Military people - Page 2

MEDIK418 · 11-13-2002, 09:28 AM

I would like to offer some fact and some opinion to this discussion. First, Vietnam was never a war, it was a police action. Very few actual major asaults took place but those that did were considered successful. The people who "lost" vietnam were the members of congress who used it to further their own careers at the expense of the people doing the fighting.

As for Impressed armies, WW1, WW2, Korea and every skirmish through the early 70's were all fought with conscripted armies and the last time I checked we won all of them.

THe draft is not in effect but I don't think a war will rage for two years before somebody starts thinking draft. consider this, if we lose 30-50 percent of our ground soldiers in Iraq (as some so- called "prophets" are telling us) that will net the military a loss of about 60-100,000 men (based on the 200-250,000 troop commitment Bush talks about) Drop that many from a military who is already seeing a drop in volunteers and you might make congress a little antsy. The military machine in Washington will begin to scream long before congress will allow that there's a problem simply because it takes so long to get anything done in this arena.

In the past, you became draft age at 19. You had to register at 18, but to my knowledge, no 18 year olds were drafted knowingly.

I hope and pray that this mess is over quickly and Dipstick hoosayne gets to see how stupid he really is but it may well be a long drawn out affair if we have to go house to house to root out everyone who needs lead enemas. I'd say your litle brother is no closer to being drafted now than he was 5 years ago but let's hope it don't change next year.
FYI. . . .if I were draft age and it started, I wouldn't wait till they had me in the lottery before I joined a branch that was a smidge safer if I was prone to lead poisoning or hives from battle induced stress.

For those of you who are still in school, when you take the asvab tests. . . don't blow the thing. The higher you make on that, the more likely you are to not have to be married to a rifle if you are drafted.

thdrcat · 11-13-2002, 12:27 PM

well put. Believe it or not i agree with you 100%. The way all the vets i have spoken with explain it is: Its hard to fight when the politicians tie 2 hands behind your back and take your steel toed boots away.

about the draft... you can not tell me that a soldier that wanted to be there, wants to help is not superior to a soldier that was pulled from what he was doing in his civilian life and considers the military to be a waste of his time / life. to better show my feeling on the subject, i rephrase my statement to: "impressed armies do not fight AS WELL" (granted there are 1,000,000 other factors like leadership, supply, location, etc.)

69fastback · 11-13-2002, 01:40 PM

Well just getting back form kuwait It is really intresting on how things are going over there. I would have rathered stayed there just cuz i know i will be turning around and going right back there to have some fun. The unit I am in impressed alot of guys with stars on there collars which everyone in my unit is very proud of. I was there when the marines got attacked and other stuff happened that wasn't on the news and this was all by kuwait activits and not iraq. I don't beleive it will be a war like last time it is going to be alot more ground forces. The Army is going to be the one doing most of the work this time not the airforce. the only way to go get saddam is through ground forces. Hell i am just a sergent and I know that. The only part that bothers me is he might use chemical weapons that is the only thing that would slow us down. If he does though i hope bush has the balls to nuke his ***.

eric dont worry about the draft there are enough of us active army guys to get the job done. They are just going to send all us active guys over there and then make all the reserve and national gaurd guys take care of the homeland.

1989gt. Dude I wouldn't count on being in the us for six months if i was you. I was only in the us for 2 months when i got back to korea before i went to kuwait. I just got back form kuwait 2 weeks ago and can go back any day. I know they tell you about all that stabilazation crap but it doesn't apply. I have barley been in the us for about 2 months in the last 2 years. Where where you at in korea i was stationed on top of a mountian outside of camp casey in 2 ID. Now i am a part of the 1st armord div out of ft. riley kansas.

PKRWUD · 11-13-2002, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 69fastback
1989gt. Dude I wouldn't count on being in the us for six months if i was you. I was only in the us for 2 months when i got back to korea before i went to kuwait. I just got back form kuwait 2 weeks ago and can go back any day. I know they tell you about all that stabilazation crap but it doesn't apply. I have barley been in the us for about 2 months in the last 2 years. Where where you at in korea i was stationed on top of a mountian outside of camp casey in 2 ID. Now i am a part of the 1st armord div out of ft. riley kansas.

And to you I also say Welcome Back, and Thanks!

Take care,
~Chris

302 LX Eric · 11-13-2002, 04:56 PM

To those of you who have served in our Armed Forces and to those who are currently serving: Thank you and God Bless.

As a 27 year-old husband and a father, it would be tough to leave my wife and son behind. But, I would go join whichever branch of military that needed me. I would take great pride in it and be there for my country anytime, anyplace.

E

HotRoddin · 11-13-2002, 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by thdrcat
about the draft... you can not tell me that a soldier that wanted to be there, wants to help is not superior to a soldier that was pulled from what he was doing in his civilian life and considers the military to be a waste of his time / life.

Maybe so if you're looking at the overall picture Robbie but as far as battle worthyness goes ... Look at the battle of Idrang Valley, 400 U.S. soldiers 2000 North Vietnamese Army, highly trained and well equiped. I defy anyone to find a unit of men that has ever in the history of warfare fought with more valor and tenacity in any war in any conflict in any place at any time.
Once you get on the battlefield and the sh** hits the fan it doesn't matter why you're there, it only matters what you have inside.
As far as the draft thing goes, I find it hard to believe that we don't seem to be able to track history even 10 years back. We went to Iraq and their "elite" Republican Guard surrendered faster than we could find places to put them. They didn't have what it takes inside, they still don't. The big question is do we? I know our soldiers do but the big question mark is can we as a people get mean enough and ugly enough and nasty enough to do what it takes to win a conflict like that ? If we can't then we could just endlessly send soldiers into battle after battle. Then it could stretch out so long that they might have to institute the draft again. If we roll through there like Rommel it could be over rather quickly. If we approach it like Viet Nam, me and a couple of the other old geezers may be the only ones left here to post

PKRWUD · 11-14-2002, 12:49 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by HotRoddin
If we approach it like Viet Nam, me and a couple of the other old geezers may be the only ones left here to post

I like to think that the term "Old Geezers" is subjective.

Take care,
~Chris

thdrcat · 11-14-2002, 02:19 AM

aye....

1989GT · 11-14-2002, 04:47 AM

Hey 69fastback I'm at camp page. (17 days now!) Also 2 ID B co 1/2 avn(atk). Yeah I know that stabilization is a bunch of ****. I'm either going to 1st or 2nd bat at campbell and I'm not sure which one is going to kuwait first but they won't send them at the same time. So depending on where I go there could be a couple of months before I go. All I'm looking for is 2 months so I can se my little girl be born.

Yeah man chemicals is all I worry about. Can you say MOPP 4? That would suck bad! So anyway man what do you do? I'm an AH-64D apache longbow crewchief.

Mach 1 · 11-14-2002, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by HotRoddin
Once you get on the battlefield and the sh** hits the fan it doesn't matter why you're there, it only matters what you have inside.

Thats exactly right. There are plenty of "incapable morons" who join the military and remain, just like any other profession has good and bad people.

You very well could have a super sniper or something that was never in the military in his life, but put in that situation, he could waste 15 enemys compared to the "trained" soldier only taking out a couple.

MEDIK418 · 11-15-2002, 10:31 AM

On the question posed concerning our ability to get down and nasty if the odds suddenly shift the other way, I refer you to Mogadishu, Somalia. A hundred or so rangers who had absolutely no combat experience. . . . .5000 somalis with guns. That wasn't so much a demonstration of US military superiority as it was a testament to the American spirit and the will to survive. I think we have what it takes. I just hope the folks back home have what it takes to continue supporting these boys when they start dropping. You guys who are active duty, Godspeed and good luck. . . my prayers are with you.

The Deuce · 11-15-2002, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 69fastback
Well just getting back form kuwait It is really intresting on how things are going over there. I would have rathered stayed there just cuz i know i will be turning around and going right back there to have some fun. The unit I am in impressed alot of guys with stars on there collars which everyone in my unit is very proud of. I was there when the marines got attacked and other stuff happened that wasn't on the news and this was all by kuwait activits and not iraq. I don't beleive it will be a war like last time it is going to be alot more ground forces. The Army is going to be the one doing most of the work this time not the airforce. the only way to go get saddam is through ground forces. Hell i am just a sergent and I know that. The only part that bothers me is he might use chemical weapons that is the only thing that would slow us down. If he does though i hope bush has the balls to nuke his ***.

eric dont worry about the draft there are enough of us active army guys to get the job done. They are just going to send all us active guys over there and then make all the reserve and national gaurd guys take care of the homeland.

1989gt. Dude I wouldn't count on being in the us for six months if i was you. I was only in the us for 2 months when i got back to korea before i went to kuwait. I just got back form kuwait 2 weeks ago and can go back any day. I know they tell you about all that stabilazation crap but it doesn't apply. I have barley been in the us for about 2 months in the last 2 years. Where where you at in korea i was stationed on top of a mountian outside of camp casey in 2 ID. Now i am a part of the 1st armord div out of ft. riley kansas.

WELCOME HOME Its about dang time they let you back in the states. If you come west for christmas, hit me up, we'll get you good and drunk, on the So Cal MW contingent.

69fastback · 11-15-2002, 09:25 PM

89gt- Best of luck to you when you go over there. It is not very fun. Good thing you are not there in the summer time though. We literally had a 130 to a 150 dagree weather about 135 was the average. That doesn't even count when the wind picks up. Yuck!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! the one advantage is all the tax free money i was getting an extra 600 a month over there. I got a good budyy that is over in the 101st right now not sure what unit though. Right now i am in 1-41 inf. I am a communications guy. 31U. I enjoy it most of the time just if the commanders can't talk to each other it really hits the fan and i never hear the end of it and when they can never hear anything good. Kind of a thankless job but i enjoy it after a while the butt chewings just roll of your back LOL.

Duce. I wish i was going to be able to come out west for some beers but it wont happen anytime soon. They are keeping us around just encase Iraq gets all riled up. Then i will be shooting back over there. But hopefully i will be out there this summer if the offer still stands.

The Deuce · 11-15-2002, 11:12 PM

69fastback,
As long as I'm out here, the offer is valid. By the summer I may even have a second Mustang in the stable. Just something to keep in mind.

11-13-2002, 09:28 AM	#1
MEDIK418 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 1999 Location: Amarillo, Texas, USA Posts: 780	I would like to offer some fact and some opinion to this discussion. First, Vietnam was never a war, it was a police action. Very few actual major asaults took place but those that did were considered successful. The people who "lost" vietnam were the members of congress who used it to further their own careers at the expense of the people doing the fighting. As for Impressed armies, WW1, WW2, Korea and every skirmish through the early 70's were all fought with conscripted armies and the last time I checked we won all of them. THe draft is not in effect but I don't think a war will rage for two years before somebody starts thinking draft. consider this, if we lose 30-50 percent of our ground soldiers in Iraq (as some so- called "prophets" are telling us) that will net the military a loss of about 60-100,000 men (based on the 200-250,000 troop commitment Bush talks about) Drop that many from a military who is already seeing a drop in volunteers and you might make congress a little antsy. The military machine in Washington will begin to scream long before congress will allow that there's a problem simply because it takes so long to get anything done in this arena. In the past, you became draft age at 19. You had to register at 18, but to my knowledge, no 18 year olds were drafted knowingly. I hope and pray that this mess is over quickly and Dipstick hoosayne gets to see how stupid he really is but it may well be a long drawn out affair if we have to go house to house to root out everyone who needs lead enemas. I'd say your litle brother is no closer to being drafted now than he was 5 years ago but let's hope it don't change next year. FYI. . . .if I were draft age and it started, I wouldn't wait till they had me in the lottery before I joined a branch that was a smidge safer if I was prone to lead poisoning or hives from battle induced stress. For those of you who are still in school, when you take the asvab tests. . . don't blow the thing. The higher you make on that, the more likely you are to not have to be married to a rifle if you are drafted. __________________ 1986 four-eyed LX coupe, 358 Cleveland, Tremec TKO600/centerforce clutch, dish cut Probe forged pistons, comp cams hyd.roller cam, .579/.588@224/230, Edel.performer, 670 holley street avenger, CPR custom built long tubes, ported and polished 4bbl heads, manley valves, beehive springs, MSD peo-billet dist/MSD6AL, fluidamper, 5 lug conv. with 17x8 bullits there's more but it's still not finished yet. Oh, and the oldest boy is turning his 89 GT into a FFR cobra this next summer.

11-13-2002, 12:27 PM	#2
thdrcat Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 100	well put. Believe it or not i agree with you 100%. The way all the vets i have spoken with explain it is: Its hard to fight when the politicians tie 2 hands behind your back and take your steel toed boots away. about the draft... you can not tell me that a soldier that wanted to be there, wants to help is not superior to a soldier that was pulled from what he was doing in his civilian life and considers the military to be a waste of his time / life. to better show my feeling on the subject, i rephrase my statement to: "impressed armies do not fight AS WELL" (granted there are 1,000,000 other factors like leadership, supply, location, etc.) Last edited by thdrcat; 11-13-2002 at 12:34 PM..

11-13-2002, 04:56 PM	#5
302 LX Eric or '331 LX Eric' Join Date: Jan 1999 Location: Columbus, Ohio Posts: 2,142	To those of you who have served in our Armed Forces and to those who are currently serving: Thank you and God Bless. As a 27 year-old husband and a father, it would be tough to leave my wife and son behind. But, I would go join whichever branch of military that needed me. I would take great pride in it and be there for my country anytime, anyplace. E __________________ 1991 5.0 LX Coupe - 40,750 miles 331 cu. in. / Tremec 3550 / BFG Drag Radials 12.22 @ 114.31 mph - w/1.89 60'

11-14-2002, 04:47 AM	#9
1989GT Registered Member Join Date: Apr 1999 Location: Cincinnati,OH Posts: 1,511	Hey 69fastback I'm at camp page. (17 days now!) Also 2 ID B co 1/2 avn(atk). Yeah I know that stabilization is a bunch of **. I'm either going to 1st or 2nd bat at campbell and I'm not sure which one is going to kuwait first but they won't send them at the same time. So depending on where I go there could be a couple of months before I go. All I'm looking for is 2 months so I can se my little girl be born. Yeah man chemicals is all I worry about. Can you say MOPP 4? That would suck bad! So anyway man what do you do? I'm an AH-64D apache longbow crewchief. __________________ 89GT,Pro-Bullet 306, H/C/I and a bunch of other stuff. Sold** 00GT, Vortech S-Trim, Steeda Boost Pipe, C&L intake, Mac off-road H-pipe, Flowmasters, B&M Ripper shifter, Eibach Sportline springs, Koni Struts/shocks, MM full length subframe connectors, Cobra brakes, 3.73's. My Car Domain Page

11-15-2002, 10:31 AM	#11
MEDIK418 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 1999 Location: Amarillo, Texas, USA Posts: 780	On the question posed concerning our ability to get down and nasty if the odds suddenly shift the other way, I refer you to Mogadishu, Somalia. A hundred or so rangers who had absolutely no combat experience. . . . .5000 somalis with guns. That wasn't so much a demonstration of US military superiority as it was a testament to the American spirit and the will to survive. I think we have what it takes. I just hope the folks back home have what it takes to continue supporting these boys when they start dropping. You guys who are active duty, Godspeed and good luck. . . my prayers are with you. __________________ 1986 four-eyed LX coupe, 358 Cleveland, Tremec TKO600/centerforce clutch, dish cut Probe forged pistons, comp cams hyd.roller cam, .579/.588@224/230, Edel.performer, 670 holley street avenger, CPR custom built long tubes, ported and polished 4bbl heads, manley valves, beehive springs, MSD peo-billet dist/MSD6AL, fluidamper, 5 lug conv. with 17x8 bullits there's more but it's still not finished yet. Oh, and the oldest boy is turning his 89 GT into a FFR cobra this next summer.

11-13-2002, 01:40 PM	#3
69fastback IRAQ VET Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: high desert California Posts: 1,480	Well just getting back form kuwait It is really intresting on how things are going over there. I would have rathered stayed there just cuz i know i will be turning around and going right back there to have some fun. The unit I am in impressed alot of guys with stars on there collars which everyone in my unit is very proud of. I was there when the marines got attacked and other stuff happened that wasn't on the news and this was all by kuwait activits and not iraq. I don't beleive it will be a war like last time it is going to be alot more ground forces. The Army is going to be the one doing most of the work this time not the airforce. the only way to go get saddam is through ground forces. Hell i am just a sergent and I know that. The only part that bothers me is he might use chemical weapons that is the only thing that would slow us down. If he does though i hope bush has the balls to nuke his ***. eric dont worry about the draft there are enough of us active army guys to get the job done. They are just going to send all us active guys over there and then make all the reserve and national gaurd guys take care of the homeland. 1989gt. Dude I wouldn't count on being in the us for six months if i was you. I was only in the us for 2 months when i got back to korea before i went to kuwait. I just got back form kuwait 2 weeks ago and can go back any day. I know they tell you about all that stabilazation crap but it doesn't apply. I have barley been in the us for about 2 months in the last 2 years. Where where you at in korea i was stationed on top of a mountian outside of camp casey in 2 ID. Now i am a part of the 1st armord div out of ft. riley kansas.

11-14-2002, 02:19 AM	#8
thdrcat Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 100	aye....

11-15-2002, 09:25 PM	#13
69fastback IRAQ VET Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: high desert California Posts: 1,480	89gt- Best of luck to you when you go over there. It is not very fun. Good thing you are not there in the summer time though. We literally had a 130 to a 150 dagree weather about 135 was the average. That doesn't even count when the wind picks up. Yuck!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! the one advantage is all the tax free money i was getting an extra 600 a month over there. I got a good budyy that is over in the 101st right now not sure what unit though. Right now i am in 1-41 inf. I am a communications guy. 31U. I enjoy it most of the time just if the commanders can't talk to each other it really hits the fan and i never hear the end of it and when they can never hear anything good. Kind of a thankless job but i enjoy it after a while the butt chewings just roll of your back LOL. Duce. I wish i was going to be able to come out west for some beers but it wont happen anytime soon. They are keeping us around just encase Iraq gets all riled up. Then i will be shooting back over there. But hopefully i will be out there this summer if the offer still stands.

11-15-2002, 11:12 PM	#14
The Deuce Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 2,325	69fastback, As long as I'm out here, the offer is valid. By the summer I may even have a second Mustang in the stable. Just something to keep in mind. __________________ 1997 Mustang GT "The Freak" - 13.80 @ 101.70, 2.07 60' 1995 Honda VFR750 - not much @ really fast (actual data pending.) 1964.5 Mustang 289 Rice Haters Club Member #13

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Life	bigwhitecobra	Blue Oval Lounge	41	06-10-2004 10:29 PM
Some people need to learn a greater respect for America, this is worth reading	Patriot	Blue Oval Lounge	11	04-09-2003 01:25 PM
Why do people like mustangs?	CactusHugger11	Modular Madness	40	02-07-2002 10:37 PM