None of us who mod imports "forget" that there is no replacement for displacement. Toyota just doesn't have an engine bigger than 3.0L in their cars for reasons that we do not know. I'm sure if we had it our way we'd have a V8 Camry pushing 300HP, but then what's Lexus gonna do? :D

So we make the best of what we have and from what I've seen many people have done a great job with that. If you consider only stock cars, our 3.0L Supra TT will at worst be on par with even your Cobra-R, whether its an auto or 6-spd Supra we're talking about. Seems like Toyota doesn't really have a reason to build larger displacement engines to achieve power.

Yes I will admit that your 5.0L will be much more efficient and robust AFTER mods since it has a greater capacity to grow into... meaning your cylinders carry a lesser load per cylinder. But the bottomline remains that there are many engines of lesser displacements (eg. Supra, Skyline, Celica/MR2 All-Trac) that will match and beat what a 5.0 has to offer.

I don't want to start a flame war. You seem like a very respectably knowlegable person.

Take the supra for example. I will not argue that it will run with if not beat a cobra r. But a turbo charger will significantly increase displacement. I will not argue over who will win but the displacement thing is really a pet peave of mine.

Thank you... and No question of a flame war here. Leave the flame for the whopper at Wendy's :D There is no problem with having a mature discussion though.

But I can see what you mean. If I drove a domestic high displacement engine I too would be bothered by the fact that cars with half my engine size want to be at the same level as me! :) But the fact of the matter is, as you too realize is technology has allowed us to do many unconventional things.

Domestic 5.0, 5.7, etc were the beginning of it all... simple musclecars with just raw power... but now with technology we have forced induction and turbo engines like the Supra and Porsche that sort of shatter the old conventional, big engine, big power routine.

I personally think its great to have variation and so many options that way. Stock for stock you, as well as I can see what the numbers are. Its not all about displacement anymore.

quote:
"I personally think its great to have variation and so many options that way. Stock for stock you, as well as I can see what the numbers are. Its not all about displacement anymore. "

It is about displacement. with forced induction whichever way you do it, supercharging, turbocharging, and also nitrous. these all increase the theoretical displacement. If you think that a n/a 3.0 supra and a TT 3.0 Supra have the same displacement then you are missing my point.

I, too, want to confirm that we are talking about RICE...did we even once mention imports that are truly FAST? No.

I've been spanked by a Civic before in the Mustang..a little 95 gray snatchback that I spied at the track the next weekend running a 12.2..and that was over 2 years ago.

I really love my Honda...but I would never mod it. Most people like to modify a car to make it faster correct? Then why start with a dog like my Civic??? A Supra or a Rx7...totally understandable. A Sentra? Sure, you can make ANYTHING fast...but at what cost? I've seen the amount of money that people invest to make something like a Neon run faster...to HANG with a fox body GT or a Camaro that would have cost THOUSANDS less...I guess that's what I don't understand...WHY purposely start with a lesser base? :confused: Yeah, lemme buy a Kawasaki ZX6e and try to make it as fast as a ZX6r....riiiiiiiight.

I had a V6 Mustang and I toyed with it, but I NEVER tried to make it fast..that's plain retarded. I just waited until I got a faster car. I guess part of modding a econo car is to be "different"...lemme tell yah its pretty hard to be different with a PRODUCTION CAR. I figure for the money you spend on that 4 cyl to make it run 13-14s, you could have made your V8 run 13s-12s, AND redo the interior ;)

I'll always think little Civics hauling *** are cute as heck, but a big waste of money for the end result...BUT...to each their own :)

Whats all this crap about sticking up for ricers?

A ricer to me is....well, you all know what a ricer is.

I guess my point is if a dude rice's out a Ford Focus, hes still a ricer in my book.

I dont think a person has to drive an import to be a ricer, as there are many import drivers that dont "rice it up", as was pointed out.

Theres nothing wrong with taking a toyota or honda and modifying it for power if thats the brand of car you like. However, there is NO REASON to put fart pipes, stickers, and big wings on them. That is the difference between a ricer and a "car enthusiast"

small cubes and power adders were the future at one time, due to emmisions, gasoline conservation, blah, blah, blah...but who knows anymore..who thought they would be building v-10s?

I know a lot of the younger crowd think a 302 is a big bad engine, but its not. Its a small engine, one of the smallest v-8's ever made. A good engine that can make power and responds well to mods, but in the big picture, still a small engine.

So, your point has mo merit. Your eithier riced out your car or you didnt, doesnt matter who made the car.

And we will continue to pick on the clueless that take this route, because its the right thing to do..:)

I don't care who makes the engine, but bigger IS often better. Yes the 5.0 is older technology, but Ford has jumped into the "new age". That is what the 4.6L SOHC and DOHC engines did.

You can through 20 psi from a turbo on a Supra, but guess what? Through 20 psi from a turbo on the 4.6L DOHC in a Mustang Cobra, and see where we stand.

Rice is not who drives Toyota or Ford or Chev or Honda.

RICE IS AN ATTITUDE



and most ricers drive imports :)

Thanks guys for the compliments. :)

On a side note: How did this thread come to this? Maybe because of kystang86's statement. But folks, we are talking about ricers here. Not imports, ricers . There is a difference. A ricer can drive anything, even cattle. Let's keep with the subject shall we.

Exactly!

That was sort of what I was getting at as well... big indeed is ideal... but not "often better" anymore. You can see that within your own production line. But the fact remains that while comparing across lines, you don't find an import racecar with such huge displacements because they achieve the same power through other techniques with smaller displacements... Lexus IS300, Supra TT (both 3.0L I6 engines), Nissan Skyline (I think an I6 engine), Porsche (2.x - 3.x L I6?) None of those cars come close to domestic musclecar displacements, yet most of them are faster stock.

Moving away from stock, its all a matter of who has deeper pockets. But here's a point to note: It is generally cheaper to mod a Mustang, however boosting a Supra TT to 20psi costs almost nothing... putting a 20 psi turbo kit on a 4.6L Mustang will cost you a whole lot more... win/win for Supra there... power as well as cost.

Exactly! That was all I wanted people to realize... and to quit making blanket statements about "all imports." I personally have been a big fan of the Trans Am for years, until I actually test drove one... power was definetly there, but it was a piece of **** that I wouldn't even buy if someone offered me a brand new one at half price.

Imports still stand lightyears ahead in terms of quality although I will admit that domestic cars are quickly narrowing the gap; some with the help of Germany. But still no cigar.

That was my point... they were stereotyping all imports to be ricers... never mentioned the truly fast ones that AREN'T glittery and all stickered up.

Here I COMPLETELY AGREE with you. If someone intention is to build a fast car, why not start with a fast car that is meant to be built up that way. Hence, there are a lot of imports to respect just as much as Mustangs, Camaros and Firebirds.

However, one thing to keep in mind is that if someone was in the market for a car with $x, they could either spend $x on a non-sporty import and $y on mods to make that import fast. This $x+y amount could get quite high. I am sure that they have the sense to realize that they would have been able to take that initial $x and buy a foxbody Mustang, and mod it up to a 12 sec car and probably still have money left over from $x. But why didn't they do that? The answer is because they also want quality. I'm sure that majority of you guys who mod a real race Mustang, also drive a second car as a daily driver, like a Ford minivan or something. :D But first and foremost I think the reason is quality, luxury and reliability.

I am confident (many people would disagree with me here) that the newer versions of domestic cars will probabably last as long as any import and be just as trouble free. But to date, no domestic has shown those traits yet, so imports will still be up ahead as far as having all the qualities of reliability and power potential... maybe not as powerful as a bare bones Mustang + $5000 in mods, but they feel that a little more money spent in mods, is worth the extra quality that they get overall.

need to know...
 

would u guys consider me a ricer if i modded my 93 toyota pickup? i mean a turbo, exhaust, and maybe lower it a little with 17's. ilove toyotas. i have 3 toy trucks. they are great trucks! now for those that dont know much about toyota trucks, i will tell you that from the factory, they put turbos in them. so i wouldnt be going the extra mile if i had a turbo engine under the hood. im not talking ground scraping, butt-booming, fart can sounding Japanese truck, but a little toy with some ponies under the hood. and yes, i thought of dropping a 5.0 motor in it!!

Re: need to know...
 

A properly modded car, no matter what kind of car it is, is definetly not rice.

What kind of pickup do you have? I think I can lend you a hand with some ideas there.

And yes, dropping a 5.0 motor in it would be quite nice, if you can figure out a way to work the engine mounts and brackets... a fair bit of labour involved I'd say. But there are good Toyota engines you could put in there to give you what you are looking for. I need to know what type of truck you got though.

its a regular cab 2wd. i put 4x4 fenders on it and got it repainted. i know alot about toyota trucks. i have done alot of research on them. advance adapters make the mounts for the Ford 5.0. the hardest part would be the exhaust. i have seen it done. thanks speed.

No problem man.

As far as engine, another option you should consider is the Toyota 3S-GTE engine. Its only a 2.0L I4, but its a turbo. There are Supra Twin Turbos in Japan who rally race, that swap out their engines for this one because it is lighter and the boost is adjustable just as easily if not easier. It is an iron block so it is quite rock solid. Mid 20lbs boost is just a 30 sec, free mod. :) There are slightly modded 3S-GTEs that are upwards of 500 HP. Some of the more heavily modded ones are as high as 800 HP, but I doubt you'd need anything that strong.

I'm not too familiar with Toyota trucks... what model is your truck?

it is just a 2wd toy pickup. has the 22re motor. what else do you want to know?

Oh 22re. I think I have a mental pic of the truck now. They are relatively light aren't they? You should be able to surprise a few people after putting a bit of power under the hood.

Go custom for exhaust. It doesn't take a good shop much to blueprint your exhaust system and design a custom cat-back at least, for you... straight pipe and mandrel bent around the corners.

srv1 and speedemn, not to interupt but srv1 you mentioned your modded truck. and the "rice version" you described fits perfectly with the high school driven, brightly painted, clear markered, loud sound systemed light pickups that are getting more and more common in my area. this not only is annoying but disturbing.

i knew a guy from indiana who knows more about engines (his specialty was chevy) who had a truck he's been messin with for a couple of years, getting parts from the autoparts shop he works at and junk yards here and there. i heard him describe it and it sounded like he had done some heavy stuff to it. i kept wondering how he got that big an engine into what sounded like a very small engine compartment. but when he drove it to a ball tournament recently in indiana, i saw first hand what a modded light mid-sized pickup is supposed to look and sound like. bright yellow, performance tires, what looked like 3" or 4" dual exhuast making a sound i only dream my '94 GT will sound like one day. and to top it off inside he had two bucket seats from a Corvette!! he has since tubbed the back end and added bigger tires. it looked mean and fast yet very classy and not overdone.

just thought i'd share my experience on how i was shown first hand that just because something other than a sports car is fast, doesn't mean i shouldn't give it serious props and respect. anyone can make anything go fast. it's just depends on $$$ and free time. not to mention a large amount of determination.

heheh Tod, we don't really see many modded trucks here in Canada... at least I haven't crossed paths with that group yet... but I bet the SVT Lightning sounds pretty sweet too. I saw an mpeg of the 2001 and wow I was blown away... sounded even better with my sub turned up! haha

I agree with you, but I feel that dumping a lot of money into a high performance car is not a wise investment, and you will never get your money back out of it. So, this is why I choose to mod a car like the mustang, because they are cheap and easy.(and also im a ford man)
However, if you have deep pocket books, theres nothing wrong with modding a nice jap car if you do it right,

A guy I work with has a 300zx and he must have $30,000 in mods in the car. the car is sweet and very fast, however I think he took a secong mortgage on his house to do it. Not the best money management ....:)