Considering the swap to a 351W - need advice

2FastLX · 06-07-2001, 12:37 PM

I am debating on finding a 351 block to start building up to drop into my Stang. Is it worth it? I plan to buy aluminum heads, new headers and intake of course, but what else will not swap over from my 5.0L engine that I will need to buy? My cam and all the other goodies I have should bolt right up right?

What all is involved in the swap as far as electronics and such and what year/vehicle should I be looking for the block from to have the best block for handling a lot of power in the future?

Also, what all machine work should I have done to the block as far as race prepping goes?

Thanks.

------------------
Too much to list. Best ET on the car so far with stock 2.73 gears - 13.73@102mph

Indiana Stangers Association
Buy your parts here
ICQ# 42269241

Smokedawg · 06-07-2001, 12:43 PM

I dont know if its true or not but I heard that the accessories wont bolt back up correct. I think you got to buy additional brackets to make everything bolt up right..I could be completly wrong though.

------------------
347 Stroker Motor: Balanced, Cobra Transmission, Extrude Ported and Polished Upper and ported Lower, GT40 Milled Ported and Polished Heads, B303 Cam, BBK 1 5/8 Headers, 30lb Bosch Injectors, Holley AFPR, March Underdrive Pulleys, Perma-Cool Fan, 3-Core Radiator, Accel Performance Coil, Accel 300+ Racing Wires, Ram Air, K&N Filter, 73mm Vortech MAF, 70mm TB, FlowMaster Exhaust w/BBK Offroad H-Pipe, Hurst Shifter, 3:55 Gears, Ram Clutch, Cross Drilled Rotors, AC del, rear seat del.

2FastLX · 06-07-2001, 12:46 PM

I can just make the brackets. No real biggie.

------------------
Too much to list. Best ET on the car so far with stock 2.73 gears - 13.73@102mph

Indiana Stangers Association
Buy your parts here
ICQ# 42269241

Smokedawg · 06-07-2001, 12:52 PM

where r u from in indiana??

------------------
347 Stroker Motor: Balanced, Cobra Transmission, Extrude Ported and Polished Upper and ported Lower, GT40 Milled Ported and Polished Heads, B303 Cam, BBK 1 5/8 Headers, 30lb Bosch Injectors, Holley AFPR, March Underdrive Pulleys, Perma-Cool Fan, 3-Core Radiator, Accel Performance Coil, Accel 300+ Racing Wires, Ram Air, K&N Filter, 73mm Vortech MAF, 70mm TB, FlowMaster Exhaust w/BBK Offroad H-Pipe, Hurst Shifter, 3:55 Gears, Ram Clutch, Cross Drilled Rotors, AC del, rear seat del.

jonnyk · 06-07-2001, 04:10 PM

Check out this article:
http://www.alternativeauto.com/water..._nut_bolt.html
Lidio has done his share of 351W conversions I'm sure

------------------
1991 LX Hatch 5.0L

[This message has been edited by jonnyk (edited 06-07-2001).]

fiveohpatrol · 06-07-2001, 04:45 PM

you will need a new oilpan kit made for the swap into stangs, it comes with the pan and a different pickup, not sure about the accessories though, why are you debating this Kevin? cause you cant figure your problems out? if you swap over a lot of your existing parts, you'll probably swap over your problem as well, i'd stay away from the windsor for now, it will cost alot more than even starting completely over on yours, good luck with whatever you decide

------------------
88 Notch, 3.73's, Ported E7's, Explorer int. w/ ported lower, pulleys, 1.7RR's, BBK headers, off-road H-pipe, flowmasters, subframe connectors, 65mm TB, shift kit, March ram air ,MSD coil, U/L control arms, 155lph fuel pump, cheap 2800 stall, Crane Adj.FPR, best 1/4--> 13.77@101.35

DirtKing · 06-07-2001, 05:10 PM

oilpan
efi distributor
headers
intake
I rebalanced my flywheel and damper so that saved money...otherwise you need 23oz units.
the bracket cost $30 from holcomb motorsports.
cam, front cover, valve covers, waterpump all work.

you might need bigger injectors for the added power.

I also crossdrilled and nitrided my crankshaft..(the 351 mains are HUGE.)

------------------
88LX notch, Speedpro EFI Procharged!

Stang Runner · 06-07-2001, 06:12 PM

You could make The 351 ford should of made, I t was in a 5.0 mag. They got 380 HP 430ft-lbs And it used the 5.0 Injection and made it run on 87oct, 11:1 compresstion. I have one of the pages on the web. http://computerconquest.homestead.com/conquest.html It may take some time. I have it all if you want it.

wiggy · 06-07-2001, 07:35 PM

I'm in the process...
351 conversion oil pan Kit($125)FMS
shortie headers for 351($220)MAC
intake from 351, deck is wider
351 balancer, install washers on stock or buy aftermarket
351 flywheel, 28 ounce ($45 for Autozone)
Waterpump bolts up
my accerssories bolted right up but I guess it depends on what year 351 you buy
distributor from a 351 EFI
Thats all you need for the conversion
I haven't fired mine up yet but I hear the difference is unbelievable
NOTE: I converted to carb

5.8 Liter Chevy Eater!

302man · 06-07-2001, 08:59 PM

Kev, it were me doing what you are thinking about doing. I would not go 351. Keep the 302 and stroke it to 347 and get a girdle. DSS makes some pretty good stuff. Someother company makes a kit with offset wrist pins so the rings are out of the wrist pin area. Besides the cost of buying and selling parts, the 50lbs added to the front of your car is enough to make me say no right off hand. How fast do you want to go ? Remember, I am doing it with a stock block and a girdle. The problem comes with a bad tune and too many RPMS .

------------------
302,vortech s trim @18-20lbs showing,edelbrock performer heads-o ringed,gt 40 upper&lower, mac 1 5/8"long tubes, sub frame connectors,50/50 rear, 70/30 front, manual rack,3:55 gears, c4 , best time 10.13@135mph

2FastLX · 06-08-2001, 04:04 AM

I've heard way too many people complain about reliability issues with the 347's to even consider buying one. This is going to be a daily driver so it HAS to be dependable and 50lbs more weight isn't going to make much of a difference when you consider the added cubic inches (will be bored .060 over). Plus I have my battery in the hatch, no A/C or smog, etc, etc, so it'll be plenty light enough in the front end. Not to mention the fact I'll be going with aluminum heads which will drop even more weight from the front. Future plans are to go with an Incon turbo or Vortech S trim and I've heard that a 351 would be great for that.

I guess I already have my mind made up that a 351 will be going in sometime in the future because the problems I am having right now with my current setup have me so frustrated I no longer have any desire whatsoever to continue fighting this thing. It's draining my wallet chasing an unsolved mystery and nobody seems to have a clue what could be causing my problems. If someone close by could come and fix this vacuum problem of mine they will be classified as the ULTIMATE STANG GUY in my book because I've tried everything everyone has told me to try and I've stumped the best of them along with myself, my brother, and a few Stang buddies from my area (see pulling codes post).

Smokedawg - I am in Mecca. 20 miles North of Terre Haute.

------------------
Too much to list. Best ET on the car so far with stock 2.73 gears - 13.73@102mph

Indiana Stangers Association
Buy your parts here
ICQ# 42269241

[This message has been edited by 2FastLX (edited 06-08-2001).]

[This message has been edited by 2FastLX (edited 06-08-2001).]

Rick 91GT · 06-08-2001, 07:13 AM

Kev- whats the PCV valve look like and where it is hooked up to, that thing has got to be leaking somewhere. Don't give up on that 302 they are good motor and will be plenty for a S-trim or turbo, look at Tims car low 10's and it stays together and he has the stock computer still also, impressed me. I was looking at going 408 or 396 for my next motor but after talking to a lot of guys with power adders they all like the small cube motors, you don't need all those ci when you have a power adder. What about re-adjusting the valves and rockers, have you done that to see if that helps?

------------------
Check Out My Site 91GT,Holley SysteMAX II Kit-Heads 2.02" x 1.60" port matched to a 1262,Anderson N-61,24#,76mm C&L,Full MAC exhaust 1-5/8" Long tubes,2-1/2" O.R H-Pipe,2 1/2" cat back, No A/C or PS or emissions, 12" K&N Filter,RNH PERFORMANCE Ram Air,Ron Davis Radiator,Full Suspension,S&W 8pt "X" brace,JAZ seats,3:73's,Welds..etc,4:30's and 31 splines coming very soon!

302man · 06-08-2001, 07:15 AM

The only problem I was aware of was a bad idle ? Whats wrong ?

------------------
302,vortech s trim @18-20lbs showing,edelbrock performer heads-o ringed,gt 40 upper&lower, mac 1 5/8"long tubes, sub frame connectors,50/50 rear, 70/30 front, manual rack,3:55 gears, c4 , best time 10.13@135mph

302man · 06-08-2001, 07:16 AM

The only problem I was aware of was a bad idle ? Whats wrong ?

------------------
302,vortech s trim @18-20lbs showing,edelbrock performer heads-o ringed,gt 40 upper&lower, mac 1 5/8"long tubes, sub frame connectors,50/50 rear, 70/30 front, manual rack,3:55 gears, c4 , best time 10.13@135mph

Rick 91GT · 06-08-2001, 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 302man:
The only problem I was aware of was a bad idle ? Whats wrong ?

Tim, Kevin was only getting 5" of vacuum at idle which is very low for that F-cam, he was thinking there was a vacuum leak somewhere but was unable to find one. With the vacuum being 9-10 points low I thought it pointed to the intake leaking the F-cam should pull atleast 13-15" of hg at idle, but there weren't any leaks to be found. Did you get the mail I sent you at home?

1000 POST !!!!!!

------------------
Check Out My Site 91GT,Holley SysteMAX II Kit-Heads 2.02" x 1.60" port matched to a 1262,Anderson N-61,24#,76mm C&L,Full MAC exhaust 1-5/8" Long tubes,2-1/2" O.R H-Pipe,2 1/2" cat back, No A/C or PS or emissions, 12" K&N Filter,RNH PERFORMANCE Ram Air,Ron Davis Radiator,Full Suspension,S&W 8pt "X" brace,JAZ seats,3:73's,Welds..etc,4:30's and 31 splines coming very soon!

[This message has been edited by Rick 91GT (edited 06-08-2001).]

jimberg · 06-08-2001, 01:07 PM

If you do the 351, go with TFS heads and intake. I plan to swap my intake as soon as I can afford it. The F303 is ground more toward low-end torque, which you don't really need with a 351, so I suggest getting something like an E303 or better. Maybe call TFS about their cams and what they recommend for the 351.

------------------
351W 89 Mustang GT Convertible

2FastLX · 06-09-2001, 10:39 AM

That is what I was planning Jim =) I got that spacer yesterday. Thanks a lot man! I owe you one.

Rick - I haven't got to the rockers yet. I am waiting until next week. Since I got a bunch of overtime this week I can order my Ford Racing valve covers and put them back on when we're done

We checked the PCV and it was fine.

I'm going to start looking for a 351 in the next couple weeks. I'd like to get a roller cam motor, but can they convert the older bocks into roller motors? Or will I need to find a late model 351?

------------------
Too much to list. Best ET on the car so far with stock 2.73 gears - 13.73@102mph

Indiana Stangers Association
Buy your parts here
ICQ# 42269241

jimberg · 06-09-2001, 11:34 AM

I think they do have kits for converting older blocks, but it would probably be easier to just get a new block with the correct lifter bore height.

Sorry that I didn't have the bolts to send you.

------------------
351W 89 Mustang GT Convertible

2FastLX · 06-10-2001, 11:14 AM

No problem Jim. I was just going to use all thread or go to our local Fastenal store and order some the correct length if they had them.

Anyone know what would be a good price for a 351 block? And what heads should I go with for it? I was considering the AFR 185's or 205's and the Trick Flow intake with my F cam.

------------------
Too much to list. Best ET on the car so far with stock 2.73 gears - 13.73@102mph

Indiana Stangers Association
Buy your parts here
ICQ# 42269241

jimberg · 06-10-2001, 12:03 PM

If you go with TFS intake you should go with TFS TW heads. They're pretty much port matched out of the box. You want a cam that gives you more power toward higher RPMS (6000-6500). 351s are seriously torquey already.

06-07-2001, 12:37 PM	#1
2FastLX The Photoshop Guru Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Mecca, Indiana Posts: 1,419	Considering the swap to a 351W - need advice I am debating on finding a 351 block to start building up to drop into my Stang. Is it worth it? I plan to buy aluminum heads, new headers and intake of course, but what else will not swap over from my 5.0L engine that I will need to buy? My cam and all the other goodies I have should bolt right up right? What all is involved in the swap as far as electronics and such and what year/vehicle should I be looking for the block from to have the best block for handling a lot of power in the future? Also, what all machine work should I have done to the block as far as race prepping goes? Thanks. ------------------ Too much to list. Best ET on the car so far with stock 2.73 gears - 13.73@102mph Indiana Stangers Association Buy your parts here ICQ# 42269241

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06-07-2001, 12:43 PM	#2
Smokedawg Tires Fear Me... Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 867	I dont know if its true or not but I heard that the accessories wont bolt back up correct. I think you got to buy additional brackets to make everything bolt up right..I could be completly wrong though. ------------------ 347 Stroker Motor: Balanced, Cobra Transmission, Extrude Ported and Polished Upper and ported Lower, GT40 Milled Ported and Polished Heads, B303 Cam, BBK 1 5/8 Headers, 30lb Bosch Injectors, Holley AFPR, March Underdrive Pulleys, Perma-Cool Fan, 3-Core Radiator, Accel Performance Coil, Accel 300+ Racing Wires, Ram Air, K&N Filter, 73mm Vortech MAF, 70mm TB, FlowMaster Exhaust w/BBK Offroad H-Pipe, Hurst Shifter, 3:55 Gears, Ram Clutch, Cross Drilled Rotors, AC del, rear seat del.

06-07-2001, 12:46 PM	#3
2FastLX The Photoshop Guru Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Mecca, Indiana Posts: 1,419	I can just make the brackets. No real biggie. ------------------ Too much to list. Best ET on the car so far with stock 2.73 gears - 13.73@102mph Indiana Stangers Association Buy your parts here ICQ# 42269241

06-07-2001, 12:52 PM	#4
Smokedawg Tires Fear Me... Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 867	where r u from in indiana?? ------------------ 347 Stroker Motor: Balanced, Cobra Transmission, Extrude Ported and Polished Upper and ported Lower, GT40 Milled Ported and Polished Heads, B303 Cam, BBK 1 5/8 Headers, 30lb Bosch Injectors, Holley AFPR, March Underdrive Pulleys, Perma-Cool Fan, 3-Core Radiator, Accel Performance Coil, Accel 300+ Racing Wires, Ram Air, K&N Filter, 73mm Vortech MAF, 70mm TB, FlowMaster Exhaust w/BBK Offroad H-Pipe, Hurst Shifter, 3:55 Gears, Ram Clutch, Cross Drilled Rotors, AC del, rear seat del.

06-07-2001, 04:10 PM	#5
jonnyk Being stroked is great Join Date: Oct 1998 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 772	Check out this article: http://www.alternativeauto.com/water..._nut_bolt.html Lidio has done his share of 351W conversions I'm sure ------------------ 1991 LX Hatch 5.0L [This message has been edited by jonnyk (edited 06-07-2001).]

06-07-2001, 04:45 PM	#6
fiveohpatrol I'd rather be basketweaving Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 2,551	you will need a new oilpan kit made for the swap into stangs, it comes with the pan and a different pickup, not sure about the accessories though, why are you debating this Kevin? cause you cant figure your problems out? if you swap over a lot of your existing parts, you'll probably swap over your problem as well, i'd stay away from the windsor for now, it will cost alot more than even starting completely over on yours, good luck with whatever you decide ------------------ 88 Notch, 3.73's, Ported E7's, Explorer int. w/ ported lower, pulleys, 1.7RR's, BBK headers, off-road H-pipe, flowmasters, subframe connectors, 65mm TB, shift kit, March ram air ,MSD coil, U/L control arms, 155lph fuel pump, cheap 2800 stall, Crane Adj.FPR, best 1/4--> 13.77@101.35

06-07-2001, 05:10 PM	#7
DirtKing Registered Member Join Date: Feb 1999 Location: brooklyn center,mn,USA Posts: 169	oilpan efi distributor headers intake I rebalanced my flywheel and damper so that saved money...otherwise you need 23oz units. the bracket cost $30 from holcomb motorsports. cam, front cover, valve covers, waterpump all work. you might need bigger injectors for the added power. I also crossdrilled and nitrided my crankshaft..(the 351 mains are HUGE.) ------------------ 88LX notch, Speedpro EFI Procharged!

06-07-2001, 06:12 PM	#8
Stang Runner Registered Member Join Date: Jun 1999 Location: Walker, MI, USA Posts: 1,202	You could make The 351 ford should of made, I t was in a 5.0 mag. They got 380 HP 430ft-lbs And it used the 5.0 Injection and made it run on 87oct, 11:1 compresstion. I have one of the pages on the web. http://computerconquest.homestead.com/conquest.html It may take some time. I have it all if you want it.

06-07-2001, 07:35 PM	#9
wiggy Registered Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Spring Lake NC 28390 Posts: 19	I'm in the process... 351 conversion oil pan Kit($125)FMS shortie headers for 351($220)MAC intake from 351, deck is wider 351 balancer, install washers on stock or buy aftermarket 351 flywheel, 28 ounce ($45 for Autozone) Waterpump bolts up my accerssories bolted right up but I guess it depends on what year 351 you buy distributor from a 351 EFI Thats all you need for the conversion I haven't fired mine up yet but I hear the difference is unbelievable NOTE: I converted to carb 5.8 Liter Chevy Eater!

06-07-2001, 08:59 PM	#10
302man Registered Member Join Date: Jul 1999 Location: INDIANAPOLIS Posts: 404	Kev, it were me doing what you are thinking about doing. I would not go 351. Keep the 302 and stroke it to 347 and get a girdle. DSS makes some pretty good stuff. Someother company makes a kit with offset wrist pins so the rings are out of the wrist pin area. Besides the cost of buying and selling parts, the 50lbs added to the front of your car is enough to make me say no right off hand. How fast do you want to go ? Remember, I am doing it with a stock block and a girdle. The problem comes with a bad tune and too many RPMS . ------------------ 302,vortech s trim @18-20lbs showing,edelbrock performer heads-o ringed,gt 40 upper&lower, mac 1 5/8"long tubes, sub frame connectors,50/50 rear, 70/30 front, manual rack,3:55 gears, c4 , best time 10.13@135mph

06-08-2001, 04:04 AM	#11
2FastLX The Photoshop Guru Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Mecca, Indiana Posts: 1,419	I've heard way too many people complain about reliability issues with the 347's to even consider buying one. This is going to be a daily driver so it HAS to be dependable and 50lbs more weight isn't going to make much of a difference when you consider the added cubic inches (will be bored .060 over). Plus I have my battery in the hatch, no A/C or smog, etc, etc, so it'll be plenty light enough in the front end. Not to mention the fact I'll be going with aluminum heads which will drop even more weight from the front. Future plans are to go with an Incon turbo or Vortech S trim and I've heard that a 351 would be great for that. I guess I already have my mind made up that a 351 will be going in sometime in the future because the problems I am having right now with my current setup have me so frustrated I no longer have any desire whatsoever to continue fighting this thing. It's draining my wallet chasing an unsolved mystery and nobody seems to have a clue what could be causing my problems. If someone close by could come and fix this vacuum problem of mine they will be classified as the ULTIMATE STANG GUY in my book because I've tried everything everyone has told me to try and I've stumped the best of them along with myself, my brother, and a few Stang buddies from my area (see pulling codes post). Smokedawg - I am in Mecca. 20 miles North of Terre Haute. ------------------ Too much to list. Best ET on the car so far with stock 2.73 gears - 13.73@102mph Indiana Stangers Association Buy your parts here ICQ# 42269241 [This message has been edited by 2FastLX (edited 06-08-2001).] [This message has been edited by 2FastLX (edited 06-08-2001).]

06-08-2001, 07:13 AM	#12
Rick 91GT Procharged! Join Date: May 1999 Location: Hanover, PA Posts: 1,539	Kev- whats the PCV valve look like and where it is hooked up to, that thing has got to be leaking somewhere. Don't give up on that 302 they are good motor and will be plenty for a S-trim or turbo, look at Tims car low 10's and it stays together and he has the stock computer still also, impressed me. I was looking at going 408 or 396 for my next motor but after talking to a lot of guys with power adders they all like the small cube motors, you don't need all those ci when you have a power adder. What about re-adjusting the valves and rockers, have you done that to see if that helps? ------------------ Check Out My Site 91GT,Holley SysteMAX II Kit-Heads 2.02" x 1.60" port matched to a 1262,Anderson N-61,24#,76mm C&L,Full MAC exhaust 1-5/8" Long tubes,2-1/2" O.R H-Pipe,2 1/2" cat back, No A/C or PS or emissions, 12" K&N Filter,RNH PERFORMANCE Ram Air,Ron Davis Radiator,Full Suspension,S&W 8pt "X" brace,JAZ seats,3:73's,Welds..etc,4:30's and 31 splines coming very soon!

06-08-2001, 07:15 AM	#13
302man Registered Member Join Date: Jul 1999 Location: INDIANAPOLIS Posts: 404	The only problem I was aware of was a bad idle ? Whats wrong ? ------------------ 302,vortech s trim @18-20lbs showing,edelbrock performer heads-o ringed,gt 40 upper&lower, mac 1 5/8"long tubes, sub frame connectors,50/50 rear, 70/30 front, manual rack,3:55 gears, c4 , best time 10.13@135mph

06-08-2001, 07:16 AM	#14
302man Registered Member Join Date: Jul 1999 Location: INDIANAPOLIS Posts: 404	The only problem I was aware of was a bad idle ? Whats wrong ? ------------------ 302,vortech s trim @18-20lbs showing,edelbrock performer heads-o ringed,gt 40 upper&lower, mac 1 5/8"long tubes, sub frame connectors,50/50 rear, 70/30 front, manual rack,3:55 gears, c4 , best time 10.13@135mph

06-08-2001, 01:07 PM	#16
jimberg Registered Member Join Date: Oct 1998 Location: Rogers, MN Posts: 2,089	If you do the 351, go with TFS heads and intake. I plan to swap my intake as soon as I can afford it. The F303 is ground more toward low-end torque, which you don't really need with a 351, so I suggest getting something like an E303 or better. Maybe call TFS about their cams and what they recommend for the 351. ------------------ 351W 89 Mustang GT Convertible

06-09-2001, 10:39 AM	#17
2FastLX The Photoshop Guru Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Mecca, Indiana Posts: 1,419	That is what I was planning Jim =) I got that spacer yesterday. Thanks a lot man! I owe you one. Rick - I haven't got to the rockers yet. I am waiting until next week. Since I got a bunch of overtime this week I can order my Ford Racing valve covers and put them back on when we're done We checked the PCV and it was fine. I'm going to start looking for a 351 in the next couple weeks. I'd like to get a roller cam motor, but can they convert the older bocks into roller motors? Or will I need to find a late model 351? ------------------ Too much to list. Best ET on the car so far with stock 2.73 gears - 13.73@102mph Indiana Stangers Association Buy your parts here ICQ# 42269241

06-09-2001, 11:34 AM	#18
jimberg Registered Member Join Date: Oct 1998 Location: Rogers, MN Posts: 2,089	I think they do have kits for converting older blocks, but it would probably be easier to just get a new block with the correct lifter bore height. Sorry that I didn't have the bolts to send you. ------------------ 351W 89 Mustang GT Convertible

06-10-2001, 11:14 AM	#19
2FastLX The Photoshop Guru Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Mecca, Indiana Posts: 1,419	No problem Jim. I was just going to use all thread or go to our local Fastenal store and order some the correct length if they had them. Anyone know what would be a good price for a 351 block? And what heads should I go with for it? I was considering the AFR 185's or 205's and the Trick Flow intake with my F cam. ------------------ Too much to list. Best ET on the car so far with stock 2.73 gears - 13.73@102mph Indiana Stangers Association Buy your parts here ICQ# 42269241

06-10-2001, 12:03 PM	#20
jimberg Registered Member Join Date: Oct 1998 Location: Rogers, MN Posts: 2,089	If you go with TFS intake you should go with TFS TW heads. They're pretty much port matched out of the box. You want a cam that gives you more power toward higher RPMS (6000-6500). 351s are seriously torquey already.