HEY SKYLER!

fastang · 07-13-2001, 12:01 PM

What size valves are in your TFS heads? AFR says that the 185's wont work with my stock pistons and that I would have to get 165's

I really want 202's

------------------
95GT B303 cam, 1.7 rockers, 65mm TB, milled heads, 355's K&N, BBK Longtubes, Flowmaster cat back, pulleys, msd coil, 9mm wires, Tremec 3550, Pro5.0 shifter,10.5 Motorsport clutch, FMS aluminum driveshaft, weld in subframe connectors

302 LX Eric · 07-13-2001, 12:50 PM

TFS TW heads have 2.02/1.60 valves.

The AFR's probably have a different placement of the valves than the TWs do - that may be why they are telling you that they won't work.

Hope this helps,
E

------------------
1991 5.0 LX Coupe - 38,000 miles

13.17 @ 106.14 mph w/ 2.138 60'

fastang · 07-13-2001, 01:09 PM

Thanks eric. Do you have to change pushrods or drill anything with the TFS heads?

302 LX Eric · 07-13-2001, 02:33 PM

You don't have to drill anything. As for the pushrods, I don't recall the exact size you need, but I purchased mine directly from Trick Flow. They are TFS harden pushrods. The exact length is stated in the directions that come with the heads. Someone here probably knows off the top of their head. Anyone?

The TFS TW heads are really nice. Are considering getting them? If so, I would recommend a very mild clean up on them - no heavy porting. However, if you are planning on a blower/nitrous, then I would speak with a reputable CNC shop about how much porting you need.

Good luck!

fastang · 07-13-2001, 03:21 PM

Im leaving to go buy em right now

The guy I talked to said they are hardened manley rods. I am having them milled and match ported to a TFSR intake as soon as they arrive

------------------
95GT B303 cam, 1.7 rockers, 65mm TB, milled heads, 355's K&N, BBK Longtubes, Flowmaster cat back, pulleys, msd coil, 9mm wires, Tremec 3550, Pro5.0 shifter,10.5 Motorsport clutch, FMS aluminum driveshaft, weld in subframe connectors

302 LX Eric · 07-13-2001, 03:53 PM

Awesome! You will be very happy with that combo.

I would imagine you will run some really nice times given your set-up. What will your camber volume end up being after the mill? Compression?

My chambers are pretty big at 65cc's - but mine were ported heavy for a future blower. With a very small cam, 9.0:1 comp and drag radials I've gone 13.17 @ 106mph. You should be able to go even faster!!!

Keep us posted on the install!

E

fastang · 07-13-2001, 05:26 PM

Well I just ordered the heads but Im not too happy

My rockers wont work so I had to order stud mt. Now my pedestal mt rockers are useless. It cost me nearly $1500 for the heads, pushrods, and rockers.

I REALLY didnt want to get new rockers. Thats why I wanted AFR's so bad, you can use pedestal mt rockers on them.

Should I get them stage II ported or just surface and port match them?

------------------
95GT B303 cam, 1.7 rockers, 65mm TB, milled heads, 355's K&N, BBK Longtubes, Flowmaster cat back, pulleys, msd coil, 9mm wires, Tremec 3550, Pro5.0 shifter,10.5 Motorsport clutch, FMS aluminum driveshaft, weld in subframe connectors

exgmguy · 07-14-2001, 05:52 AM

The stock rockers are junk anyway. The factory ratios are not always accurate, and they can flex at high rpm's. A stud is always stronger than a bolt too. Not to mention the friction losses from a roller rocker. The pusrods you need are 6.7 inches in length too.

Also, With the stud mount roller rockers your stock valve covers will not fit. So after you spend the 100+ bucks on the new fancy Motorsport valve covers and bolt those on you will find out your upper intake won't fit anymore either due to the taller valve covers. The 3/8" intake spacer should work. If you use a 1" spacer I hope you have some pennies saved for a new cowl hood.

------------------
1988 Mustang GT
12.0 @ 122
1992 BadAzz Wrangler
1993 Explorer

fastang · 07-14-2001, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by exgmguy:
The stock rockers are junk anyway. The factory ratios are not always accurate, and they can flex at high rpm's. A stud is always stronger than a bolt too. Not to mention the friction losses from a roller rocker. The pusrods you need are 6.7 inches in length too.

Also, With the stud mount roller rockers your stock valve covers will not fit. So after you spend the 100+ bucks on the new fancy Motorsport valve covers and bolt those on you will find out your upper intake won't fit anymore either due to the taller valve covers. The 3/8" intake spacer should work. If you use a 1" spacer I hope you have some pennies saved for a new cowl hood.

I dont mind buying new valve covers but Im NOT buying a hood. I think a TFSR intake will clear the valve covers anyway since its a shorter runner. I hope.

------------------
95GT B303 cam, 1.7 rockers, 65mm TB, milled heads, 355's K&N, BBK Longtubes, Flowmaster cat back, pulleys, msd coil, 9mm wires, Tremec 3550, Pro5.0 shifter,10.5 Motorsport clutch, FMS aluminum driveshaft, weld in subframe connectors

[Note: This message has been edited by Mr 5 0]

Skyman · 07-14-2001, 04:41 PM

Looks like these guys got it all right on already and you already got everything purchased. If your going to port them why not go ahead now that I think of it, and go with a stage two. Should be around $400? maybe 500 right? Since your going with a 347 in the future. Sure it maybe a bit big for the 302 but I doubt it.

If it doesnt fit w/ the 1" spacer just throw it out, I havn't seen them make much of a difference anyways.

I cant wait to see this come together!

Skyler

------------------
-1989 Saleen Mustang #406-
TFS TW Heads, E-303, Edelbrock intake, 70mm TB, 73mm MAF, 24lb injectors, 1 5/8 shorties, Off Road H, 3 Chamber flows, Jaz Race seats, Back seat removed, sub-frames, Roll Cage, and a 80 shot of N20.
12.54@107.4 Motor
1.69 60'

fastang · 07-14-2001, 04:48 PM

Sky, didnt you say that you wished you had an RPM intake before? Do you think I should get the TFSR intake or a track heat? I think Im going to get a little bowl work done to them. Your cam is a slightly smaller grind than mine and it works great with your heads, maybe mine will respond well to a little more flow? This is no BS, I should have everthing done in a month or so. I still have to buy the intake, a set of valve covers(which ones are you using?) a gasket set and probably a new dampenener pulley.

------------------
95GT B303 cam, 1.7 rockers, 65mm TB, milled heads, 355's K&N, BBK Longtubes, Flowmaster cat back, pulleys, msd coil, 9mm wires, Tremec 3550, Pro5.0 shifter,10.5 Motorsport clutch, FMS aluminum driveshaft, weld in subframe connectors

exgmguy · 07-14-2001, 05:56 PM

I would go with the Track heat intake. The "R" will just make your stock compression 302 soggy. That intake is for a monster 302 spinning to 7 grand, or a mean stroker. You have to use and upper intake spacer or the throttle linkage on the bottom of the throttle body will hit the valve cover, as well as the vacuum lines under the plenum. (depending on the intake)

This is info from my Fox body GT. Your SN-95 may be slightly different. (curved inlet after throttle body, hood line)

------------------
1988 Mustang GT
11.8 @ 123 (7/14/01)
1992 BadAzz Wrangler
1993 Explorer

fastang · 07-15-2001, 11:32 PM

I heard that some shops buy the TFS castings and stuff cheaper valves in them and sell them complete to make a larger profit. Has anyone else heard of this? The cheaper valved dont flow as well. I want to make sure that I get what I pay for.

------------------
95GT B303 cam, 1.7 rockers, 65mm TB, milled heads, 355's K&N, BBK Longtubes, Flowmaster cat back, pulleys, msd coil, 9mm wires, Tremec 3550, Pro5.0 shifter,10.5 Motorsport clutch, FMS aluminum driveshaft, weld in subframe connectors

Skyman · 07-15-2001, 11:49 PM

I bought mine from SUMMIT in early 99.
I wish I got a RPM intake. And a little higher revving cam.

The track heat intake should be good.

Actually I was on the Anderson Ford web site a while back and they had a 10:1 compression 302 with TFS TW heads, cam I forget, and they tested 12 intakes with it.

The Track heat made the 2nd most power right around 348hp, and the most was made by the Holley intake at 362hp.

The other intakes were the RPM, and the Perfomer, and the Explorer, they were all around 318-330hp.

You really can't go all that wrong, but I would go w/ the holley or track heat.

We gotta hit the track as soon as you get it together and get that sucker all dialed it.

Skyler

------------------
-1989 Saleen Mustang #406-
TFS TW Heads, E-303, Edelbrock intake, 70mm TB, 73mm MAF, 24lb injectors, 1 5/8 shorties, Off Road H, 3 Chamber flows, Jaz Race seats, Back seat removed, sub-frames, Roll Cage, and a 80 shot of N20.
12.54@107.4 Motor
1.69 60'

fastang · 07-16-2001, 11:06 AM

Sounds good. Its going to take 2 weeks longer than I had planned because Im going for the stage II porting but oh well. I should have it all together by the time Fontana opens up. Are you still down to meet there opening day? Its probably going to be packed but it'll be fun.

------------------
95GT B303 cam, 1.7 rockers, 65mm TB, milled heads, 355's K&N, BBK Longtubes, Flowmaster cat back, pulleys, msd coil, 9mm wires, Tremec 3550, Pro5.0 shifter,10.5 Motorsport clutch, FMS aluminum driveshaft, weld in subframe connectors

fastang · 07-16-2001, 12:55 PM

I just talked to the shop, Im definitely getting the good valves and he said he would do the whole deal, stage one and two porting for 490 bucks. Thats cheap, and he has a flowbench with a printer to show the work

Skyman · 07-16-2001, 02:56 PM

That sounds like a good price. I should get my heads ported eventually. Whenever something breaks and I have to dig into the motor again.

I'll go that day... Even if it is packed its still fun. I hope it will be a nice track.

Skyler

------------------
-1989 Saleen Mustang #406-
TFS TW Heads, E-303, Edelbrock intake, 70mm TB, 73mm MAF, 24lb injectors, 1 5/8 shorties, Off Road H, 3 Chamber flows, Jaz Race seats, Back seat removed, sub-frames, Roll Cage, and a 80 shot of N20.
12.54@107.4 Motor
1.69 60'

fastang · 07-16-2001, 05:46 PM

Sky, I was watching your video of you in the car driving and I noticed that you didnt powershift. Do you ever? Were you powershifting when you ran the 12.5?

------------------
95GT B303 cam, 1.7 rockers, 65mm TB, milled heads, 355's K&N, BBK Longtubes, Flowmaster cat back, pulleys, msd coil, 9mm wires, Tremec 3550, Pro5.0 shifter,10.5 Motorsport clutch, FMS aluminum driveshaft, weld in subframe connectors

AJSTANG · 07-16-2001, 08:08 PM

Coming in a little late on this post but wanted to share some info. The push rods are 6.7" and you can get them from Trick Flow. Go at least with the stage I port for a little extra flow and hp. Sky did you see my response in street racers corner. Also Use 1.6:1 ratio rockers. I'd recommend a different cam though something with more duration

------------------
'93 GT Conv.
TFS Twisted Wedge Heads, Cobra Intake, Lunati Cam, 24lb inj.,Pro-M 80 mm MAF
13.24 @ 106.40 mph w/2.05sec/60ft

Skyman · 07-17-2001, 01:19 AM

I only powershift on the 3-4 shift. Not the others.

Skyler

------------------
-1989 Saleen Mustang #406-
TFS TW Heads, E-303, Edelbrock intake, 70mm TB, 73mm MAF, 24lb injectors, 1 5/8 shorties, Off Road H, 3 Chamber flows, Jaz Race seats, Back seat removed, sub-frames, Roll Cage, and a 80 shot of N20.
12.54@107.4 Motor
1.69 60'

07-13-2001, 12:01 PM	#1
fastang Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: santa ana ca Posts: 1,349	HEY SKYLER! What size valves are in your TFS heads? AFR says that the 185's wont work with my stock pistons and that I would have to get 165's I really want 202's ------------------ 95GT B303 cam, 1.7 rockers, 65mm TB, milled heads, 355's K&N, BBK Longtubes, Flowmaster cat back, pulleys, msd coil, 9mm wires, Tremec 3550, Pro5.0 shifter,10.5 Motorsport clutch, FMS aluminum driveshaft, weld in subframe connectors

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07-13-2001, 12:50 PM	#2
302 LX Eric or '331 LX Eric' Join Date: Jan 1999 Location: Columbus, Ohio Posts: 2,142	TFS TW heads have 2.02/1.60 valves. The AFR's probably have a different placement of the valves than the TWs do - that may be why they are telling you that they won't work. Hope this helps, E ------------------ 1991 5.0 LX Coupe - 38,000 miles 13.17 @ 106.14 mph w/ 2.138 60'

07-13-2001, 01:09 PM	#3
fastang Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: santa ana ca Posts: 1,349	Thanks eric. Do you have to change pushrods or drill anything with the TFS heads?

07-13-2001, 02:33 PM	#4
302 LX Eric or '331 LX Eric' Join Date: Jan 1999 Location: Columbus, Ohio Posts: 2,142	You don't have to drill anything. As for the pushrods, I don't recall the exact size you need, but I purchased mine directly from Trick Flow. They are TFS harden pushrods. The exact length is stated in the directions that come with the heads. Someone here probably knows off the top of their head. Anyone? The TFS TW heads are really nice. Are considering getting them? If so, I would recommend a very mild clean up on them - no heavy porting. However, if you are planning on a blower/nitrous, then I would speak with a reputable CNC shop about how much porting you need. Good luck!

07-13-2001, 03:21 PM	#5
fastang Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: santa ana ca Posts: 1,349	Im leaving to go buy em right now The guy I talked to said they are hardened manley rods. I am having them milled and match ported to a TFSR intake as soon as they arrive ------------------ 95GT B303 cam, 1.7 rockers, 65mm TB, milled heads, 355's K&N, BBK Longtubes, Flowmaster cat back, pulleys, msd coil, 9mm wires, Tremec 3550, Pro5.0 shifter,10.5 Motorsport clutch, FMS aluminum driveshaft, weld in subframe connectors

07-13-2001, 03:53 PM	#6
302 LX Eric or '331 LX Eric' Join Date: Jan 1999 Location: Columbus, Ohio Posts: 2,142	Awesome! You will be very happy with that combo. I would imagine you will run some really nice times given your set-up. What will your camber volume end up being after the mill? Compression? My chambers are pretty big at 65cc's - but mine were ported heavy for a future blower. With a very small cam, 9.0:1 comp and drag radials I've gone 13.17 @ 106mph. You should be able to go even faster!!! Keep us posted on the install! E

07-13-2001, 05:26 PM	#7
fastang Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: santa ana ca Posts: 1,349	Well I just ordered the heads but Im not too happy My rockers wont work so I had to order stud mt. Now my pedestal mt rockers are useless. It cost me nearly $1500 for the heads, pushrods, and rockers. I REALLY didnt want to get new rockers. Thats why I wanted AFR's so bad, you can use pedestal mt rockers on them. Should I get them stage II ported or just surface and port match them? ------------------ 95GT B303 cam, 1.7 rockers, 65mm TB, milled heads, 355's K&N, BBK Longtubes, Flowmaster cat back, pulleys, msd coil, 9mm wires, Tremec 3550, Pro5.0 shifter,10.5 Motorsport clutch, FMS aluminum driveshaft, weld in subframe connectors

07-14-2001, 05:52 AM	#8
exgmguy Registered Member Join Date: Feb 1999 Location: Utica, Michigan Posts: 2,631	The stock rockers are junk anyway. The factory ratios are not always accurate, and they can flex at high rpm's. A stud is always stronger than a bolt too. Not to mention the friction losses from a roller rocker. The pusrods you need are 6.7 inches in length too. Also, With the stud mount roller rockers your stock valve covers will not fit. So after you spend the 100+ bucks on the new fancy Motorsport valve covers and bolt those on you will find out your upper intake won't fit anymore either due to the taller valve covers. The 3/8" intake spacer should work. If you use a 1" spacer I hope you have some pennies saved for a new cowl hood. ------------------ 1988 Mustang GT 12.0 @ 122 1992 BadAzz Wrangler 1993 Explorer

07-14-2001, 04:41 PM	#10
Skyman I need 110mph Trap Speed! Join Date: Feb 1999 Location: So, CA Posts: 4,315	Looks like these guys got it all right on already and you already got everything purchased. If your going to port them why not go ahead now that I think of it, and go with a stage two. Should be around $400? maybe 500 right? Since your going with a 347 in the future. Sure it maybe a bit big for the 302 but I doubt it. If it doesnt fit w/ the 1" spacer just throw it out, I havn't seen them make much of a difference anyways. I cant wait to see this come together! Skyler ------------------ -1989 Saleen Mustang #406- TFS TW Heads, E-303, Edelbrock intake, 70mm TB, 73mm MAF, 24lb injectors, 1 5/8 shorties, Off Road H, 3 Chamber flows, Jaz Race seats, Back seat removed, sub-frames, Roll Cage, and a 80 shot of N20. 12.54@107.4 Motor 1.69 60'

07-14-2001, 04:48 PM	#11
fastang Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: santa ana ca Posts: 1,349	Sky, didnt you say that you wished you had an RPM intake before? Do you think I should get the TFSR intake or a track heat? I think Im going to get a little bowl work done to them. Your cam is a slightly smaller grind than mine and it works great with your heads, maybe mine will respond well to a little more flow? This is no BS, I should have everthing done in a month or so. I still have to buy the intake, a set of valve covers(which ones are you using?) a gasket set and probably a new dampenener pulley. ------------------ 95GT B303 cam, 1.7 rockers, 65mm TB, milled heads, 355's K&N, BBK Longtubes, Flowmaster cat back, pulleys, msd coil, 9mm wires, Tremec 3550, Pro5.0 shifter,10.5 Motorsport clutch, FMS aluminum driveshaft, weld in subframe connectors

07-14-2001, 05:56 PM	#12
exgmguy Registered Member Join Date: Feb 1999 Location: Utica, Michigan Posts: 2,631	I would go with the Track heat intake. The "R" will just make your stock compression 302 soggy. That intake is for a monster 302 spinning to 7 grand, or a mean stroker. You have to use and upper intake spacer or the throttle linkage on the bottom of the throttle body will hit the valve cover, as well as the vacuum lines under the plenum. (depending on the intake) This is info from my Fox body GT. Your SN-95 may be slightly different. (curved inlet after throttle body, hood line) ------------------ 1988 Mustang GT 11.8 @ 123 (7/14/01) 1992 BadAzz Wrangler 1993 Explorer

07-15-2001, 11:32 PM	#13
fastang Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: santa ana ca Posts: 1,349	I heard that some shops buy the TFS castings and stuff cheaper valves in them and sell them complete to make a larger profit. Has anyone else heard of this? The cheaper valved dont flow as well. I want to make sure that I get what I pay for. ------------------ 95GT B303 cam, 1.7 rockers, 65mm TB, milled heads, 355's K&N, BBK Longtubes, Flowmaster cat back, pulleys, msd coil, 9mm wires, Tremec 3550, Pro5.0 shifter,10.5 Motorsport clutch, FMS aluminum driveshaft, weld in subframe connectors

07-15-2001, 11:49 PM	#14
Skyman I need 110mph Trap Speed! Join Date: Feb 1999 Location: So, CA Posts: 4,315	I bought mine from SUMMIT in early 99. I wish I got a RPM intake. And a little higher revving cam. The track heat intake should be good. Actually I was on the Anderson Ford web site a while back and they had a 10:1 compression 302 with TFS TW heads, cam I forget, and they tested 12 intakes with it. The Track heat made the 2nd most power right around 348hp, and the most was made by the Holley intake at 362hp. The other intakes were the RPM, and the Perfomer, and the Explorer, they were all around 318-330hp. You really can't go all that wrong, but I would go w/ the holley or track heat. We gotta hit the track as soon as you get it together and get that sucker all dialed it. Skyler ------------------ -1989 Saleen Mustang #406- TFS TW Heads, E-303, Edelbrock intake, 70mm TB, 73mm MAF, 24lb injectors, 1 5/8 shorties, Off Road H, 3 Chamber flows, Jaz Race seats, Back seat removed, sub-frames, Roll Cage, and a 80 shot of N20. 12.54@107.4 Motor 1.69 60'

07-16-2001, 11:06 AM	#15
fastang Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: santa ana ca Posts: 1,349	Sounds good. Its going to take 2 weeks longer than I had planned because Im going for the stage II porting but oh well. I should have it all together by the time Fontana opens up. Are you still down to meet there opening day? Its probably going to be packed but it'll be fun. ------------------ 95GT B303 cam, 1.7 rockers, 65mm TB, milled heads, 355's K&N, BBK Longtubes, Flowmaster cat back, pulleys, msd coil, 9mm wires, Tremec 3550, Pro5.0 shifter,10.5 Motorsport clutch, FMS aluminum driveshaft, weld in subframe connectors

07-16-2001, 12:55 PM	#16
fastang Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: santa ana ca Posts: 1,349	I just talked to the shop, Im definitely getting the good valves and he said he would do the whole deal, stage one and two porting for 490 bucks. Thats cheap, and he has a flowbench with a printer to show the work

07-16-2001, 02:56 PM	#17
Skyman I need 110mph Trap Speed! Join Date: Feb 1999 Location: So, CA Posts: 4,315	That sounds like a good price. I should get my heads ported eventually. Whenever something breaks and I have to dig into the motor again. I'll go that day... Even if it is packed its still fun. I hope it will be a nice track. Skyler ------------------ -1989 Saleen Mustang #406- TFS TW Heads, E-303, Edelbrock intake, 70mm TB, 73mm MAF, 24lb injectors, 1 5/8 shorties, Off Road H, 3 Chamber flows, Jaz Race seats, Back seat removed, sub-frames, Roll Cage, and a 80 shot of N20. 12.54@107.4 Motor 1.69 60'

07-16-2001, 05:46 PM	#18
fastang Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: santa ana ca Posts: 1,349	Sky, I was watching your video of you in the car driving and I noticed that you didnt powershift. Do you ever? Were you powershifting when you ran the 12.5? ------------------ 95GT B303 cam, 1.7 rockers, 65mm TB, milled heads, 355's K&N, BBK Longtubes, Flowmaster cat back, pulleys, msd coil, 9mm wires, Tremec 3550, Pro5.0 shifter,10.5 Motorsport clutch, FMS aluminum driveshaft, weld in subframe connectors

07-16-2001, 08:08 PM	#19
AJSTANG Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Maryland Posts: 123	Coming in a little late on this post but wanted to share some info. The push rods are 6.7" and you can get them from Trick Flow. Go at least with the stage I port for a little extra flow and hp. Sky did you see my response in street racers corner. Also Use 1.6:1 ratio rockers. I'd recommend a different cam though something with more duration ------------------ '93 GT Conv. TFS Twisted Wedge Heads, Cobra Intake, Lunati Cam, 24lb inj.,Pro-M 80 mm MAF 13.24 @ 106.40 mph w/2.05sec/60ft

07-17-2001, 01:19 AM	#20
Skyman I need 110mph Trap Speed! Join Date: Feb 1999 Location: So, CA Posts: 4,315	I only powershift on the 3-4 shift. Not the others. Skyler ------------------ -1989 Saleen Mustang #406- TFS TW Heads, E-303, Edelbrock intake, 70mm TB, 73mm MAF, 24lb injectors, 1 5/8 shorties, Off Road H, 3 Chamber flows, Jaz Race seats, Back seat removed, sub-frames, Roll Cage, and a 80 shot of N20. 12.54@107.4 Motor 1.69 60'