4.10's, subframes, and new traction lock = 4 tenths slower!?!?

Killercanary · 04-12-2001, 10:49 PM

Well, I just got back from the track and I'm upset. Last year with the same setup I have now I was running consistent 13.8's at 98mph. The only thing I changed was: swapped out the 3.73's for 4.10, put in a new clutch pack in the traction lock, and added global west subframe connectors. My best time and mph tonight was a 14.265 at 96.98mph, but all my other passes were 14.3's. My 60' used to be 1.91-1.92, tonight my best was a 2.000. It seemed like it hooked up pretty well, but the 60' tells a different story. The thing I don't understand is that I had better 60's without subframe connectory, higher gears, and with a totally shot posi. I can account for almost an extra 100lbs that the car has this year as compared to last, but not .5 worth. I'm not real upset though as I hope these parts will help once I get the heads, cam, rockers, MAF, etc. on. Anyone have a clue though as to how I slowered down .5?

------------------
95 GT convt' 5 speed, 3.73's,FMS HD clutch, Pro 5.0 shifter, ASP alum. underdrive pulleys, Bassani offroad X pipe, 2 chmbr flowmasters, K&N w/o silencer, edelbrock performer intake, FRPP 65mm T-body, FRPP shorty headers, FRPP aluminum driveshaft.Hooker 4pt chrome car bar, Xenon/Wings West ground effects, custom interior
Best ET: 13.83
Best MPH: 98.55mph with Best 60': 1.91 on Nitto DR's
Homepage: <A HREF="http://www.angelfire.com/pa2/killercanary" TARGET=_blank>http://www.angelfire

[This message has been edited by Killercanary (edited 04-12-2001).]

NOS_Notch · 04-12-2001, 11:12 PM

My 60' used to be 1.91-1.92, tonight my best was a 2.000.

I think you just answered it yourself.....
there is 2 tenths plus your extra 100 lbs...another tenth....
Where are you shifting?? w/stock tach or lite???
I have a 5200 chip in my lite and it works best for me...you want to be done w/ your shift at about 5500
My timing is at 14*
You don't sound too far off.
My guess is you should be about 13.50's at around 100-102 mph.
We have a similar setup(except i have a much lighter notchback)and my best on motor is 13.28 @ 104
Get some traction and you will be happy...your not shifting into 5th are you???
A lot of people will try to convinve you that w/ 4.10's you've run out of gear....
But your fine in 4th going all the way..about 5500-5700

------------------
4.10's,long tubes & 75 shot...Goes 12.50's
Check it out at http://www.burnouts.webprovider.com

exgmguy · 04-13-2001, 05:43 AM

Sounds like you are just spinning more with the taller gear.

93CobraR · 04-13-2001, 07:14 PM

Also the 4.10's take you threw the trap at about 5600 or more right? before you went threw lower, the more rpms the car turns over 5400 or so your just losing power. After my new heads it really helped my times. I gained 3 mph and .5 after just GT-40's no intake or anything else. So that could also be why your slower.

------------------
87 GT, 4 inch cowl hood,17x9 Cobra R's/255/45's,GT-40 heads,long tubes headers,h-pipe,Flows,BBK cold air, Mass air,70mm MAF, 1.7's, 1" spacer,underdrive pulleys,Pro 5.0, King Cobra, Adj. fuel Reg., Lakewood Lift Bars,50/50's,subframes, 4.10's.
Best time 12.96
Best MPH 103.42
Best 60' 1.695

Visit my site at:
http://www.geocities.com/cobrar93_2000/MyPage.html

Killercanary · 04-14-2001, 03:54 PM

I think some has to do with the launch, but if I was cutting 1.91 60's with practically only one wheel working and with a higher gear and no subframes in my convertible, I would surely think I would have launched better now with 4.10's, new clutch pack, and subframe connectors. I couldn't get better than a 2.000 60'. The car would either bog, spin or result in tons of wheelhop which has never happened before. I used to just dump the clutch and it would hook and go, but now at the same rpm launch it spins, so on my last run I slipped the clutch slightly till it started to roll and then dumped it- it started to hook than I got tons of wheel hop, like I said my car has never wheel hopped before. Any ideas why its doing this now?

Also, I'm only crossing at around 5400-5500, before it was like 5000-5100rpms, so I think I'm not that far into the upper rpm range to make this much of a dramatic effect on my times. I just can't wait till I get my FTI cam so I can tear down the motor and put it on along with my new AFR heads, injectors, MAF, etc!!!

------------------
95 GT convt' 5 speed, 3.73's,FMS HD clutch, Pro 5.0 shifter, ASP alum. underdrive pulleys, Bassani offroad X pipe, 2 chmbr flowmasters, K&N w/o silencer, edelbrock performer intake, FRPP 65mm T-body, FRPP shorty headers, FRPP aluminum driveshaft.Hooker 4pt chrome car bar, Xenon/Wings West ground effects, custom interior
Best ET: 13.83
Best MPH: 98.55mph with Best 60': 1.91 on Nitto DR's
Homepage: <A HREF="http://www.angelfire.com/pa2/killercanary" TARGET=_blank>http://www.angelfire

Skyman · 04-14-2001, 04:11 PM

Killer- I really dont think there is anything to worry about here. You lost maybe 1mph at the most. That could just come from the extra 100lbs. Or any other factor. I wouldn't worry about any of this. Your car still runs great and I think you're going to be really happy once you get the new heads/cam in.

5400rpm is pretty high for stock heads. My car I get best results shifting at 5600. I think 5000 was probably a lot better.

Anyways, good luck, and I'm looking forward to the results after everything is done.

Sky

------------------
-1989 Saleen Mustang #406- TFS Heads, E-303, edelbrock intake,70MM TB, 73mm MAF, off road H, headers and 3chamber flows.
12.55@107mph
Runs on 87 Octane and gets 24mpg!

Killercanary · 04-15-2001, 10:55 PM

I too think I may be a little high in the rev's for the stock heads now after realizing my HP peaked at 4800 on the dyno. I shift the first 3 gears at 5200rpms, which has always yielded my best times before. I hope your right that it will all pay off soon. The only thing that confuses me is that I still thought that I would pick up from the the 330' to 1/8th mile and more with the 4.10's as they are helping me get all 3700+lbs up and moving quicker, but I can't see any substantial improvement. The gears make the car feel at least 200lbs lighter than before. If you would have told me that I would have noticed this much with a jump of only one gear ratio I wouldn't have believed it, but it made quite a difference. I'm itching like you can't believe to put on my heads and stuff. I even thought about putting the heads, rockers, and the rest on except for the cam for now till I get the cam, but then I looked under my hood at everything I'd have to do twice- I think I'll just grit my teeth and bear it. I hope I hear word soon on the cam, I know it'll be worth the wait from what all the other guys are getting out of their combo's with Ed's cams.

------------------
95 GT convt' 5 speed, 3.73's,FMS HD clutch, Pro 5.0 shifter, ASP alum. underdrive pulleys, Bassani offroad X pipe, 2 chmbr flowmasters, K&N w/o silencer, edelbrock performer intake, FRPP 65mm T-body, FRPP shorty headers, FRPP aluminum driveshaft.Hooker 4pt chrome car bar, Xenon/Wings West ground effects, custom interior
Best ET: 13.83
Best MPH: 98.55mph with Best 60': 1.91 on Nitto DR's
Homepage: <A HREF="http://www.angelfire.com/pa2/killercanary" TARGET=_blank>http://www.angelfire

Dark Knight · 04-16-2001, 05:03 PM

I wouldnt worry about it.. the gears are running you out of the RPM range for now...
as for the 60ft.. it might have just been track prep too... the wheel hop is probably because you are getting into the torque range sooner than before...

------------------
84 convt,'95 302,AFR's, performer
3.55's, underdrives stock shorties
stock cam, 1.7's
14.06@100.21, 255RWHP on a hot day
265 on the mph/weight chart

blacksunshine88GT · 04-17-2001, 12:46 AM

hey paul its greco just lettin you know that i have a mustang works name now look for me and write back !!!!!

Killercanary · 04-17-2001, 07:50 PM

Hey Greco- I checked out your site and sent you an email, but I never heard from you. Are you going to Keystone this week? The weather looks good, but its gonna be pretty cold, like in the 40's during the day and a chilly high 20's at night. We should run good MPH, but traction will definitely be a problem, at least for me. I think my dad and I are going, we want to see how his car runs now with 3.73's in place of the 3.55's, upper and lower control arms, and an electric fan- this way we have a new base time before we put on his Holley kit. Email me and let me know if you're going.

------------------
95 GT convt' 5 speed, 3.73's,FMS HD clutch, Pro 5.0 shifter, ASP alum. underdrive pulleys, Bassani offroad X pipe, 2 chmbr flowmasters, K&N w/o silencer, edelbrock performer intake, FRPP 65mm T-body, FRPP shorty headers, FRPP aluminum driveshaft.Hooker 4pt chrome car bar, Xenon/Wings West ground effects, custom interior
Best ET: 13.83
Best MPH: 98.55mph with Best 60': 1.91 on Nitto DR's
Homepage: <A HREF="http://www.angelfire.com/pa2/killercanary" TARGET=_blank>http://www.angelfire

04-12-2001, 10:49 PM	#1
Killercanary Registered Member Join Date: Nov 1999 Location: Altoona, PA Posts: 336	4.10's, subframes, and new traction lock = 4 tenths slower!?!? Well, I just got back from the track and I'm upset. Last year with the same setup I have now I was running consistent 13.8's at 98mph. The only thing I changed was: swapped out the 3.73's for 4.10, put in a new clutch pack in the traction lock, and added global west subframe connectors. My best time and mph tonight was a 14.265 at 96.98mph, but all my other passes were 14.3's. My 60' used to be 1.91-1.92, tonight my best was a 2.000. It seemed like it hooked up pretty well, but the 60' tells a different story. The thing I don't understand is that I had better 60's without subframe connectory, higher gears, and with a totally shot posi. I can account for almost an extra 100lbs that the car has this year as compared to last, but not .5 worth. I'm not real upset though as I hope these parts will help once I get the heads, cam, rockers, MAF, etc. on. Anyone have a clue though as to how I slowered down .5? ------------------ 95 GT convt' 5 speed, 3.73's,FMS HD clutch, Pro 5.0 shifter, ASP alum. underdrive pulleys, Bassani offroad X pipe, 2 chmbr flowmasters, K&N w/o silencer, edelbrock performer intake, FRPP 65mm T-body, FRPP shorty headers, FRPP aluminum driveshaft.Hooker 4pt chrome car bar, Xenon/Wings West ground effects, custom interior Best ET: 13.83 Best MPH: 98.55mph with Best 60': 1.91 on Nitto DR's Homepage: <A HREF="http://www.angelfire.com/pa2/killercanary" TARGET=_blank>http://www.angelfire [This message has been edited by Killercanary (edited 04-12-2001).]

04-12-2001, 11:12 PM	#2
NOS_Notch Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Fresno,CA. USA Posts: 384	My 60' used to be 1.91-1.92, tonight my best was a 2.000. I think you just answered it yourself..... there is 2 tenths plus your extra 100 lbs...another tenth.... Where are you shifting?? w/stock tach or lite??? I have a 5200 chip in my lite and it works best for me...you want to be done w/ your shift at about 5500 My timing is at 14* You don't sound too far off. My guess is you should be about 13.50's at around 100-102 mph. We have a similar setup(except i have a much lighter notchback)and my best on motor is 13.28 @ 104 Get some traction and you will be happy...your not shifting into 5th are you??? A lot of people will try to convinve you that w/ 4.10's you've run out of gear.... But your fine in 4th going all the way..about 5500-5700 ------------------ 4.10's,long tubes & 75 shot...Goes 12.50's Check it out at http://www.burnouts.webprovider.com

04-13-2001, 05:43 AM	#3
exgmguy Registered Member Join Date: Feb 1999 Location: Utica, Michigan Posts: 2,631	Sounds like you are just spinning more with the taller gear.

04-13-2001, 07:14 PM	#4
93CobraR Registered Member Join Date: Oct 1999 Location: Cincinnati, Ohio Posts: 1,575	Also the 4.10's take you threw the trap at about 5600 or more right? before you went threw lower, the more rpms the car turns over 5400 or so your just losing power. After my new heads it really helped my times. I gained 3 mph and .5 after just GT-40's no intake or anything else. So that could also be why your slower. ------------------ 87 GT, 4 inch cowl hood,17x9 Cobra R's/255/45's,GT-40 heads,long tubes headers,h-pipe,Flows,BBK cold air, Mass air,70mm MAF, 1.7's, 1" spacer,underdrive pulleys,Pro 5.0, King Cobra, Adj. fuel Reg., Lakewood Lift Bars,50/50's,subframes, 4.10's. Best time 12.96 Best MPH 103.42 Best 60' 1.695 Visit my site at: http://www.geocities.com/cobrar93_2000/MyPage.html

04-14-2001, 03:54 PM	#5
Killercanary Registered Member Join Date: Nov 1999 Location: Altoona, PA Posts: 336	I think some has to do with the launch, but if I was cutting 1.91 60's with practically only one wheel working and with a higher gear and no subframes in my convertible, I would surely think I would have launched better now with 4.10's, new clutch pack, and subframe connectors. I couldn't get better than a 2.000 60'. The car would either bog, spin or result in tons of wheelhop which has never happened before. I used to just dump the clutch and it would hook and go, but now at the same rpm launch it spins, so on my last run I slipped the clutch slightly till it started to roll and then dumped it- it started to hook than I got tons of wheel hop, like I said my car has never wheel hopped before. Any ideas why its doing this now? Also, I'm only crossing at around 5400-5500, before it was like 5000-5100rpms, so I think I'm not that far into the upper rpm range to make this much of a dramatic effect on my times. I just can't wait till I get my FTI cam so I can tear down the motor and put it on along with my new AFR heads, injectors, MAF, etc!!! ------------------ 95 GT convt' 5 speed, 3.73's,FMS HD clutch, Pro 5.0 shifter, ASP alum. underdrive pulleys, Bassani offroad X pipe, 2 chmbr flowmasters, K&N w/o silencer, edelbrock performer intake, FRPP 65mm T-body, FRPP shorty headers, FRPP aluminum driveshaft.Hooker 4pt chrome car bar, Xenon/Wings West ground effects, custom interior Best ET: 13.83 Best MPH: 98.55mph with Best 60': 1.91 on Nitto DR's Homepage: <A HREF="http://www.angelfire.com/pa2/killercanary" TARGET=_blank>http://www.angelfire

04-14-2001, 04:11 PM	#6
Skyman I need 110mph Trap Speed! Join Date: Feb 1999 Location: So, CA Posts: 4,315	Killer- I really dont think there is anything to worry about here. You lost maybe 1mph at the most. That could just come from the extra 100lbs. Or any other factor. I wouldn't worry about any of this. Your car still runs great and I think you're going to be really happy once you get the new heads/cam in. 5400rpm is pretty high for stock heads. My car I get best results shifting at 5600. I think 5000 was probably a lot better. Anyways, good luck, and I'm looking forward to the results after everything is done. Sky ------------------ -1989 Saleen Mustang #406- TFS Heads, E-303, edelbrock intake,70MM TB, 73mm MAF, off road H, headers and 3chamber flows. 12.55@107mph Runs on 87 Octane and gets 24mpg!

04-15-2001, 10:55 PM	#7
Killercanary Registered Member Join Date: Nov 1999 Location: Altoona, PA Posts: 336	I too think I may be a little high in the rev's for the stock heads now after realizing my HP peaked at 4800 on the dyno. I shift the first 3 gears at 5200rpms, which has always yielded my best times before. I hope your right that it will all pay off soon. The only thing that confuses me is that I still thought that I would pick up from the the 330' to 1/8th mile and more with the 4.10's as they are helping me get all 3700+lbs up and moving quicker, but I can't see any substantial improvement. The gears make the car feel at least 200lbs lighter than before. If you would have told me that I would have noticed this much with a jump of only one gear ratio I wouldn't have believed it, but it made quite a difference. I'm itching like you can't believe to put on my heads and stuff. I even thought about putting the heads, rockers, and the rest on except for the cam for now till I get the cam, but then I looked under my hood at everything I'd have to do twice- I think I'll just grit my teeth and bear it. I hope I hear word soon on the cam, I know it'll be worth the wait from what all the other guys are getting out of their combo's with Ed's cams. ------------------ 95 GT convt' 5 speed, 3.73's,FMS HD clutch, Pro 5.0 shifter, ASP alum. underdrive pulleys, Bassani offroad X pipe, 2 chmbr flowmasters, K&N w/o silencer, edelbrock performer intake, FRPP 65mm T-body, FRPP shorty headers, FRPP aluminum driveshaft.Hooker 4pt chrome car bar, Xenon/Wings West ground effects, custom interior Best ET: 13.83 Best MPH: 98.55mph with Best 60': 1.91 on Nitto DR's Homepage: <A HREF="http://www.angelfire.com/pa2/killercanary" TARGET=_blank>http://www.angelfire

04-16-2001, 05:03 PM	#8
Dark Knight Registered Member Join Date: Oct 1998 Location: Az Posts: 854	I wouldnt worry about it.. the gears are running you out of the RPM range for now... as for the 60ft.. it might have just been track prep too... the wheel hop is probably because you are getting into the torque range sooner than before... ------------------ 84 convt,'95 302,AFR's, performer 3.55's, underdrives stock shorties stock cam, 1.7's 14.06@100.21, 255RWHP on a hot day 265 on the mph/weight chart

04-17-2001, 12:46 AM	#9
blacksunshine88GT Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: elizabeth,pa,usa Posts: 7	hey paul its greco just lettin you know that i have a mustang works name now look for me and write back !!!!!

04-17-2001, 07:50 PM	#10
Killercanary Registered Member Join Date: Nov 1999 Location: Altoona, PA Posts: 336	Hey Greco- I checked out your site and sent you an email, but I never heard from you. Are you going to Keystone this week? The weather looks good, but its gonna be pretty cold, like in the 40's during the day and a chilly high 20's at night. We should run good MPH, but traction will definitely be a problem, at least for me. I think my dad and I are going, we want to see how his car runs now with 3.73's in place of the 3.55's, upper and lower control arms, and an electric fan- this way we have a new base time before we put on his Holley kit. Email me and let me know if you're going. ------------------ 95 GT convt' 5 speed, 3.73's,FMS HD clutch, Pro 5.0 shifter, ASP alum. underdrive pulleys, Bassani offroad X pipe, 2 chmbr flowmasters, K&N w/o silencer, edelbrock performer intake, FRPP 65mm T-body, FRPP shorty headers, FRPP aluminum driveshaft.Hooker 4pt chrome car bar, Xenon/Wings West ground effects, custom interior Best ET: 13.83 Best MPH: 98.55mph with Best 60': 1.91 on Nitto DR's Homepage: <A HREF="http://www.angelfire.com/pa2/killercanary" TARGET=_blank>http://www.angelfire