Sky, I need your help with a post about your car.

[fastang]

Theres a post at ClubSi called "Big Block Chevelle goes down" in the Si vs all forum. Its about a 306 beating a Chevelle. Anyway Im in a small disagreement about the validity of your dyno numbers and the possiblity of a built 306 with AFR 185's and a Holley intake hitting 360 rwhp.

What exactly were your dyno numbers and do you have the sheet? If you could please post them over there I would appreciate it.

------------------
95GT B303 cam, 1.7 rockers, 65mm TB, milled heads, 355's K&N, BBK Longtubes, Flowmaster cat back, pulleys, msd coil, 9mm wires, Tremec 3550, Pro5.0 shifter,10.5 Motorsport clutch, FMS aluminum driveshaft, weld in subframe connectors

[SaleenGTS]

If those are box stock pieces, no way. 360 rwhp is a lot of power...that's about 420 at the crank. You won't get that out of a 306, even if you port the crap out of them. You will need a 331 or 347 to get that.

I may be wrong, if I am, it won't be the first time, but I will stand my ground on this one.

------------------
Dustin
89 Saleen GT Sport,428 rwhp,TFS Street Heat Intake,TFS TW Heads,TFS #2 cam,BD-11A 9 psi,Crane 1.6 rr's,BBK 70mm TB,Pro-M 80mm MAF,MSD 6BTM, FMS 9mm wires,BBK longtubes,BBK Short H-pipe,American Thunder cat back,3.55's

12.3@119

[Skyman]

It made 332rwhp and 350.5rwtq. The Ls1 I raced and beat at carlsbad made 333rwhp I believe. I do have the sheets and I can scan them if u like. Showw me the thread, I'll jump over there too.

Skyler

------------------
-1989 Saleen Mustang #406-
TFS TW Heads, E-303, Edelbrock intake, 70mm TB, 73mm MAF, 24lb injectors, 1 5/8 shorties, Off Road H, 3 Chamber flows, Jaz Race seats, Back seat removed, sub-frames, Roll Cage, and a 80 shot of N20.
12.54@107.4 Motor
1.69 60'

[BowTie Eater 5 Liter]

they made 421hp out of a stock 302 shortblock, & afr185 heads (milled) tfs r intake & a nasty roller cam. torque was at 380 or somethin

[exgmguy]

That would have to be one built to the gills 302. On a Dynojet no less. Sounds a little hard to swallow. And Sky, I think you need to have your car dynoed again.

[87vert351]

If your car weighs 3500 and you are goin' 107 that's about 300rwhp and right around 350fwhp. That's if the car weighs that much which is one heavy fox if it's not a vert so the power figures will probably even be less in reality. Dyno numbers mean nothing anyway I've seen cars making 500fwhp only go in the 12's. Hp means nothing if you can't drive.

Mustangs making roughly 330rwhp around 3300lbs usually will mph in the low 11x from what I've seen.

------------------
351w, tremec trans Best N/A Pass 11.44@120 Best Nitrous Pass 10.62@132

[Skyman]

Im sorry, but I can drive. Ive yet to see anyone pull a 12.5 out of a 107mph trap speed.

I agree also that my MPH doesnt refelct 332rwhp. But look at GT-Hunter on this site he has 320rwhp and is trapping 106.

The saleen is heavier, 3200lbs stock I believe, and I have a full roll cage and subframes, which probably added more weight than the race seats.

I raced a LS1 that dynoed 333rwhp and it trapped 108 to my 107.4. So I don't know. But I want to get to a dyno jet.


Skyler

------------------
-1989 Saleen Mustang #406-
TFS TW Heads, E-303, Edelbrock intake, 70mm TB, 73mm MAF, 24lb injectors, 1 5/8 shorties, Off Road H, 3 Chamber flows, Jaz Race seats, Back seat removed, sub-frames, Roll Cage, and a 80 shot of N20.
12.54@107.4 Motor
[b][i]332RWHP, 350rwtq[b][i]

[fastang]

Dustin, werent you the one that posted the Anderson link where the 306 with TFS heads and the Holley intake made exactly 360 rwhp on a chassis dyno? I agree its defintely not the norm.

Sky, The post is at www.ClubSi.com Look under the "Si vs All" forum and clik on the thread called Big Block Chevelle goes down or something like that. Its posted by a guy called Guffinator. Theres a lot of Mustang owners over there now. In fact two of the moderators of the forum drive mustangs

I thought that you hit 340 something hp sky. When I read that you hit 332 I went back over there and corrected myself. Still damn impressive numbers and I would still like you to post the sheet if its not a pain in your *** . Im going to try to post a link to the thread but Im not great at it so if it doesnt work just go there the old fashioned way

[fastang]

Ok here goes,
http://forums.clubsi.com/ubb/Forum4/HTML/011421.html

[SaleenGTS]

fastang
I stand corrected

For some wierd reason, I always thought those were FWHP....lol

But look at who did the tuning. One of the performance Gods. So it can be done, but it is rare.

------------------
Dustin
89 Saleen GT Sport,428 rwhp,TFS Street Heat Intake,TFS TW Heads,TFS #2 cam,BD-11A 9 psi,Crane 1.6 rr's,BBK 70mm TB,Pro-M 80mm MAF,MSD 6BTM, FMS 9mm wires,BBK longtubes,BBK Short H-pipe,American Thunder cat back,3.55's

12.3@119

[87vert351]

Skyman,
I wasn't implying that you couldn't drive. You're using all that have right now. I was just saying a lot of people get hung up on dyno numbers and they really don't mean a thing.(to me anyway) Your car runs right where it should for your mods. When I had a 302 I went about the same as you 12.5x's@108/109 with a comparable set-up.

[SaleenGTS]

Dyno numbers mean everything. You will never see the low times without the dyno numbers.

------------------
Dustin
89 Saleen GT Sport,428 rwhp,TFS Street Heat Intake,TFS TW Heads,TFS #2 cam,BD-11A 9 psi,Crane 1.6 rr's,BBK 70mm TB,Pro-M 80mm MAF,MSD 6BTM, FMS 9mm wires,BBK longtubes,BBK Short H-pipe,American Thunder cat back,3.55's

12.3@119

[smokedchevy]

It's all about the total combo. Horse power is nothing without a properly set up car. I ran 13.50 at 107 mph at 3000ft elevation. That's a lot of horsepower, but with my crappy traction it didn't mean jack. A car with less power and more traction could easily toast me. I think we all get too hung up on horsepower.

------------------
92 GT, 4:10 gears, centerforce clutch, 6# powerdyne blower, bbk h-pipe, flowmasters

I find it hard to believe (not impossible I guess) for a 306 w/ heads and intake to make 360 rwhp (maybe he was talking rwtq???). Oh well, even if it isn't true.....it's only a little fib, right?

------------------
'90 LX 5.0;12K original miles (no sh*&);3.55 gears; March pulleys;Edelbrock Performer Heads;BBK 1 5/8" equal length shorties;MSD 6AL ignition w/ blaster 2 coil;FMS E303 cam;Pro-M 75mm MAF;BBK 70mm TB; Eibach drag-launch spring kit;Southside welded subs;K&N cone filter charger;Hurst shifter;Cervini's 3" turbo hood;A/C delete; gutted cats;2 chamber Flomasters;Corbeau racing seats;FMS 30# injectors;JMS chip; Holley 190lb fp;TFS track heat Intake (12.299 @ 113 - 1.78 60')

[87vert351]

SaleenGTS
Dyno numbers only prove how fast a car *should/could* be. Which means nothing if the rest of the car isn't working. I make probably 50 rwhp less then you yet I mph the same I wonder why? I've gone 11.73@123 on a bfg drag radial on motor. Best mph on a slick is 120 on motor since they don't spin I lose mph on a good tire. I don't care if someone is making 500 rwhp if the car isn't putting it down it could get beat by a car making 300rwhp thats working. Dyno numbers are good for bench racing and giving you an idication of whats *possible* that's about it IMO...which no one has to agree with.

Dyno tuning doesn't fall into that comment.

------------------
351w, tremec trans Best N/A Pass 11.44@120 Best Nitrous Pass 10.62@132

[SaleenGTS]

87vert...easy now, all I was saying is that you need to have the horsepower to get the low times. You won't see a 300 rwhp mustang turn 10's. Point proven.

------------------
Dustin
89 Saleen GT Sport,428 rwhp,TFS Street Heat Intake,TFS TW Heads,TFS #2 cam,BD-11A 9 psi,Crane 1.6 rr's,BBK 70mm TB,Pro-M 80mm MAF,MSD 6BTM, FMS 9mm wires,BBK longtubes,BBK Short H-pipe,American Thunder cat back,3.55's

12.3@119

[jonnyk]

360 rwhp from a 302 is doable. There was a guy on the Corral that had ported TFS heads, a Holley intake, custom cam, that was turning 365 rwhp or something like that? It's all in the combination...for all we know it could be a 12:1 compression motor with a solid cam in it. Need more info.

------------------
'91 LX Hatch, 17 ROH ZR6's, lowered, 3.73's, offroad H pipe, SN Cobra cat-back, ASP pullies, 14° timing, C&L 76mm MAF, 170A 3G, B&M Ripper on a T5
Best ET: 14.593 Best MPH: 95.72 (75°, 75% hum., 2200')
1991 LX Hatch 5.0L

[87vert351]

And you won't see a car with say...428rwhp go ohh low 11's high 10's like it *could* with a car that's properly set-up...point proven. I didn't want to go there..BUT you made me
This coin has two sides I guess we just look at it differntly and that is fine. I was just stating my own opinions. I do realize a car can't go 10's with only 300rwhp.

What was this post about anyway?!? LOL

Sorry to side track your post fastang

[fastang]

87vert, I dont care if you go off topic, talk about whatever you guys want

JonnyK, The motor in question isnt even a 302, its a 306 with higher compression pistons, AFR 185's and a Holley itake. I still say its very possible, just not the norm.

Everyone please at least click the link and read the post

------------------
95GT B303 cam, 1.7 rockers, 65mm TB, milled heads, 355's K&N, BBK Longtubes, Flowmaster cat back, pulleys, msd coil, 9mm wires, Tremec 3550, Pro5.0 shifter,10.5 Motorsport clutch, FMS aluminum driveshaft, weld in subframe connectors

[SaleenGTS]

Originally posted by 87vert351:
And you won't see a car with say...428rwhp go ohh low 11's high 10's like it *could* with a car that's properly set-up...point proven. I didn't want to go there..BUT you made me
This coin has two sides I guess we just look at it differntly and that is fine. I was just stating my own opinions. I do realize a car can't go 10's with only 300rwhp.

First off, I want to state that you haven't offended me if you think you did. I love opinions.

Secondly, my 12.3 was run on street tires. I have been through 3 clutches in the last 3 months, so slicks are out of the question for now. I love the raw acceleration. Your point proven just backed up my theory, and I thank you for that. Once again, all I was saying is that more hp=lower et's.


------------------
Dustin
89 Saleen GT Sport,428 rwhp,TFS Street Heat Intake,TFS TW Heads,TFS #2 cam,BD-11A 9 psi,Crane 1.6 rr's,BBK 70mm TB,Pro-M 80mm MAF,MSD 6BTM, FMS 9mm wires,BBK longtubes,BBK Short H-pipe,American Thunder cat back,3.55's

12.3@119