new TA runs you about 30 grand, and thats not a WS6. Same as in Sanford, Lillington, and the few Poncho dealers in Fayetteville. The average selling price for a Z28, a new one around here is 26 grand, and thats a plain jane with an auto (its hard to find a manual GM product around here.)

Your talking about 35-38 grand for a SS, and TA WS6.

I bought my 2000 GT for 19 grand, new.

The only option its lacking is leather, well okay, and the mach 460.

SaleenGTS · 05-02-2001, 05:16 PM

In the defense of GONZO...I have never seen a WS-6 that high...the highest I have seen one was 32. I have seen the Mechams and one firehawk for 36 and 34K.

I also have never seen a GT for 19K new

------------------
Dustin
93 Cobra 261 rwhp
89 GT(Saleen Clone) 392 rwhp(TFS Intake,TFS Heads, BD-11A 9#,Ecam,1.6 rr's, BBK longtubes, lots more...

95mustanggt · 05-02-2001, 08:04 PM

Every time I go to a dealership I check out mustangs, camaro's and firebirds. In Canadian $, A T/A is around $40K to $45K (28 to 31K US). Most of the Mustang GT's loaded are around $32K ($21K US). But a base GT (no leather or Mach) is around $27/28K ($17/18K US). That is just what I've seen in the different dealers in the Edmonton Alberta area.

It's not a real bad thing, speed costs, right?

------------------
Driving: 1998 F-150
Far way in Edmonton==>

1995 Mustang GT

Unit 5302 · 05-03-2001, 12:15 AM

I don't see how buying a used car figures into the equation.

Great! I could probably buy some rusted out 78 TA and put a giganto blown Big Block and run 10's for half the cost of your SN95.

Oh, and according to my info from the GM and Ford web sites.

MSRP Ford Mustang GT $23,230
MSRP Chevy Camaro Z28 $22,450

Maybe some dealers are tacking on extra money due to the coming end of production on the F bodies. Also the C-5 Vette should run in the mid to upper 40's. No fricken way should it be $75k, even the Z06 is way the hell cheaper than that.

Mercury · 05-03-2001, 12:54 AM

Yes, here in Fayetteville the F-Bodys are not cheap. Maybe it has something to do with being next to a military base, the biggest one in the country.

I went shopping for a new Mustang, but was curious to see how much a Trans-Am was just in case i couldnt afford the Mustang. I about sh$t myself when I saw the prices on window stickers. I couldnt believe it, I called a few pontiac and Ford dealers around the area, and they were all within 700 dollars of one another.

The Z28's were cheaper, but still overpriced in my book. The guy at work thought he had a steal at 29 grand, all it was was a 2000 Z28, with leather, t-tops and an auto. He said he was going to go for an SS, but after the test drive the guy told him the one he just drove goes for 33k.

Brad tried to talk the guy down, but the salesman said that theres a waiting list for those cars and he could probably get more for it, he wasnt going to budge on the price. That was a damn barebones SS.

As for a New GT (GOt mine new in 2000) I got mine for just a hair under 20k after tax, tags and licensing fee's. And the dealership spent 2 weeks trying to find me a Performance Red GT that was new, and a 5spd.

I test drove a 2000 black 5spd GT, Fully optioned, everything. After a week they called me and said they had a deal. They said if I could be colorblind, and sign the papers that day, they would sell me the car for 18,900. Everyone thinks I'm retarted for not taking it, I kinda feel like it, but I had to have RED, had to be Performance RED. RED RED RED.

------------------
64 1/2 "D" code Red Mustang Coupe. 289, C4, 3:1 rear gear. Mallory duel point. Ported & Polished 65 heads shaved .01 with 351 windsor valves, high side of 10.5:1 comp, 1.7:1 sled rockers, blue wolverine lumpy cam, autolite 4100 Hipo 4 barrel. And to many others to list

2000 Perf Red Mustang GT. 5spd. BBK Underdrive pulleys, Flotech off-road H pipe. Hurst T-Handle

64 1/2 red 6cyl coupe. Auto. project car.

StoplightWarrior · 05-03-2001, 01:02 AM

I pulled into the local Pontiac dealership, and checked out the three badass TA's they had out(silver, red, black). $29K, $29K, $31K. I bought my GT at the end of the year for 21K. Ive seen V6 camaros around here going for the same price as my GT.

------------------
Black 2000 GT
Magnaflow mufflers, K&N
Steeda springs, subs, strut tower, CC plates

Mercury · 05-03-2001, 02:00 AM

To all Camaro and Firebird Owners out there, this is not ment to offend you all. I wouldnt mind (Hell I'd really enjoy) owning a new Trans-Am (It'd have to be Red)

Mustangs are cheaper because they acutally sell.

Skyman · 05-03-2001, 02:50 AM

You can debate this all you want, but the MSRP's speak for themselfs.

Plain and simple the LS1 cars are a more HP per dollar car anyway you look at it. Its just what do you prefer?

Sky

------------------
-1989 Saleen Mustang #406- TFS Heads, E-303, edelbrock intake,70MM TB, 73mm MAF, off road H, headers and 3chamber flows.
12.55@107mph
Going for 11's on 87 octane with A/C and 20+MPG!!!

SaleenGTS · 05-03-2001, 08:09 AM

I prefer the good ole Stang....LONG LIVE FORD!!!

------------------
Dustin
93 Cobra 261 rwhp
89 GT(Saleen Clone) 392 rwhp(TFS Intake,TFS Heads, BD-11A 9#,Ecam,1.6 rr's, BBK longtubes, lots more...

95mustanggt · 05-03-2001, 11:38 AM

Well I just went to a couple of dealers and got some prices.

2001 Camaro SS: $40,970 CDN. That with a 6 spd.

2001 Firbird: $41,965 CDN. Also with a 6 spd.

2001 Mustang GT $31,615 CDN. 5 Spd.

That is around a $9,000 difference Canadian.

In US funds you're looking at:
Camaro: $26,200
Firebird: $26,870
Mustang: $20,200

And that is around a $6,000 difference. You can do a lot with $6,000. What's a blower worth? How much power would that grab you?

AND if you do the $/HP calculations based on these numbers...
Camaro:$80.67/HP
Firbird:$82.64/HP
Mustang GT: $77.69/HP

So the Mustang has the best $/HP ratio of the cars. I bet once you add a blower, you'd be even better!

These are not based on the "MRSP". These are based on what I saw at the dealership. The same price you'd pay if you wanted once of these cars. Go to a dealer and check it out.

This is similar to these phantom track ET's. There's "what it should run" amd "what it does run".

------------------
Driving: 1998 F-150
Far way in Edmonton==>

1995 Mustang GT

NarayanM · 05-03-2001, 01:14 PM

From kbb.com

MSRP on a 2001GT 'Delux' GT Coupe
23230.00

MSRP on a 2001GT 'Premium' Coupe
24380.00

MSRP on a 2001 Z28 'Stripped'
22450
Now remember, this price is w/o power door locks, windows, fog lights, etc etc, leather wraped wheel. WHICH ARE STANDARD on the GT Delux. Those options ad 1715
The stang also comes witha 6 in dash CD changer, gotta pay more in the Z

MSRP on a 'fully loaded' Z28
27228
That is with the traction control, leather, etc, everything that si standard on the GT. The only thing I could see that is 'more' than the GT is trhe 12 disc changer in the trunk, as opposed to a 6 in dash (id rather have the in dash.)

So that is almost a 4K difference in MSRP. Seemingly also, peole have been getting stangs for closer to invoice than Z28s. I know, I've been pricing a 2001GT, and I was quoted with a price of 500 over invocie which is 23022.

------------------
Manu Narayan
Moderator @ StangNet.com

Lizard King · 05-03-2001, 03:28 PM

Wow, the exchange and region makes quite a difference!!!!!

I had been shopping for a TransAM WS6 back when I was looking for the Stang GT... the WS6 was negotiated down to ~39K CAN back then... The sticker price was around $44K

My 2000 GT, I bought for $26,600 CAN (compared to MSRP of $30,900 CAN). A buddy of mine just bought his 2001 for $26,400 CAN (fully loaded).

If you make the conversion to USD (about 1.56 right now)... in US Dollars here is what the values were exactly one year ago:

TA WS6 = $25,000 neg. - MSRP $28,200
2000GT = $17,051 neg. - MSRP $19,743

You guys should come up here to buy!!!!!

05-03-2001, 04:02 PM

Hate to burst the bubble here, but here in Houston, (at least at Gay pontiac dealership) I saw not one, not 2, not 3 but 12 Trans Am's with the WS6 packages, auto, and FULLY optioned out for $29,997. All kinds of colors. Across the Freeway (I-45) at Mcree Ford, the stangs were running at $23k-$29k (hardtop-convertable) and Cobras were in the $29k-$35k (hardtop-convertable). The TAs were T-tops only.

I guess what I am trying to say is that they cost about the same here.

Unit 5302 · 05-03-2001, 06:32 PM

The price you'd actually pay?

That's up to you and how well you represent yourself.

The MSRP is the suggested retail price, including some dealer markup.

Yes the GT comes with better options, and better looks, and IMHO, everything better, but how many people have I seen on this board ***** about not offering an LX 4.6L stripper? Bottom line is you can negotiate your price down if you know what you are doing, and if you do, based on the MSRP, you should be able to get a Z28 or the same or less than a GT.

Oh, and the most interesting part of that is, I'd bet money a decent driver in the 260hp 4.6L (not 225) will hand his LT1 a serious *** whuppin.

Steve2000SS · 05-06-2001, 02:00 AM

Your right.. a 2001 GT come with everything better than a fbod.. except:
1. engine
2. brakes
3. 6 speed manual (has to be better since you dont even offer one)
4. a real functioning ram air hood (if you want to shell out the xtra $$ for the SS or WS6 package)

As for looks that's in the eye of the beholder (i like both).. your car is easier to get in and out of.. and easier to judge your front corners.. but your seats stink (so do camaro seats.. for different reasons).. TA seats rock.. I prefer that you have a trunk rather than a hatch.. Oh and around here they sell Z's for $100 over invoice and SS's for $400 over.. Get what you like and like what you get..

------------------
2000 M6 SS Camaro.. mostly stock go mods.. lots of show stuff..
320rwhp & 333rwtq corrected SAE

Unit 5302 · 05-06-2001, 01:17 PM

Hey Steve2000SS

Haven't been able to get a hatch on a Mustang since 1993.

I'd say the Gen II 4.6L is superior to the LS1 as well. With only 260hp it's getting people 13's. Not too hard to add a S/C and whoop LS1's like yesterday's news.

Brakes and 6spd ........
......
......
no comment

aurilius_maximus · 05-06-2001, 01:31 PM

My buddy just traded in his 97 GT and bought a 2001 Camaro SS Z28, fully loaded, 6 speed, and he was out the door at arond 32K. I have rode in it and raced it, and I was not impressed at all. In my opinion it is not worth the money...

05-02-2001, 09:21 AM	#2
Lizard King midnightruns.com Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada Posts: 584	The difference in buy a LS1 TA or Camaro compared to a new Mustang GT with 4.6 is about $15K (CAN - 10K USD) ... For 15K CAN the 4.6 GT can be modded to run 11.8 second quarter mile (based on MMFF article)... the mods needed are: Exaust, Supercharger kit(complete), gears, tires, suspension. With those mods, screw hunting down Camaros, let's go for Vipers and Porches 911TT. ------------------ Lizard King, Bone Stock; 13.69 at 101MPH • Extreme Burnout •2000GT VS LS1 • Quartermile run •2000GT vs LX Stang

05-02-2001, 01:24 PM	#4
Mercury The Redneck James Bond Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Fayetteville NC Posts: 1,707	I dont know about where you live Gonzo, but here in Fayetteville a new TA runs you about 30 grand, and thats not a WS6. Same as in Sanford, Lillington, and the few Poncho dealers in Fayetteville. The average selling price for a Z28, a new one around here is 26 grand, and thats a plain jane with an auto (its hard to find a manual GM product around here.) Your talking about 35-38 grand for a SS, and TA WS6. I bought my 2000 GT for 19 grand, new. The only option its lacking is leather, well okay, and the mach 460.

05-02-2001, 05:16 PM	#5
SaleenGTS RICE taste like Chicken Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Edmond, OK Posts: 687	In the defense of GONZO...I have never seen a WS-6 that high...the highest I have seen one was 32. I have seen the Mechams and one firehawk for 36 and 34K. I also have never seen a GT for 19K new ------------------ Dustin 93 Cobra 261 rwhp 89 GT(Saleen Clone) 392 rwhp(TFS Intake,TFS Heads, BD-11A 9#,Ecam,1.6 rr's, BBK longtubes, lots more...

05-02-2001, 08:04 PM	#6
95mustanggt Registered Member Join Date: May 2000 Location: Kamloops, BC Posts: 2,875	Every time I go to a dealership I check out mustangs, camaro's and firebirds. In Canadian $, A T/A is around $40K to $45K (28 to 31K US). Most of the Mustang GT's loaded are around $32K ($21K US). But a base GT (no leather or Mach) is around $27/28K ($17/18K US). That is just what I've seen in the different dealers in the Edmonton Alberta area. It's not a real bad thing, speed costs, right? ------------------ Driving: 1998 F-150 Far way in Edmonton==> 1995 Mustang GT

05-03-2001, 12:15 AM	#7
Unit 5302 Registered Member Join Date: May 1999 Posts: 5,246	I don't see how buying a used car figures into the equation. Great! I could probably buy some rusted out 78 TA and put a giganto blown Big Block and run 10's for half the cost of your SN95. Oh, and according to my info from the GM and Ford web sites. MSRP Ford Mustang GT $23,230 MSRP Chevy Camaro Z28 $22,450 Maybe some dealers are tacking on extra money due to the coming end of production on the F bodies. Also the C-5 Vette should run in the mid to upper 40's. No fricken way should it be $75k, even the Z06 is way the hell cheaper than that.

05-03-2001, 12:54 AM	#8
Mercury The Redneck James Bond Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Fayetteville NC Posts: 1,707	Yes, here in Fayetteville the F-Bodys are not cheap. Maybe it has something to do with being next to a military base, the biggest one in the country. I went shopping for a new Mustang, but was curious to see how much a Trans-Am was just in case i couldnt afford the Mustang. I about sh$t myself when I saw the prices on window stickers. I couldnt believe it, I called a few pontiac and Ford dealers around the area, and they were all within 700 dollars of one another. The Z28's were cheaper, but still overpriced in my book. The guy at work thought he had a steal at 29 grand, all it was was a 2000 Z28, with leather, t-tops and an auto. He said he was going to go for an SS, but after the test drive the guy told him the one he just drove goes for 33k. Brad tried to talk the guy down, but the salesman said that theres a waiting list for those cars and he could probably get more for it, he wasnt going to budge on the price. That was a damn barebones SS. As for a New GT (GOt mine new in 2000) I got mine for just a hair under 20k after tax, tags and licensing fee's. And the dealership spent 2 weeks trying to find me a Performance Red GT that was new, and a 5spd. I test drove a 2000 black 5spd GT, Fully optioned, everything. After a week they called me and said they had a deal. They said if I could be colorblind, and sign the papers that day, they would sell me the car for 18,900. Everyone thinks I'm retarted for not taking it, I kinda feel like it, but I had to have RED, had to be Performance RED. RED RED RED. ------------------ 64 1/2 "D" code Red Mustang Coupe. 289, C4, 3:1 rear gear. Mallory duel point. Ported & Polished 65 heads shaved .01 with 351 windsor valves, high side of 10.5:1 comp, 1.7:1 sled rockers, blue wolverine lumpy cam, autolite 4100 Hipo 4 barrel. And to many others to list 2000 Perf Red Mustang GT. 5spd. BBK Underdrive pulleys, Flotech off-road H pipe. Hurst T-Handle 64 1/2 red 6cyl coupe. Auto. project car.

05-03-2001, 01:02 AM	#9
StoplightWarrior Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Nor-Cal Posts: 1,311	I pulled into the local Pontiac dealership, and checked out the three badass TA's they had out(silver, red, black). $29K, $29K, $31K. I bought my GT at the end of the year for 21K. Ive seen V6 camaros around here going for the same price as my GT. ------------------ Black 2000 GT Magnaflow mufflers, K&N Steeda springs, subs, strut tower, CC plates

05-03-2001, 02:00 AM	#10
Mercury The Redneck James Bond Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Fayetteville NC Posts: 1,707	To all Camaro and Firebird Owners out there, this is not ment to offend you all. I wouldnt mind (Hell I'd really enjoy) owning a new Trans-Am (It'd have to be Red) Mustangs are cheaper because they acutally sell.

05-03-2001, 02:50 AM	#11
Skyman I need 110mph Trap Speed! Join Date: Feb 1999 Location: So, CA Posts: 4,315	You can debate this all you want, but the MSRP's speak for themselfs. Plain and simple the LS1 cars are a more HP per dollar car anyway you look at it. Its just what do you prefer? Sky ------------------ -1989 Saleen Mustang #406- TFS Heads, E-303, edelbrock intake,70MM TB, 73mm MAF, off road H, headers and 3chamber flows. 12.55@107mph Going for 11's on 87 octane with A/C and 20+MPG!!!

05-03-2001, 08:09 AM	#12
SaleenGTS RICE taste like Chicken Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Edmond, OK Posts: 687	I prefer the good ole Stang....LONG LIVE FORD!!! ------------------ Dustin 93 Cobra 261 rwhp 89 GT(Saleen Clone) 392 rwhp(TFS Intake,TFS Heads, BD-11A 9#,Ecam,1.6 rr's, BBK longtubes, lots more...

05-03-2001, 11:38 AM	#13
95mustanggt Registered Member Join Date: May 2000 Location: Kamloops, BC Posts: 2,875	Well I just went to a couple of dealers and got some prices. 2001 Camaro SS: $40,970 CDN. That with a 6 spd. 2001 Firbird: $41,965 CDN. Also with a 6 spd. 2001 Mustang GT $31,615 CDN. 5 Spd. That is around a $9,000 difference Canadian. In US funds you're looking at: Camaro: $26,200 Firebird: $26,870 Mustang: $20,200 And that is around a $6,000 difference. You can do a lot with $6,000. What's a blower worth? How much power would that grab you? AND if you do the $/HP calculations based on these numbers... Camaro:$80.67/HP Firbird:$82.64/HP Mustang GT: $77.69/HP So the Mustang has the best $/HP ratio of the cars. I bet once you add a blower, you'd be even better! These are not based on the "MRSP". These are based on what I saw at the dealership. The same price you'd pay if you wanted once of these cars. Go to a dealer and check it out. This is similar to these phantom track ET's. There's "what it should run" amd "what it does run". ------------------ Driving: 1998 F-150 Far way in Edmonton==> 1995 Mustang GT

05-03-2001, 01:14 PM	#14
NarayanM Registered Member Join Date: Feb 1999 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 22	From kbb.com MSRP on a 2001GT 'Delux' GT Coupe 23230.00 MSRP on a 2001GT 'Premium' Coupe 24380.00 MSRP on a 2001 Z28 'Stripped' 22450 Now remember, this price is w/o power door locks, windows, fog lights, etc etc, leather wraped wheel. WHICH ARE STANDARD on the GT Delux. Those options ad 1715 The stang also comes witha 6 in dash CD changer, gotta pay more in the Z MSRP on a 'fully loaded' Z28 27228 That is with the traction control, leather, etc, everything that si standard on the GT. The only thing I could see that is 'more' than the GT is trhe 12 disc changer in the trunk, as opposed to a 6 in dash (id rather have the in dash.) So that is almost a 4K difference in MSRP. Seemingly also, peole have been getting stangs for closer to invoice than Z28s. I know, I've been pricing a 2001GT, and I was quoted with a price of 500 over invocie which is 23022. ------------------ Manu Narayan Moderator @ StangNet.com

05-03-2001, 03:28 PM	#15
Lizard King midnightruns.com Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada Posts: 584	Wow, the exchange and region makes quite a difference!!!!! I had been shopping for a TransAM WS6 back when I was looking for the Stang GT... the WS6 was negotiated down to ~39K CAN back then... The sticker price was around $44K My 2000 GT, I bought for $26,600 CAN (compared to MSRP of $30,900 CAN). A buddy of mine just bought his 2001 for $26,400 CAN (fully loaded). If you make the conversion to USD (about 1.56 right now)... in US Dollars here is what the values were exactly one year ago: TA WS6 = $25,000 neg. - MSRP $28,200 2000GT = $17,051 neg. - MSRP $19,743 You guys should come up here to buy!!!!!

05-03-2001, 04:02 PM	#16
blkrain Guest Posts: n/a	Hate to burst the bubble here, but here in Houston, (at least at Gay pontiac dealership) I saw not one, not 2, not 3 but 12 Trans Am's with the WS6 packages, auto, and FULLY optioned out for $29,997. All kinds of colors. Across the Freeway (I-45) at Mcree Ford, the stangs were running at $23k-$29k (hardtop-convertable) and Cobras were in the $29k-$35k (hardtop-convertable). The TAs were T-tops only. I guess what I am trying to say is that they cost about the same here.

05-03-2001, 06:32 PM	#17
Unit 5302 Registered Member Join Date: May 1999 Posts: 5,246	The price you'd actually pay? That's up to you and how well you represent yourself. The MSRP is the suggested retail price, including some dealer markup. Yes the GT comes with better options, and better looks, and IMHO, everything better, but how many people have I seen on this board *** about not offering an LX 4.6L stripper? Bottom line is you can negotiate your price down if you know what you are doing, and if you do, based on the MSRP, you should be able to get a Z28 or the same or less than a GT. Oh, and the most interesting part of that is, I'd bet money a decent driver in the 260hp 4.6L (not 225) will hand his LT1 a serious * whuppin.

05-06-2001, 02:00 AM	#18
Steve2000SS Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Corona, CA Posts: 31	Your right.. a 2001 GT come with everything better than a fbod.. except: 1. engine 2. brakes 3. 6 speed manual (has to be better since you dont even offer one) 4. a real functioning ram air hood (if you want to shell out the xtra $$ for the SS or WS6 package) As for looks that's in the eye of the beholder (i like both).. your car is easier to get in and out of.. and easier to judge your front corners.. but your seats stink (so do camaro seats.. for different reasons).. TA seats rock.. I prefer that you have a trunk rather than a hatch.. Oh and around here they sell Z's for $100 over invoice and SS's for $400 over.. Get what you like and like what you get.. ------------------ 2000 M6 SS Camaro.. mostly stock go mods.. lots of show stuff.. 320rwhp & 333rwtq corrected SAE

05-06-2001, 01:17 PM	#19
Unit 5302 Registered Member Join Date: May 1999 Posts: 5,246	Hey Steve2000SS Haven't been able to get a hatch on a Mustang since 1993. I'd say the Gen II 4.6L is superior to the LS1 as well. With only 260hp it's getting people 13's. Not too hard to add a S/C and whoop LS1's like yesterday's news. Brakes and 6spd ........ ...... ...... no comment

05-06-2001, 01:31 PM	#20
aurilius_maximus Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Mt. Shasta, California, 96067 Posts: 77	My buddy just traded in his 97 GT and bought a 2001 Camaro SS Z28, fully loaded, 6 speed, and he was out the door at arond 32K. I have rode in it and raced it, and I was not impressed at all. In my opinion it is not worth the money...