Suspension upgrade Qs for '65 coupe

[DeltaMustang65]

I got a new 1-piece export brace (old one was 4-piece) and a monte carlo bar with the curve in the middle, and am in the process of installing them. One issue I'm having is with the old export brace. For some reason, the 2 smaller pieces are welded to the shock tower. They're not very good welds, but they're more than I can handle without power tools. The new 1-piece will fit, but I really want to get these disgusting things off before I put the new one on. If anyone can suggest what to use on these welds, it would be greatly appreciated. I wouldn't flinch at buying power tools for this, because the geniuses that hooked my headers up to the exhaust pipe saw fit to weld one of the collectors up to the pipe, and I could use it to fix that too.

The monte carlo bar seems to be just a little too long for the engine bay. Should I be jacking the car up to remove the load on the suspension before I start fitting these and bolting them up?

Lastly, I'm planning on getting a suspension upgrade kit within a month or two from Mustang's Plus. I was thinking of the "street heat" kit. Does anyone have any experience with this setup? I'm not planning on any hardcore racing, but I'm looking for a balance between comfort and handling. Or at least the best handling I can get without a jarring ride. Again, any advice is greatly appreciated. Thanks.

[rwhite65]

The Monte Carlo bar not fitting is supposed to be a common thing with a 40 year old car. You are supposed to be able to jack it up by the front cross member, and allow the car to sit for a little while. This is suppose to let the stress off the inner fender walls and should give you the clearance you need.

I should clarify I have not done this before, but swear I read it on here once upon a time...and it makes sense to me.
Ryan

[DeltaMustang65]

Makes sense. I'm going to stop by sears right now and see if I can find something to saw/remove the welded pieces of the old export brace. Were the factory installed ones welded up to the shock towers like that, or does that sound like someone's bad idea?

[stanger66]

best thing to get the welds off are power drill w/cutting off tool attachment with a steady hand.
With the suspension kit I would take a look at www.mustangdepot.com 's suspension kit, I think it comes with more choices and is pretty reasonably priced. If youre getting new leaf springs go with 4 or 4 1/2 leaf. They will probably be right around what youre looking for. I'm putting 5 leaf race springs in my 66.

[DeltaMustang65]

Got the export brace and monte carlo bar on with much pushing and pulling, and at the cost of a very sore back. Sometimes it just doesn't pay to be tall, heh heh...

I picked up an angle grinder from sears with some cutting and grinding disks and went to work on the old 4-piece. Fun times. If the old export brace wasn't metal, I would have loved to ritualistically burn it before tossing it in the garbage.

So the 5 leafs that come with mustang plus' "street heat" kit would be a bit much for a moderately modified (eventually) car? How about the 620 springs? They say that the 5 leaf mid-eyes and 620s drop the car an inch at all 4 corners. I'd like that, I'll check and see if I can get the same ride height with the 4.5 leafs. Would I still go for the 620 springs if I choose the 4.5 leaf springs or should I go with something less stiff? Also, if I go with poly bushings, is that going to rattle my car around like those ricers you sometimes see that seem to have no suspension travel at all? I'd honestly rather have rubber that I'd have to change more often than a ride THAT jarring.

I appreciate the answers, everyone. I'm thinking I'm gonna wait a month or two before buying a kit in order to give myself time to research this stuff. I want to make sure I get this done right before I spend a nice chunk of $$$.

[stanger66]

Did you look at the kit on the web site that I told you about?
The 4 and 4.5 leaf come in mid eye (ie1"0 drop) if you wanted to get them I know at that web site. As for the 5 leaf I'm going to try them first and see how they do and my have to get the coil over design with independent rear. I hoping to have around 500 to 700 rwhp in mine eventually. I have 4 engines to put in my car and cant fiqure out which one 302/460/5.4 lightning/4.6 w/vortec supercharger of course.

[DeltaMustang65]

Yep, just checked those kits out. I can't help but notice they seem a bit more expensive than comparable kits from MP at first glance. That plus the shipping would probably put them out of my budget. I live in stockton, and MP is roughly 15 minutes away.

I see that 620 doesn't refer to spring rate, but the diameter of the spring (I've never touched suspension before). If so, how do I find out how stiff the front springs are?

Also, what of poly vs. rubber bushings? I'm guessing from what you say that 5-leafs are meant more for track or drag strip. In that case, should I go with 4.5 leafs? 4 leafs were stock, correct?

I noticed "Carrol Shell-B" mentioned a few times while I was browsing Mustang Depot. What's the deal with that? Does he have some issue similar to Ford with people using his name?

[stanger66]

I would go with rubber bushings I have never used poly. I'm using the 5 leaf for the support if I do want to race street/strip I not really worried about comfort by the time I get done with it there is not going to be any flexing. I dont know what the spring rate will be for the springs but its a lowering spring it cant have much. My car I think have 3.5 leafs in it now the 4.5 should work fine and you want to get mid eye for the 1" drop. It must be nice having MP so close, all the stores I deal with online are least 450 mi. away.

[DeltaMustang65]

Yeah, it's cool having MP in town. Although I haven't dealt with them for quite some time before I bought the bracing. Now I'm finally back to tinkering on my car.

It kinda sucks that their kits come with poly bushings, but I'm sure they'll let me use rubber and chop a little off the price. That's what I'm doing with the shocks. I have their gas shocks already, and they said that they can leave them out of the kit along with what they would have cost. I'm eventually going to get some adjustable gas shocks, though. That's why I wish I knew the spring rates. I need to go pick up a handling book from Barnes and Noble soon, too. Maybe monday after class...

[bmxmon]

I have the 620 springs, they are pretty nice not too stiff of a ride. I believe my ride height either stayed the same or even went up, just because the old springs had 40 years of wear on them. Something you need to consider. I thought i've heard that poly bushings were better, since they dont crack as easily as rubber, though i could be wrong.
___________
I also recommend that you get a coil compressor that goes inside the spring, as its a PITA with the ones that go on the outside. Thats my regret when i did mine.

[rwhite65]

I have the 620's up front, but cut them to get the ride height I wanted to match my lowered rear springs.
Ryan

[DeltaMustang65]

I've heard about new springs not actually lowering old mustangs thanks to decades of wear. It honestly won't bother me much because I like how my car sits now. The only thing that might suck is if the front and back aren't at the same height. I won't cut the springs because I've heard that doing so seriously messes the spring up. I guess all I can do is hope.

[rwhite65]

Originally Posted by DeltaMustang65

I won't cut the springs because I've heard that doing so seriously messes the spring up. I guess all I can do is hope.

I have had no issues with mine, for the last few years since I cut them. However, if it makes you feel uncomfortable that is totally understandable.
Ryan

[DeltaMustang65]

I noticed they sell panhard bar kits at Mustang Depot. Can't say I've seen them at Mustangs Plus. I'm guessing this is something meant for track cars and may screw up my ride if used on the street. Is there any reason for me to install this on my car if it will only rarely be driven at the track, and even then, not in hardcore competition?

[stanger66]

The panhard bar are pretty much traction bars for side to side movement. I know many people that have them on the cars some of them are daily driven. I just give extra support when driving. I am going to put those on mine. I am going to drive mine as much as I can when dry out. Don't drive in rain/snow with it at all.
It would probably benefit you having the v8 in your car. Helps keep to rear where it is supposed to be.

[DeltaMustang65]

I'd like to give a big thank-you to Alex, Mr. White, Stanger66, Mr. Rudis, and MDJay. You guys are a great help.

I hope this topic has helped other suspension newbies like myself realize that this CAN be done relatively easily yourself. I'm very happy that I was able to complete this project, as it not only has greatly increased the handling of my Mustang, but it also feels much safer to drive, as well.

Thanks again.

Matt

[DeltaMustang65]

I finally got around to getting a quote from Mustangs Plus' "Restomod Shop" on getting the Shelby Drop, but they want around $750.00 for it. It includes an alignment that they don't do, but send the car out for. Still, this seems rather steep.

I pressed them on it, asking why it was so much for punching a few holes. They said it's not just that, but removing the upper arms and all that. I replied that I know that because I rebuilt the whole suspension myself (and removed and reinstalled the upper arms, springs, shocks TWICE) and the hours they were quoting just didn't seem to add up to how long it took ME, a newbie. They didn't really have much to say at that point, and I felt like they were just trying to screw me or something.

Also worrisome, I called them in the morning with questions on that and getting subframes welded in and they said they'd call back later, which they never did. Both guys I talked to seemed kinda shady, and not too knowledgeable. Honestly, I don't know if I'd have the work done there even IF the price was right...

Has anyone else had this done at a shop, and what was the cost? Thanks in advance.

Matt

[DeltaMustang65]

Quick question.

My suspension and steering have been completed for a while now, and I can't help but wonder if I should get new shocks since my car is now lowered 1.5". Is the shock being slightly compressed at rest compromising my ride quality?

I can't seem to find any shocks for lowered '65s.

Suggestions, anyone?

P.S. How has everyone been? Sorry I haven't said hello sooner.

[drudis]

Contact John at theis email address: dietrends at-sign juno.com

He built a NICE 1965, and drives with me on opentrack events. Knows his stuff...


Tell him Darius sent ya.

[bmxmon]

I like that 65.