general v8 question
 

i've come across a 1970 pontiac tempest that i can acquire for a song.......

it runs and drives, but it is an inline 6.......

if i acquire an engine/tranny/rear end for it, what would you consider a fair price to pay for labor to get it all installed?

1970's is smog era stuff
 

Unless yiu're planning on building the car yourself, I wouldn't even plan on it. Now, if you're putting in a 455 modded with a T-4 and a 10 bolt, you may have something .

Rev

between 500-800. it all depends on if you bring your own parts and supplies and if modifications come about.

i've located a rebuilt 400 from a 69 gto along with rear-end............now i'm looking for a tranny.........

i live in an aparment complex and park on the street, so doing it myself isn't really feasible.................i'd planned on something turnkey, but not every day you get a deal on a 1970 tempest.......

also Rev, 1970 is a few years before smog era

also do you have all the accesory brakets for the V8? what about exhaust? that would have to be custom also. what is wrong with the 6? i would run that until you have everything needed for the V8 swap. trust me, it is easier that way.

Parts + labor?
 

He did say parts + labor. Whenever that is specified, it just means he doesn't have a clue, doesn't it? If he did, he would be asking about conversions and how to do it, wouldn't he?

Nothing against the conversion, he definitely needs it.

Rev








ts

i don't have anything yet............

it is just an offer that i can't refuse and i'm kinda thinking out loud/asking for advice..........

Rev, if i had a house and a place to work, i'd do it myself...........i have an apartment and 2 parking spaces on the street

Re: Parts + labor?
 

are you talking to me or him?:confused: :confused:

Been there , done that.................
 

Yes, I've been there and done that back in '71. I had a '71 Fiat 124 Sports Coupe. Weighed 2200 lbs with 105 hp with a 5 speed. Yes I was an an apartment dweller then, so I know what it's like. Wasn't trying to rag on you as some others have done. I personally want you to continue the performance car hobby. Count on me for continued support, but keep it civil.

Rev

i'm kinda in a catch-22 situation........

i can:

-buy a house to have somewhere to work on cars, and then not have the time or money to work on cars

or.........

-stay in an apartment and have the money to play with cars, but have nowhere at all to work on them

i say find a friend with a place to work on it. other than that your fukked!:D

i know where you could probably get everything you need, but since i'm a dick, well cant help ya.:)

i don't expect your help, but..........

for the record, i never called you a dick..........i was referring to my poor reception as the only import at knoxville dragway on test & tune night earlier this summer...........where a camaro owner spit on my "nazi car".........and a cutlass owner told me that i wasn't welcome there

only people raised in Tennesee are hillbillies. oops! sorry MARTY!:D hahaha j/k

you kidding right?...that guy was a ***. i may not like some cars personally but i would never tell he/she had a 'nazi car'. i hope you told him where to go.

yeah your a dick, no arguement there!:D :D HAHAHA! sometimes your an easy target Marty! like Topless!:D j/k

hey Digital: -FOR SALE - Iraqi rifle. Never fired. Dropped once.
i had to think about that for a sec and after i figured it out, i laughed my asz off!! good one!

thank's srv1 appreciate it my brotha. :D :D :D :p

not really, i felt like a lot of people had a problem with me being there, so i left (kinda funny since i'm a domestic car guy too and everyone there was awesome when i pulled up in an f150 to watch)...........i'll come back in the volkswagen, but not alone and prolly not without my 9 iron..........

i've never gotten that an autocross;)

the only "Nazi car" i can think of is the old Beetle's if you wanted to be technical. i never in my life have had someone spit at me. i honestly would say if some guy did that, even if i am out numbered 3 to 1, i would definetly come out swinging! i wouldnt care how big he is, even if he was as big as Tony Frank i still would come after him. Only if he spit on me. If i wasnt spitted on, then i would walk away if i was out numbered. words i can often ignore, but a total disrespect like that would be uncalled for. only scumbags spit.:mad:

you know that your my left hand man!:p

lol yeah when i found that one, i thought it was a good one too and had to throw that in there.:D

as long as i aint gotta be your right hand man & do that nasty thing, bwahahaha, j/k. :rolleyes: :D :D :D

That is the most intelligent Camaro owner I've heard of in a long time. Since the first Volkswagen or "peoples car" (literal translation) was built under commision of Hitler, he was totally correct.

It is no reason for him to spit on the car, and if I could stand fwd, I might have on myself, but he was correcter than he though saying that.

You might find the labor as cheap as srv1 suggested, but don't count on it. I don't know anyone that would even consider it for less than $1500. Swapping out an entire driveline with an entirely different one is not an easy job. Don't get me wrong, you may very well find someone that will do it for $800, but plan on spending $1500. At least. That way you won't be stuck with all your parts, and not enough to get the work done if the cost is higher.

Take care,
~Chris

wrong thread bud, i challenged you to race, that's when you called me a dick,duuuhhh. remember???? hhhuuuhhh. :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:btw i will give you credit, you are toneing it down, i know about 3 or 4 places to get the parts you need , but i only help people who are nice.

here is your challenge and my reply:

i implied that i suspected you as very capable of being a dick, but nowhere did i call you one.

well no offense Chris, but how hard is it to swap out a whole driveline in a 1970 vehicle? simple as pie!(assuming this isnt northern vehicle with RUST!) The hardest part would be the front brackets for the accesories for the motor. all electrical, fuel, and suspension is all basic. now if we were talking about a late model Fox 4cyl-8cyl Fuel Injection swap, then that would be alot of money to do. my figures were not low, they were average. heck, i would charge him $800 to do everything. as long as he brings ALL the parts, all i have is labor. Also you got to remember i am not on flat rate when i do it. i do it at my pace at my convience. if i was flat rate, your figure would be correct. i assume this is bolt out, bolt in procedure with some minor modifications. what i dont guarantee in that labor time is tuning of the driveline. that would be additional.

BTW, did you ever get the clutch working right?

I used to quote $500 for engine swaps, and always came away underpaid. The customer never has all the parts, or refuses to buy a new water pump because the old one is only six months old, but because it's been sitting dry for 4 weeks, the seals have cracked, and I get to swap the water pump after everything is done, while he says "oh, you were right".

I won't even consider an engine swap for less than $1000, and I'm cheap. I do include dialing it in. When I'm finished, the customer will drive their vehicle home.

A 1970 Tempest or LeMans, or what ever it was he's looking at is pretty routine, but you'r going to have to rebuild the front suspension too. The springs are different between the 6 and the 8, and as long as you're in there, it's silly not to do the bushings (probably will crumble as you take the a-arms out anyway). Then there's the tranny crossmember, and whichever shifter he's going to want you to install. You'll need to measure and locate a driveshaft, and hope that there isn't too much welding involved with the new rearend. The brake lines should line up fine, but you know he's going to need disks up front, and the '70 6'ers had 4w drums, without a power booster, which means new brake lines anyway.

Then, you have to ask yourself; how many miles are on this 400 from a donor goat? Is it complete? You wouldn't install a points ignition, would you? Of course not, so start checking the local yards for a Pontiac HEI. The carb is going to need a rebuild, too. The p/s will be different, and the radiator will be too small. The shocks are going to suck, too.

Then there's the exhaust.

Bro, if you want to do that for $800, God bless you.

I'm too big of a prick, and my time and tools are worth more than that. Hell, I still need to come up with another $200 for a reverse power bleeder!!!

Take care,
~Chris

Yeah, today. I took the weekend off and just did stuff around the house, and went back at it today. I reverse pressure bled it with a cleaned out quart-sized oil pump can. By the time the fluid was clear up top (from the bottom), I put the cap and bellows thingy on the master, propped a 2x4 between my seat and a fully depressed clutch pedal, and just cracked the beeder for a sec. A slight puff of air, followed by a dribble, was all I gave it a chance to emit. I removed the 2x4, and pumped that pedal like Fred Flintstone taking off in his car. That was the part that just felt wrong, but you were 100% correct. Within 15 minutes, the pedal felt normal, so I measured the bearing travel, and it was just over 1/2" (specs are .460" or more). I was thrilled.

I was also kinda stupid. I've needed to pull my upper intake and reseat my air injection tubes for over a year now because of a periodic exhaust leak. I felt brave today, and pulled the upper intake. I got the injection tubes out, and discovered the #6 tube was rotting through. I tried welding uit, but didn't turn the Mig down, and put a damn hole in it. An hour later, it looks okay, but then I had to watch my Packers kick some Chicago butt. :)

Should be done tomorrow. besides, this gives me a chance to check all the stupid plastic vacuum lines Ford likes to use for the EGR system.

Thank you very much for your help. I had input from about 5 or 6 sources, and they really pretty much said the same thing, just in different ways. Following your advice to the T was what paid off, though. Thanks again, James!!!

Take care,
~Chris

YOU ARE RIGHT! but all he wanted was the drivetrain dropped in. he never mentioned anything else. i quoted him just to put a motor, tranny and rearend in with little modifications if needed. now any ADDITIONAL time like the brake conversion, brackets and cables for the tranny and anything else is extra. if he didnt have the right parts or didnt have all of them, then this would take time and of course more dough.

i should have explained myself better. i would do it for $800 bucks still, just bolting it in and modifying it to work. I would definitaly would tell him up front what ways he could go and what he could also do. all he asked was a fair price for just installing it! so i dont think $800 is too little just to put in the drivetrain with the correct parts given.

also just to let you know, not all 6's came with drums!

That is great you made your own tool! saves money! you would think the Fred Flinstone way would be wrong, but it works.

Is your AIR tubes in the manifold or the head? Did you have a hard time getting the nut out? I have tried welding them also, but welded shut!!! you cant do that their, and neither can i technically, but who is going to prove it? we dont have sniffers here except the boroughs and NYC. the ones that are the pain are the 2.8's Camaros and Caprices body styles. The Olds blocks can be too, but so far knock on wood for them!

I'm glad that my advice worked for you. One hand washes the other.

edit

I get it.

I used to bid jobs that way too, but it seemed like no matter how clear I made things up front, they always expected more for the money, so i just found it easier to bid high, and do the work necessary.

i must admit, though, if I'd taken Spanish in high school instead of "let's cut class and go to In-N-Out Burger", I would probably have had better luck with most of my prior problem customers.

The air tubes go into the head, just below the upper intake. After you suggested it, I took my camera out to the garage, and took a bunch of pics. I'll show you what I mean in a few. (BTW, I just used small pipe plugs in my Olds heads). I called Ford to see if they could suggest where I could find another one, and to my surprise, they said they could get one, but it would have to be ordered. They only want $106 for it, too! Man, I almost fell down when he told me that.

Today was the first real test. It drove great, and felt so much snappier than it was. I can't tell if it's because the clutch was slipping, or because I cleaned my injectors.

The pedal is better than it's ever been. I have at least 4-5 inches from the floor before the clutch engages.

Thanks again. This really helped me when I needed it, and I do appreciate it. You just may get a Christmas card this year! :D

Thanks Bro.

Take care,
~Chris