3.27 - 4.10 Gearing ???

JBeryleC · 03-17-2004, 04:09 PM

question....

Seems as though everyone agrees that if your gonna do gears then dont waste time with anything numberically less than 4.10's

The question is this...

My '02 GT is bone stock, and 1st gear only last a couple seconds as it is. With 3.27 (stock) gears I believe.

So.. um.. with 4.10's do you not even use 1st gear or what??

I couldnt imagine having an even lower 1st or 2nd gear, doesnt that render them unusable?

seems like changing out 3rd 4th & 5th to a lower ratio (numerically higher) might be a better option. No?
It's a cost thing, I know that... rebuilding a tranny is way more expensive than gearing a rearend. But if someone has the money, why not?

Opinions???

xxxBlakexxx · 03-17-2004, 09:30 PM

I am going to try to take a stab at this. I hope I am not F-ed up.

With a higher gear ratio, 1st gear will run out sooner as you implied. But, keep this in mind. The difference should be less noticeable at the lower gears because the change is just a percentage.

If with 3.23's you must shift at say 35 mph, with 4.10's it might be 32 mph. The difference is much more at the higher gears. I don't have 4.10's, so this is just an educated guess on the speed.

Also, cars with mods can generally rev a little higher as the car pulls better and rev limiters get raised. This will close the gap on the shift point.

Changing indivudual gears (and this is just a guess) I think would screw everything up. If you shift properly with the stock tranny, you should hit each gear in the power band perfectly, right?

JBeryleC · 03-18-2004, 01:10 AM

Well heres the deal...

We all know that we have PLENTY of pull in 1st and 2nd, even 3rd... stock!

BUT 4th & 5th have NO pull at all in low RPMS

My goal is to get those gears to have as much power at low RPM's as 1st 2nd & 3rd have.

I dont think you can achieve with with gearing lower (numerically higher) Because you'd be just raising the RPM's throughout the the whole tranny.

I dont want to have a half second 1st gear, ya know?

I think my only option is to cam the motor and build it up more to get more power overall. But LOW rpm torque is what I'm after, NOT high rpm power... we all know the GT has plenty of pull between 2800 and 3000 rpms...

I want more in the 1000-2800 range
A cam and bolt on's will do that

blue00gt · 03-18-2004, 08:55 PM

Actually, in 1st and 2nd gear is where you gain most of the time in the 1/4 mile by changing gears. It's all about getting the motor in the powerband faster.
As for the example that was posted, if you top out at 35mph in 1st with stock 3.27 gears, you would top out at 28mph with 4.10s (just divide 3.27 by 4.10 and multiply by the speed).
Gears don't change the powerband of the motor, they are just torque multiplication. If you want it to pull more in the lower revs you need to change parts on the engine. Even with steeper gears if you are lugging it at low rpms it's still going to feel slow. The point of the gears is to get your rpms up.
If you want your car to pull more at low rpms you should give up and put a stock 5.0 in it. Mod motors don't really start to pull until near 4k. If you re-cammed your motor to make more power down low you'll just lose top end and end up with a slower car. Sounds like you want a truck or luxury car type motor.

JBeryleC · 03-18-2004, 09:07 PM

caming it right will give more power all through the rpm range. Gaining low end tq while not losing any highend hp.

Thats the goal

Might just have to go with a twin screw sc.
which would require either a '03+ cobra front k member & suspension or a tall azz hood. lol

We'll see... which ever is cheaper and will give me what I want.

91LX2Bfast · 03-18-2004, 10:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JBeryleC
...Might just have to go with a twin screw sc.
which would require either a '03+ cobra front k member & suspension or a tall azz hood....

Someone passed you some bad info. You can bolt-on a Kenne Bell twin screw or any other blower kit for that matter without replacing the K member or hood.

JBeryleC · 03-18-2004, 10:17 PM

theres not enough clearence there...

the cobra k member is needed to lower the entire engine
or a taller hood to clear the sc

91LX2Bfast · 03-18-2004, 10:30 PM

What setup are you referring to?

Straight from Kenne Bell site: "Direct bolt on replacement. Connects to stock inlet system. Looks factory. Mounts on top of engine. Fits under stock hood."

JBeryleC · 03-18-2004, 10:46 PM

I just checked it out. WOW. I had no idea. I was given wrong info.

Thank you much for clearing that up

xxxBlakexxx · 03-18-2004, 11:25 PM

Blue: Thanks fo r the speed correction.

explicitone · 03-19-2004, 02:03 AM

4.10s do not still feel slow down low they help get off the line at 1000 or 6000 I can cruise in 5th gear @30(1200) and still pull 5th all the way to what ever with out ever needing to down shift.

yes you can still use 1st and 2nd yes the car will go through these gears faster the same with 3rd and 4th

at time when I dont feel like shifting I will start in 2nd and then shift to 4th and then to 5th no lag at all

it might be that you have a 70mm t/b with the stock plenum is know by almost everybody that it has no gain and will cause you to lose power down low and mid range and jba headers which show no gains at all on a non supercharged car the only thing they do is drain your wallet(blue00gt)

wanted to clear up somethings so all this bad info does not keep getting passed on to other newbes

OH and the k/b twin is made for the 2v motors so the is no need to change the k-member or the hood the only power adder ment for the street that these things might need to be changed is some tubro setups

JBeryleC · 03-19-2004, 02:32 AM

Well first gear doesnt last long enough for me already, stock. So I wont be doing gears.

I'll just build up the motor to get the lowend I want.

Thanks for all the info

explicitone · 03-19-2004, 02:38 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by JBeryleC
Well first gear doesnt last long enough for me already, stock. So I wont be doing gears.

I'll just build up the motor to get the lowend I want.

Thanks for all the info

to bad that you live in ca. cause if you lived closer then I would love to take you for a ride and I know you would change your mind

gears are the best bang for the buck mod for any mustang

JBeryleC · 03-19-2004, 02:50 AM

Yeah I know all about gears... remember I have the big truck..

went from stock 3.53 gears to 4.10 then to 4.56

Amazing results, but that was on a Jet Performance E4OD tranny

I dont wanna gear the stang like that because I hate how fast 1st gear is over... it's a daily driver.

maybe if it was just for the track then yeah I'd do it.

has nothing to do with gas mileage, its just that I want longer lasting 1st gear

explicitone · 03-19-2004, 02:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by JBeryleC
Yeah I know all about gears... remember I have the big truck..

went from stock 3.53 gears to 4.10 then to 4.56

Amazing results, but that was on a Jet Performance E4OD tranny

I dont wanna gear the stang like that because I hate how fast 1st gear is over... it's a daily driver.

maybe if it was just for the track then yeah I'd do it.

has nothing to do with gas mileage, its just that I want longer lasting 1st gear

thats cool

to each there own

03-17-2004, 04:09 PM	#1 (permalink)
JBeryleC Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Sebastopol CA Posts: 169	3.27 - 4.10 Gearing ??? question.... Seems as though everyone agrees that if your gonna do gears then dont waste time with anything numberically less than 4.10's The question is this... My '02 GT is bone stock, and 1st gear only last a couple seconds as it is. With 3.27 (stock) gears I believe. So.. um.. with 4.10's do you not even use 1st gear or what?? I couldnt imagine having an even lower 1st or 2nd gear, doesnt that render them unusable? seems like changing out 3rd 4th & 5th to a lower ratio (numerically higher) might be a better option. No? It's a cost thing, I know that... rebuilding a tranny is way more expensive than gearing a rearend. But if someone has the money, why not? Opinions??? __________________ Torch Red '02 GT Convertible 5 spd BBK long tubes, BBK h-pipe, MAC mufflers, K&N w/ silencer trimmed, FRPP 70mm throttle body, C&L plenum, Mobil1 synthetic fluids, FRPP aluminum drive shaft, Steeda Tri-Ax shifter, FRPP 4.10's, 18x9 & 18x10 Saleens with Dunlop SP Super Sport Race rubber, Mach1 grill (GT delete), & Mach1 bumper chin! Click here for pictures & more info! If you are in Northern California, check out North Bay Mustang Club for local meets and cruises!

03-17-2004, 09:30 PM	#2 (permalink)
xxxBlakexxx Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Mountaintop, PA Posts: 634	I am going to try to take a stab at this. I hope I am not F-ed up. With a higher gear ratio, 1st gear will run out sooner as you implied. But, keep this in mind. The difference should be less noticeable at the lower gears because the change is just a percentage. If with 3.23's you must shift at say 35 mph, with 4.10's it might be 32 mph. The difference is much more at the higher gears. I don't have 4.10's, so this is just an educated guess on the speed. Also, cars with mods can generally rev a little higher as the car pulls better and rev limiters get raised. This will close the gap on the shift point. Changing indivudual gears (and this is just a guess) I think would screw everything up. If you shift properly with the stock tranny, you should hit each gear in the power band perfectly, right? __________________ "Children should not get cancer, but they do!" Help a child with cancer at www.homeoftheirown.org My Stang: 2000 Mustang GT Vert - Steeda Tri-Ax Shifter; C&L Plenum; BBK 75 mm TB; Steeda Strut Tower Supports; Black "Deep Dish" Bullet Wheels; FRPP 4.10's; Steeda Subframes; SLP Catback & SLP Catted X-Pipe; SCT 4 Position Chip with 3 custom tunes; Steeda CAI; Venom-1000 Nitrous; Roush Stage 3 Body Kit; Bullet Suspension Package (on the way)

03-18-2004, 01:10 AM	#3 (permalink)
JBeryleC Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Sebastopol CA Posts: 169	Well heres the deal... We all know that we have PLENTY of pull in 1st and 2nd, even 3rd... stock! BUT 4th & 5th have NO pull at all in low RPMS My goal is to get those gears to have as much power at low RPM's as 1st 2nd & 3rd have. I dont think you can achieve with with gearing lower (numerically higher) Because you'd be just raising the RPM's throughout the the whole tranny. I dont want to have a half second 1st gear, ya know? I think my only option is to cam the motor and build it up more to get more power overall. But LOW rpm torque is what I'm after, NOT high rpm power... we all know the GT has plenty of pull between 2800 and 3000 rpms... I want more in the 1000-2800 range A cam and bolt on's will do that __________________ Torch Red '02 GT Convertible 5 spd BBK long tubes, BBK h-pipe, MAC mufflers, K&N w/ silencer trimmed, FRPP 70mm throttle body, C&L plenum, Mobil1 synthetic fluids, FRPP aluminum drive shaft, Steeda Tri-Ax shifter, FRPP 4.10's, 18x9 & 18x10 Saleens with Dunlop SP Super Sport Race rubber, Mach1 grill (GT delete), & Mach1 bumper chin! Click here for pictures & more info! If you are in Northern California, check out North Bay Mustang Club for local meets and cruises!

03-18-2004, 08:55 PM	#4 (permalink)
blue00gt Mustang Addict Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: McKinney, TX Posts: 1,294	Actually, in 1st and 2nd gear is where you gain most of the time in the 1/4 mile by changing gears. It's all about getting the motor in the powerband faster. As for the example that was posted, if you top out at 35mph in 1st with stock 3.27 gears, you would top out at 28mph with 4.10s (just divide 3.27 by 4.10 and multiply by the speed). Gears don't change the powerband of the motor, they are just torque multiplication. If you want it to pull more in the lower revs you need to change parts on the engine. Even with steeper gears if you are lugging it at low rpms it's still going to feel slow. The point of the gears is to get your rpms up. If you want your car to pull more at low rpms you should give up and put a stock 5.0 in it. Mod motors don't really start to pull until near 4k. If you re-cammed your motor to make more power down low you'll just lose top end and end up with a slower car. Sounds like you want a truck or luxury car type motor. __________________ Strike down the unroadworthy! 2000 GT Atl. Blue: '03 Cobra motor - 465rwhp/473rwtq, T-56 6-speed, full MM TA/PH & tubular K-member suspension, Saleen body, 17" Torq-Thrust II's, M/T ET Street radials, and lots more '94 Rio Red Cobra: All the bolt-ons, 3.73s

03-18-2004, 09:07 PM	#5 (permalink)
JBeryleC Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Sebastopol CA Posts: 169	caming it right will give more power all through the rpm range. Gaining low end tq while not losing any highend hp. Thats the goal Might just have to go with a twin screw sc. which would require either a '03+ cobra front k member & suspension or a tall azz hood. lol We'll see... which ever is cheaper and will give me what I want. __________________ Torch Red '02 GT Convertible 5 spd BBK long tubes, BBK h-pipe, MAC mufflers, K&N w/ silencer trimmed, FRPP 70mm throttle body, C&L plenum, Mobil1 synthetic fluids, FRPP aluminum drive shaft, Steeda Tri-Ax shifter, FRPP 4.10's, 18x9 & 18x10 Saleens with Dunlop SP Super Sport Race rubber, Mach1 grill (GT delete), & Mach1 bumper chin! Click here for pictures & more info! If you are in Northern California, check out North Bay Mustang Club for local meets and cruises!

03-18-2004, 10:17 PM	#7 (permalink)
JBeryleC Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Sebastopol CA Posts: 169	theres not enough clearence there... the cobra k member is needed to lower the entire engine or a taller hood to clear the sc __________________ Torch Red '02 GT Convertible 5 spd BBK long tubes, BBK h-pipe, MAC mufflers, K&N w/ silencer trimmed, FRPP 70mm throttle body, C&L plenum, Mobil1 synthetic fluids, FRPP aluminum drive shaft, Steeda Tri-Ax shifter, FRPP 4.10's, 18x9 & 18x10 Saleens with Dunlop SP Super Sport Race rubber, Mach1 grill (GT delete), & Mach1 bumper chin! Click here for pictures & more info! If you are in Northern California, check out North Bay Mustang Club for local meets and cruises!

03-18-2004, 10:30 PM	#8 (permalink)
91LX2Bfast Registered Member Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Warrington, PA Posts: 694	What setup are you referring to? Straight from Kenne Bell site: "Direct bolt on replacement. Connects to stock inlet system. Looks factory. Mounts on top of engine. Fits under stock hood."

03-18-2004, 10:46 PM	#9 (permalink)
JBeryleC Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Sebastopol CA Posts: 169	I just checked it out. WOW. I had no idea. I was given wrong info. Thank you much for clearing that up __________________ Torch Red '02 GT Convertible 5 spd BBK long tubes, BBK h-pipe, MAC mufflers, K&N w/ silencer trimmed, FRPP 70mm throttle body, C&L plenum, Mobil1 synthetic fluids, FRPP aluminum drive shaft, Steeda Tri-Ax shifter, FRPP 4.10's, 18x9 & 18x10 Saleens with Dunlop SP Super Sport Race rubber, Mach1 grill (GT delete), & Mach1 bumper chin! Click here for pictures & more info! If you are in Northern California, check out North Bay Mustang Club for local meets and cruises!

03-18-2004, 11:25 PM	#10 (permalink)
xxxBlakexxx Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Mountaintop, PA Posts: 634	Blue: Thanks fo r the speed correction. __________________ "Children should not get cancer, but they do!" Help a child with cancer at www.homeoftheirown.org My Stang: 2000 Mustang GT Vert - Steeda Tri-Ax Shifter; C&L Plenum; BBK 75 mm TB; Steeda Strut Tower Supports; Black "Deep Dish" Bullet Wheels; FRPP 4.10's; Steeda Subframes; SLP Catback & SLP Catted X-Pipe; SCT 4 Position Chip with 3 custom tunes; Steeda CAI; Venom-1000 Nitrous; Roush Stage 3 Body Kit; Bullet Suspension Package (on the way)

03-19-2004, 02:03 AM	#11 (permalink)
explicitone Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: racine ,wi Posts: 687	4.10s do not still feel slow down low they help get off the line at 1000 or 6000 I can cruise in 5th gear @30(1200) and still pull 5th all the way to what ever with out ever needing to down shift. yes you can still use 1st and 2nd yes the car will go through these gears faster the same with 3rd and 4th at time when I dont feel like shifting I will start in 2nd and then shift to 4th and then to 5th no lag at all it might be that you have a 70mm t/b with the stock plenum is know by almost everybody that it has no gain and will cause you to lose power down low and mid range and jba headers which show no gains at all on a non supercharged car the only thing they do is drain your wallet(blue00gt) wanted to clear up somethings so all this bad info does not keep getting passed on to other newbes OH and the k/b twin is made for the 2v motors so the is no need to change the k-member or the hood the only power adder ment for the street that these things might need to be changed is some tubro setups __________________ RUN IT STAIGHT AND RUN IT HARD on motor ________ 60' 1.66 1/4 12.704 mph 109.4 Novi 2000 60' 1.564(crap) 1/4 11.717 mph 118.53 _________

03-19-2004, 02:32 AM	#12 (permalink)
JBeryleC Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Sebastopol CA Posts: 169	Well first gear doesnt last long enough for me already, stock. So I wont be doing gears. I'll just build up the motor to get the lowend I want. Thanks for all the info __________________ Torch Red '02 GT Convertible 5 spd BBK long tubes, BBK h-pipe, MAC mufflers, K&N w/ silencer trimmed, FRPP 70mm throttle body, C&L plenum, Mobil1 synthetic fluids, FRPP aluminum drive shaft, Steeda Tri-Ax shifter, FRPP 4.10's, 18x9 & 18x10 Saleens with Dunlop SP Super Sport Race rubber, Mach1 grill (GT delete), & Mach1 bumper chin! Click here for pictures & more info! If you are in Northern California, check out North Bay Mustang Club for local meets and cruises!

03-19-2004, 02:50 AM	#14 (permalink)
JBeryleC Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Sebastopol CA Posts: 169	Yeah I know all about gears... remember I have the big truck.. went from stock 3.53 gears to 4.10 then to 4.56 Amazing results, but that was on a Jet Performance E4OD tranny I dont wanna gear the stang like that because I hate how fast 1st gear is over... it's a daily driver. maybe if it was just for the track then yeah I'd do it. has nothing to do with gas mileage, its just that I want longer lasting 1st gear __________________ Torch Red '02 GT Convertible 5 spd BBK long tubes, BBK h-pipe, MAC mufflers, K&N w/ silencer trimmed, FRPP 70mm throttle body, C&L plenum, Mobil1 synthetic fluids, FRPP aluminum drive shaft, Steeda Tri-Ax shifter, FRPP 4.10's, 18x9 & 18x10 Saleens with Dunlop SP Super Sport Race rubber, Mach1 grill (GT delete), & Mach1 bumper chin! Click here for pictures & more info! If you are in Northern California, check out North Bay Mustang Club for local meets and cruises!

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