What oil pump?

Five0 · 07-06-2001, 10:04 PM

What oil pump should I use for the 347-stroker motor I am building? A high volume, or a regular stock type pump and why?

I heard someone say not to use a high volume pump on these motors because they push the freeze plugs out. Is that true?

------------------
James Cox
nochevy@hotmail.com
1991 Mustang LX
12.565 @109.38mph 1.764 60ft

elmir50 · 07-07-2001, 12:22 AM

Use a high volume pump if you are using any type of forced aspiration, or a remote oil cooler. On a noramally aspirated engine without the above noted items, it does not need a high volume pump. A high volume pump will heat up the oil more, pump excess oil to the top of the motor, and it also take more horsepower to turn a high volume pump then a regular pump.

What does oil have to do with freeze plugs ?????

The freeze plugs are on the outside of the block where there are water jackets. They are leftover holes from when the block was cast. They also serve to pop out if the water in the block ever freezes. This prevent the block from cracking if the event should ever happen.

foxandfoe · 07-07-2001, 01:59 AM

i would not use a high volume but if you do
(warning) get a heavy duty drive rod from ford motor sports or other do not use the rod it comes with it will twist and brake
i dont have a lot of eaxperiece with blowere but i would think a blower would use the
exess oil from a hv pump other than that
elmir50 sys it all. ect. if you are building race motor with loose tolerances the hv pump is a go.

smokedchevy · 07-07-2001, 03:17 AM

Not the freeze plugs, the oil gallery plugs. They're pressed in, and yes they can pop out if a high volume oil pump is used. Stock 302's have pressed in plugs. Race engines have screw in plugs. The heavy duty oil pump drive is a must!

Five0 · 07-07-2001, 11:37 AM

Thanks for the help, I guess I will go with a regular oil pump.

oldman · 07-07-2001, 06:53 PM

Good idea. High volume oil pumps are designed to work in engines with "blueprinted" clearances. WIth stock main and rod clearances you are just adding a tremendous strain to the oil pump drive trying to shove twice as much oil through the same size gaps.

07-08-2001, 12:35 AM

I would say go with the High Volume Oil Pump. I say this with a few suggestions and personal experience.

First, if your using a High Volume Oil Pump, I would recommend an Oil Pan that can hold a couple of extra quarts of oil. Since you mentioned you are building a 347 I would urge you to work closely with a qualified engine builder and follow his recommendations. A High Volume Oil pump will normally use 20-30% more oil during circulation, which takes allot more oil out of the pan, thus the benefit of the extra quarts of a bigger pan. Also the added benefit of cooling since their is more oil for circulation( or something like that). I am by far no expert, just a few tips that have served me well over the past ten years with my two 347 Stroker Kits.

Here are some tips from Melling on what a High Volume Pump will NOT do:It will not replace a rebuild in a worn-out engine. It may increase pressure but the engine is still worn-out.

1.) It will not pump the oil pan dry. Both solid and hydraulic lifters have metering valves to limit flow of the oil to the top of the engine. If a pan is pumped dry, it is because the holes that drain oil back to the pan are plugged. If the high volume pump is also higher pressure, there will be a slight increase in flow to the top.

2.) It will not wear out distributor gears. The load on the gear is directly related to the resistance to flow. Oil pressure is the measure of resistance to flow. The Ford 427 FE "side oiler" used a pump with relief valve set at 125 psi and it used a standard distributor gear. Distributor gear failures are usually caused by a worn gear on a new cam gear and/or worn bearings allowing misalignment.

3.) It will not cause foaming of the oil. With any oil pump, the excess oil not needed by the engine is recirculated within the pump. Any additional foaming is usually created by revving the engine higher. The oil thrown from the rod bearings is going faster and causes the foaming. This is why high performance engines use a windage tray.

4.) It will not cause spark scatter. Because of the pump pressure there is a load on the distributor gear. The number of teeth on the oil pump gears determine the number of impulses per revolution of the pump. In a SB Chevy there are seven teeth on each gear giving 14 impulses per revolution. At 6000 RPM the oil pump is turning 3000 RPM or 50 revolutions per second. To have an effect on the distributor, these impulses would have to vibrate the distributor gear through an intermediate shaft that has loose connections at both ends. Spark scatter is usually caused by weak springs in the points or dust inside the distributor cap.

Hope this helps.

07-06-2001, 10:04 PM	#1
Five0 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2000 Location: middleburg, fl, usa Posts: 1,134	What oil pump? What oil pump should I use for the 347-stroker motor I am building? A high volume, or a regular stock type pump and why? I heard someone say not to use a high volume pump on these motors because they push the freeze plugs out. Is that true? ------------------ James Cox nochevy@hotmail.com 1991 Mustang LX 12.565 @109.38mph 1.764 60ft

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07-07-2001, 12:22 AM	#2
elmir50 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 1999 Location: Tsawwassen BC Canada Posts: 413	Use a high volume pump if you are using any type of forced aspiration, or a remote oil cooler. On a noramally aspirated engine without the above noted items, it does not need a high volume pump. A high volume pump will heat up the oil more, pump excess oil to the top of the motor, and it also take more horsepower to turn a high volume pump then a regular pump. What does oil have to do with freeze plugs ????? The freeze plugs are on the outside of the block where there are water jackets. They are leftover holes from when the block was cast. They also serve to pop out if the water in the block ever freezes. This prevent the block from cracking if the event should ever happen.

07-07-2001, 01:59 AM	#3
foxandfoe Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: new castle pa Posts: 32	i would not use a high volume but if you do (warning) get a heavy duty drive rod from ford motor sports or other do not use the rod it comes with it will twist and brake i dont have a lot of eaxperiece with blowere but i would think a blower would use the exess oil from a hv pump other than that elmir50 sys it all. ect. if you are building race motor with loose tolerances the hv pump is a go.

07-07-2001, 03:17 AM	#4
smokedchevy Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: ventura,CA Posts: 438	Not the freeze plugs, the oil gallery plugs. They're pressed in, and yes they can pop out if a high volume oil pump is used. Stock 302's have pressed in plugs. Race engines have screw in plugs. The heavy duty oil pump drive is a must!

07-07-2001, 11:37 AM	#5
Five0 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2000 Location: middleburg, fl, usa Posts: 1,134	Thanks for the help, I guess I will go with a regular oil pump.

07-07-2001, 06:53 PM	#6
oldman Registered Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Amarillo, Texas, 79107 Posts: 78	Good idea. High volume oil pumps are designed to work in engines with "blueprinted" clearances. WIth stock main and rod clearances you are just adding a tremendous strain to the oil pump drive trying to shove twice as much oil through the same size gaps.

07-08-2001, 12:35 AM	#7
stanglx347 Guest Posts: n/a	I would say go with the High Volume Oil Pump. I say this with a few suggestions and personal experience. First, if your using a High Volume Oil Pump, I would recommend an Oil Pan that can hold a couple of extra quarts of oil. Since you mentioned you are building a 347 I would urge you to work closely with a qualified engine builder and follow his recommendations. A High Volume Oil pump will normally use 20-30% more oil during circulation, which takes allot more oil out of the pan, thus the benefit of the extra quarts of a bigger pan. Also the added benefit of cooling since their is more oil for circulation( or something like that). I am by far no expert, just a few tips that have served me well over the past ten years with my two 347 Stroker Kits. Here are some tips from Melling on what a High Volume Pump will NOT do:It will not replace a rebuild in a worn-out engine. It may increase pressure but the engine is still worn-out. 1.) It will not pump the oil pan dry. Both solid and hydraulic lifters have metering valves to limit flow of the oil to the top of the engine. If a pan is pumped dry, it is because the holes that drain oil back to the pan are plugged. If the high volume pump is also higher pressure, there will be a slight increase in flow to the top. 2.) It will not wear out distributor gears. The load on the gear is directly related to the resistance to flow. Oil pressure is the measure of resistance to flow. The Ford 427 FE "side oiler" used a pump with relief valve set at 125 psi and it used a standard distributor gear. Distributor gear failures are usually caused by a worn gear on a new cam gear and/or worn bearings allowing misalignment. 3.) It will not cause foaming of the oil. With any oil pump, the excess oil not needed by the engine is recirculated within the pump. Any additional foaming is usually created by revving the engine higher. The oil thrown from the rod bearings is going faster and causes the foaming. This is why high performance engines use a windage tray. 4.) It will not cause spark scatter. Because of the pump pressure there is a load on the distributor gear. The number of teeth on the oil pump gears determine the number of impulses per revolution of the pump. In a SB Chevy there are seven teeth on each gear giving 14 impulses per revolution. At 6000 RPM the oil pump is turning 3000 RPM or 50 revolutions per second. To have an effect on the distributor, these impulses would have to vibrate the distributor gear through an intermediate shaft that has loose connections at both ends. Spark scatter is usually caused by weak springs in the points or dust inside the distributor cap. Hope this helps.