Competition Engineering(Moroso) anti-sway bar opinion/pics....not good!

8850 · 11-06-2001, 05:58 PM

Last time out that 1.394 60' created so much twist with the factory rear anti-swab bar and air bag that I almost ruined my passenger slick. I decided I better do something. I priced around and based on the pics from catalogs the Competition Engineering bar made by Moroso looked like a good choice. Did I ever make the wrong choice!

Before I started the installation I had a few questions to ask Morose about the bar as the instructions were very vague in describing the hole drilling. In fact, non-existent. I left a message on their answering machine, faxed them, and emailed them. I haven't heard from them yet.

I have finished the installation now. Here are my comments and pics.

This first pic shows the entire assembly the way it comes. So far so good, right?
http://www.fbody.com/members/LarryS/arassy.jpg

Notice in this second pic how the hole only goes through one side of the aluminum arm. Try drilling through the existing hole to make the through hole. All you do is whaler out the original hole. No hole exists in the alloy bar. Try drilling a 25/64 diameter centered through this hard bar with a drill motor. Haha! I was able to mark the bar is about all my drill would do. Of course their theory is that by having you drill the holes it will be located farthest out for best fit. They could have at least drilled through the arms. Off the machine shop I go. The other manufacturers of anti-sway bars have their arms already located and secured.
http://www.fbody.com/members/LarryS/arholeone.jpg

This third pic shows the holes drilled. OK now I'm ready to install this thing. Well, not just yet!
http://www.fbody.com/members/LarryS/arafterdrill.jpg

In this fourth pic notice how the supplied dark bolt has threads that will bear on the aluminum. Not good engineering. I bought a longer grade 8 bolt so the shoulder, rather than threads, would bear on the aluminum. Now I'm ready to install this thing. Well, not just yet. Even the bolts in the weld on bracket to the drive shaft tube had threads bearing on the bracket. Four more bolts to buy. Now I'm ready to install this thing. Well, not just yet.
http://www.fbody.com/members/LarryS/arboltlgth.jpg

Don't have a pic for the next problem but if you examine the assembly you will see that there are two grease fittings. One in each bracket. The bar is tubing and has a through hole. If you don't plug the tube then you are going to fill the entire bar with grease. Now that just didn't make sense to me. Down to the hardware store to buy plugs. Of course I couldn't find anything the correct size so I had a choice to have a machine shop make two plugs or I could buy a 5/8 bolt which was only three thousands smaller than the hole, cut it into small plugs and knurl the OD of each plug. This is what I did and drove the short plugs into the bar ends. So now I'm ready to install this thing. Well, not just yet.

In my next pic you will notice a small screw centered in the bracket inside that pretty weld. Their are two of those screws in each bracket to install to hold this thing prior to welding. The second one is located behind the portion of the bracket that holds the bar. It would take a magician to get that hole taped and the screw installed. Needless to say, the second screw did not go in. Didn't Morose install one of these things and determine that this screw just might not go in?
http://www.fbody.com/members/LarryS/arweld.jpg

This pic shows one side completed. A big thank you to Mike over at Ober & Sons on Synott street for a super weld job! (Excuse my mismatch paint but it should keep the rust away).
http://www.fbody.com/members/LarryS/arfinished.jpg

I spent a lot of time redesigning and running down everything I needed for this job. I certainly would not recommend this bar to anybody having gone through all the problems I have encountered. I hope now that it works. Hopefully I will find out this Sunday at the CCB in Sealy, Texas.

------------------
88 347, Twisted wedge heads,Comp Cams 224/230 cam, 1/4=10.324 @ 126.95, 60' = 1.394 http://xs-fx.com/raughammer/larrysample.htm

[This message has been edited by 8850 (edited 11-06-2001).]

Coupe Devil · 11-06-2001, 10:56 PM

Ok so I guess I wont be purchasing that bar. I am buil;ding the drag car but this has unfortunatley slowed the process. That looked like a lot of trouble to install. Who else makes this bar? Are you thinking about redoing it. How much power are you making to ruin a slick. Dang man that's some torque. What kinda control arms are you using? Just a few questions for ya. Hope ya don't mind.

------------------
'93 lx notch 4 banger (drive it to work currently), Using the 306, 8.8 posi, 4.10's, summit rear cover, elec. fan, cowl hood, wieand stealth intake, Heddman 1-3/4 long tubes, holley 650 d.p.carb., built c-?, e-303, full autometer guages, msd box, mallory unilite dist, and coil, roll cage, summit seat, subs, 15x10's in the back with slicks, skinnies up front, custom dash, all in use for 1988 Hatch Drag Car.

8850 · 11-07-2001, 08:27 AM

pony_power_90,

No problem at all. I enjoy the questions.

There are several other companies that make a drag race rear anti-sway bar. Wolfe, Racecraft, BBK and Maximum Motorsports are a few. I haven't seen any others with this hole drilling problem like the CE.

I have it on and completed so hopfully it will perform.

I am dynoeing 360 hp with over 500 lbs of torque. With my light car I got to have slicks. And Hoosier slicks at that. I tried M/T Drags and they wouldn't hold at all.

I'm running factory control arms with polyurethane bushings. They seem to be holding up all right.

Coupe Devil · 11-07-2001, 09:26 AM

Thanks man, I am not gonna be making that much power for a while but it would be nice someday. I plan on upgrading control arms. Probably mega bite jr's. Maybe I can make it hook. Did you remove the fatory sway bar on your car after you installed the new Moroso one. I was planning on leaving mine on. Is that a bad idea? I am using the factory control arms, and sway bar for a while until funds get better. I have a set of factory v-8 springs and a set of 4 banger springs I can use. I am on a budget so I will use one of those for a while. I plan on upgrading to the Eibach drag kit later. Which would be better springs to use for a little while?

The car is a factory 4 banger car, Can I upgrade the front brakes with out changing spindles? I want the bigger 5.0 brakes but not have to swap all the spindles and other suspension stuff. I will probably go with 5 lug when I do it.

------------------
'93 lx notch 4 banger (drive it to work currently), Using the 306, 8.8 posi, 4.10's, summit rear cover, elec. fan, cowl hood, wieand stealth intake, Heddman 1-3/4 long tubes, holley 650 d.p.carb., built c-?, e-303, full autometer guages, msd box, mallory unilite dist, and coil, roll cage, summit seat, subs, 15x10's in the back with slicks, skinnies up front, custom dash, all in use for 1988 Hatch Drag Car.

[This message has been edited by pony_power_90 (edited 11-07-2001).]

8850 · 11-07-2001, 09:51 AM

I didn't need more than the factory rear bar before I hit 1.3's. With a heavier car you might need stronger sooner.

I did remove the factory rear bar with the installation of this bar. If this bar is designed right I shouldn't need both.

I'm still runing my factory control arms with polyurethane bushings. This works fine for me so far.

I do have the Eibach rear drag spring kit with air bags.

Coupe Devil · 11-07-2001, 12:29 PM

My car is gonna be real light to. Totally gutted, custom dash and interior stuff, fiber seat, aluminum wherever I can get it. Which springs would work better FOR NOW until I can afford the Eibach stuff?

------------------
'93 lx notch 4 banger (drive it to work currently), Using the 306, 8.8 posi, 4.10's, summit rear cover, elec. fan, cowl hood, wieand stealth intake, Heddman 1-3/4 long tubes, holley 650 d.p.carb., built c-?, e-303, full autometer guages, msd box, mallory unilite dist, and coil, roll cage, summit seat, subs, 15x10's in the back with slicks, skinnies up front, custom dash, all in use for 1988 Hatch Drag Car.

andy669 · 11-07-2001, 09:33 PM

Well 8850, heres the Wolfe. (the one you should have probably got) I dont understand the part about having to plug the ends though. I havent installed it yet, but I cant wait to get this thing together!
http://members.mustangworks.com/andy669/swaybar1.jpg
http://members.mustangworks.com/andy669/swaybar2.jpg

andy

------------------
3 Black 94 GT Vert. AODE/TKO conversion, 3:73's, ported X-305's, GT40 manifolds, 75mm TB, 30lbers, PMS, 300 horse Top Gun wet kit, and all the other little stuff

8850 · 11-08-2001, 08:45 AM

andy669,

My CE bar has a bushing inside the bracket tube for the bar to ride on. The grease fitting is outboard of this bushing. If the bushing seals fairly good then the grease would take the easier path which is down the center of the bar. With the Wolfe, when you apply grease it goes directly to the bearing surface. I think the bushing is a good idea as long as it doesn't wear out. Once this thing is welded up you can't replace the bushing. With yours, I don't think it will ever wear out as long as you keep grease on the bearing surface.

I wonder if both our bars are the same strength? Mine is 1" OD x .623-.624 ID or about a 3/16 wall.

It appears that the brackets that weld to the differential axle tube are flat on yours. My CE has extra legs for added strength. Another plus for the CE. I would still go with the Wolfe just because of this hole drilling. It has to go to a machine shop and a welding shop for installation. Yours only a weld shop.

pony_power_90,

I would go with air bags until you can afford the Eibach drag springs.

Phantom5oh · 11-08-2001, 10:15 AM

Anything made by Moroso, IMO is JUNK!!! I looked into them for an oil pan a few years ago, they can't even make on that sits flat on the engine... the thing was warped beyond comprehension... not just one but all the ones I tried... maybe thats why they sell them so cheap... after that experiance i saved up and bought a canton... for suspension parts, maximum motorsports makes awesome stuff thats well designed and properly engineered... but after seeing your problems with another Moroso product... i will NEVER buy anything of theirs again!!!

Steve

------------------
Project Bird Turd

GNC Racing & Performance
Scarzi's Machine Works

andy669 · 11-08-2001, 10:53 AM

8850, the bar on mine is 1.250 od and .500 id. making the thickness .375! I'm not sure what you mean about the rearend brackets being flat. They are curved to fit the rearend, but they are just 2 pieces.(one on each side of the heim) Does yours have gussets? That might not be a bad idea. I bought a 8.8 out of a wrecked car that had a swaybar. The brackets were welded on (the worst looking weld you've ever seen) and one of the heim joints was broke off in it. I was surprised that it didnt rip the bracket right off the rearend!
The only other sway bar that i've seen is the HPMotorsport. I can tell you that the Wolfe blows it away! I have their upper, lowers, and CM cage! It is awesome stuff! Well worth the money, i think. Let me know if you want to see pictures.
andy

------------------
3 Black 94 GT Vert. AODE/TKO conversion, 3:73's, ported X-305's, GT40 manifolds, 75mm TB, 30lbers, PMS, 300 horse Top Gun wet kit, and all the other little stuff

8850 · 11-08-2001, 11:47 AM

andy669,

If your bar is 1.25 diameter and .375 wall it is probably going to be stronger than mine. I hope mine gets the job done. If it is harder than yours with a higher tensile strength then it can be smaller and have the same strength. I'll find out Saturday if it gets the job done.

You can take a look in this pic and see the extra ears that come out to weld to the axle tube that the Wolfe does not have. This should give a little better anchor to the tube. Ours are both curved to fit the tube but yours does not have the ears. This may be the only thing better about the CE.
http://www.fbody.com/members/LarryS/arfinished.jpg

11-06-2001, 05:58 PM	#1
8850 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 1998 Location: Sugarland, TX USA Posts: 161	Competition Engineering(Moroso) anti-sway bar opinion/pics....not good! Last time out that 1.394 60' created so much twist with the factory rear anti-swab bar and air bag that I almost ruined my passenger slick. I decided I better do something. I priced around and based on the pics from catalogs the Competition Engineering bar made by Moroso looked like a good choice. Did I ever make the wrong choice! Before I started the installation I had a few questions to ask Morose about the bar as the instructions were very vague in describing the hole drilling. In fact, non-existent. I left a message on their answering machine, faxed them, and emailed them. I haven't heard from them yet. I have finished the installation now. Here are my comments and pics. This first pic shows the entire assembly the way it comes. So far so good, right? http://www.fbody.com/members/LarryS/arassy.jpg Notice in this second pic how the hole only goes through one side of the aluminum arm. Try drilling through the existing hole to make the through hole. All you do is whaler out the original hole. No hole exists in the alloy bar. Try drilling a 25/64 diameter centered through this hard bar with a drill motor. Haha! I was able to mark the bar is about all my drill would do. Of course their theory is that by having you drill the holes it will be located farthest out for best fit. They could have at least drilled through the arms. Off the machine shop I go. The other manufacturers of anti-sway bars have their arms already located and secured. http://www.fbody.com/members/LarryS/arholeone.jpg This third pic shows the holes drilled. OK now I'm ready to install this thing. Well, not just yet! http://www.fbody.com/members/LarryS/arafterdrill.jpg In this fourth pic notice how the supplied dark bolt has threads that will bear on the aluminum. Not good engineering. I bought a longer grade 8 bolt so the shoulder, rather than threads, would bear on the aluminum. Now I'm ready to install this thing. Well, not just yet. Even the bolts in the weld on bracket to the drive shaft tube had threads bearing on the bracket. Four more bolts to buy. Now I'm ready to install this thing. Well, not just yet. http://www.fbody.com/members/LarryS/arboltlgth.jpg Don't have a pic for the next problem but if you examine the assembly you will see that there are two grease fittings. One in each bracket. The bar is tubing and has a through hole. If you don't plug the tube then you are going to fill the entire bar with grease. Now that just didn't make sense to me. Down to the hardware store to buy plugs. Of course I couldn't find anything the correct size so I had a choice to have a machine shop make two plugs or I could buy a 5/8 bolt which was only three thousands smaller than the hole, cut it into small plugs and knurl the OD of each plug. This is what I did and drove the short plugs into the bar ends. So now I'm ready to install this thing. Well, not just yet. In my next pic you will notice a small screw centered in the bracket inside that pretty weld. Their are two of those screws in each bracket to install to hold this thing prior to welding. The second one is located behind the portion of the bracket that holds the bar. It would take a magician to get that hole taped and the screw installed. Needless to say, the second screw did not go in. Didn't Morose install one of these things and determine that this screw just might not go in? http://www.fbody.com/members/LarryS/arweld.jpg This pic shows one side completed. A big thank you to Mike over at Ober & Sons on Synott street for a super weld job! (Excuse my mismatch paint but it should keep the rust away). http://www.fbody.com/members/LarryS/arfinished.jpg I spent a lot of time redesigning and running down everything I needed for this job. I certainly would not recommend this bar to anybody having gone through all the problems I have encountered. I hope now that it works. Hopefully I will find out this Sunday at the CCB in Sealy, Texas. ------------------ 88 347, Twisted wedge heads,Comp Cams 224/230 cam, 1/4=10.324 @ 126.95, 60' = 1.394 http://xs-fx.com/raughammer/larrysample.htm [This message has been edited by 8850 (edited 11-06-2001).]

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Does anyone have a Competition Engineering anti roll bar on there car?	topher5_0	Windsor Power	0	02-21-2002 07:48 AM
Who makes a good heavy duty rear sway bar?	8850	Windsor Power	5	10-18-2001 06:19 PM

11-06-2001, 10:56 PM	#2
Coupe Devil Moderator Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Myrtle Beach SC Posts: 1,643	Ok so I guess I wont be purchasing that bar. I am buil;ding the drag car but this has unfortunatley slowed the process. That looked like a lot of trouble to install. Who else makes this bar? Are you thinking about redoing it. How much power are you making to ruin a slick. Dang man that's some torque. What kinda control arms are you using? Just a few questions for ya. Hope ya don't mind. ------------------ '93 lx notch 4 banger (drive it to work currently), Using the 306, 8.8 posi, 4.10's, summit rear cover, elec. fan, cowl hood, wieand stealth intake, Heddman 1-3/4 long tubes, holley 650 d.p.carb., built c-?, e-303, full autometer guages, msd box, mallory unilite dist, and coil, roll cage, summit seat, subs, 15x10's in the back with slicks, skinnies up front, custom dash, all in use for 1988 Hatch Drag Car.

11-07-2001, 08:27 AM	#3
8850 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 1998 Location: Sugarland, TX USA Posts: 161	pony_power_90, No problem at all. I enjoy the questions. There are several other companies that make a drag race rear anti-sway bar. Wolfe, Racecraft, BBK and Maximum Motorsports are a few. I haven't seen any others with this hole drilling problem like the CE. I have it on and completed so hopfully it will perform. I am dynoeing 360 hp with over 500 lbs of torque. With my light car I got to have slicks. And Hoosier slicks at that. I tried M/T Drags and they wouldn't hold at all. I'm running factory control arms with polyurethane bushings. They seem to be holding up all right.

11-07-2001, 09:26 AM	#4
Coupe Devil Moderator Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Myrtle Beach SC Posts: 1,643	Thanks man, I am not gonna be making that much power for a while but it would be nice someday. I plan on upgrading control arms. Probably mega bite jr's. Maybe I can make it hook. Did you remove the fatory sway bar on your car after you installed the new Moroso one. I was planning on leaving mine on. Is that a bad idea? I am using the factory control arms, and sway bar for a while until funds get better. I have a set of factory v-8 springs and a set of 4 banger springs I can use. I am on a budget so I will use one of those for a while. I plan on upgrading to the Eibach drag kit later. Which would be better springs to use for a little while? The car is a factory 4 banger car, Can I upgrade the front brakes with out changing spindles? I want the bigger 5.0 brakes but not have to swap all the spindles and other suspension stuff. I will probably go with 5 lug when I do it. ------------------ '93 lx notch 4 banger (drive it to work currently), Using the 306, 8.8 posi, 4.10's, summit rear cover, elec. fan, cowl hood, wieand stealth intake, Heddman 1-3/4 long tubes, holley 650 d.p.carb., built c-?, e-303, full autometer guages, msd box, mallory unilite dist, and coil, roll cage, summit seat, subs, 15x10's in the back with slicks, skinnies up front, custom dash, all in use for 1988 Hatch Drag Car. [This message has been edited by pony_power_90 (edited 11-07-2001).]

11-07-2001, 09:51 AM	#5
8850 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 1998 Location: Sugarland, TX USA Posts: 161	I didn't need more than the factory rear bar before I hit 1.3's. With a heavier car you might need stronger sooner. I did remove the factory rear bar with the installation of this bar. If this bar is designed right I shouldn't need both. I'm still runing my factory control arms with polyurethane bushings. This works fine for me so far. I do have the Eibach rear drag spring kit with air bags.

11-07-2001, 12:29 PM	#6
Coupe Devil Moderator Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Myrtle Beach SC Posts: 1,643	My car is gonna be real light to. Totally gutted, custom dash and interior stuff, fiber seat, aluminum wherever I can get it. Which springs would work better FOR NOW until I can afford the Eibach stuff? ------------------ '93 lx notch 4 banger (drive it to work currently), Using the 306, 8.8 posi, 4.10's, summit rear cover, elec. fan, cowl hood, wieand stealth intake, Heddman 1-3/4 long tubes, holley 650 d.p.carb., built c-?, e-303, full autometer guages, msd box, mallory unilite dist, and coil, roll cage, summit seat, subs, 15x10's in the back with slicks, skinnies up front, custom dash, all in use for 1988 Hatch Drag Car.

11-07-2001, 09:33 PM	#7
andy669 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Moline Il Posts: 901	Well 8850, heres the Wolfe. (the one you should have probably got) I dont understand the part about having to plug the ends though. I havent installed it yet, but I cant wait to get this thing together! http://members.mustangworks.com/andy669/swaybar1.jpg http://members.mustangworks.com/andy669/swaybar2.jpg andy ------------------ 3 Black 94 GT Vert. AODE/TKO conversion, 3:73's, ported X-305's, GT40 manifolds, 75mm TB, 30lbers, PMS, 300 horse Top Gun wet kit, and all the other little stuff

11-08-2001, 08:45 AM	#8
8850 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 1998 Location: Sugarland, TX USA Posts: 161	andy669, My CE bar has a bushing inside the bracket tube for the bar to ride on. The grease fitting is outboard of this bushing. If the bushing seals fairly good then the grease would take the easier path which is down the center of the bar. With the Wolfe, when you apply grease it goes directly to the bearing surface. I think the bushing is a good idea as long as it doesn't wear out. Once this thing is welded up you can't replace the bushing. With yours, I don't think it will ever wear out as long as you keep grease on the bearing surface. I wonder if both our bars are the same strength? Mine is 1" OD x .623-.624 ID or about a 3/16 wall. It appears that the brackets that weld to the differential axle tube are flat on yours. My CE has extra legs for added strength. Another plus for the CE. I would still go with the Wolfe just because of this hole drilling. It has to go to a machine shop and a welding shop for installation. Yours only a weld shop. pony_power_90, I would go with air bags until you can afford the Eibach drag springs.

11-08-2001, 10:15 AM	#9
Phantom5oh Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2000 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 334	Anything made by Moroso, IMO is JUNK!!! I looked into them for an oil pan a few years ago, they can't even make on that sits flat on the engine... the thing was warped beyond comprehension... not just one but all the ones I tried... maybe thats why they sell them so cheap... after that experiance i saved up and bought a canton... for suspension parts, maximum motorsports makes awesome stuff thats well designed and properly engineered... but after seeing your problems with another Moroso product... i will NEVER buy anything of theirs again!!! Steve ------------------ Project Bird Turd GNC Racing & Performance Scarzi's Machine Works

11-08-2001, 10:53 AM	#10
andy669 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Moline Il Posts: 901	8850, the bar on mine is 1.250 od and .500 id. making the thickness .375! I'm not sure what you mean about the rearend brackets being flat. They are curved to fit the rearend, but they are just 2 pieces.(one on each side of the heim) Does yours have gussets? That might not be a bad idea. I bought a 8.8 out of a wrecked car that had a swaybar. The brackets were welded on (the worst looking weld you've ever seen) and one of the heim joints was broke off in it. I was surprised that it didnt rip the bracket right off the rearend! The only other sway bar that i've seen is the HPMotorsport. I can tell you that the Wolfe blows it away! I have their upper, lowers, and CM cage! It is awesome stuff! Well worth the money, i think. Let me know if you want to see pictures. andy ------------------ 3 Black 94 GT Vert. AODE/TKO conversion, 3:73's, ported X-305's, GT40 manifolds, 75mm TB, 30lbers, PMS, 300 horse Top Gun wet kit, and all the other little stuff

11-08-2001, 11:47 AM	#11
8850 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 1998 Location: Sugarland, TX USA Posts: 161	andy669, If your bar is 1.25 diameter and .375 wall it is probably going to be stronger than mine. I hope mine gets the job done. If it is harder than yours with a higher tensile strength then it can be smaller and have the same strength. I'll find out Saturday if it gets the job done. You can take a look in this pic and see the extra ears that come out to weld to the axle tube that the Wolfe does not have. This should give a little better anchor to the tube. Ours are both curved to fit the tube but yours does not have the ears. This may be the only thing better about the CE. http://www.fbody.com/members/LarryS/arfinished.jpg