To all Members

chuck88 · 10-10-2002, 05:23 PM

A surgeing idle seemed to be a common problem. Please list your solutions, whether you are mass air or not, and the modifications you have.

Thanks

Chuck88GT

Superpromustang · 10-10-2002, 05:42 PM

I converted my 88 to mass air because of the surging idle problem. After I did the conversion I noticed it idled better, but was still surging a bit. I set the timing to what I wanted to run, then I disconnnected my IAB and set the idle to 1000 rpm's (recommended for any cam other than stock), then I shut the motor off, turned the key on, but didn't start it, and set my TPS voltage to .99 volts. This fixed my surging idle. Later on about three months later it started surging again, I called Pro-M to see if they had any suggestions, and they said that the oil from the K&N was causing the mass air sensor to take falst readings. they told me to spray the element with glass cleaner and let it dry, and wash all the oil out of the filter, every since then my car has idled just fine, and I'm running the trickflow stage 2 cam. I still can't do a running test on it though. Hope this helps.

Kenny

88workcar · 10-10-2002, 06:10 PM

Mine still surges. I did do the same as super pro. That works great. Mine only surges s o m e t i m e so I don't worry about it. I hope you do get yours perfect.

joe4speed · 10-11-2002, 03:22 AM

LOL I converted to mass air as well, it surged for about 20 miles after that and it never did it again!

ImportKiller · 10-11-2002, 01:18 PM

Hey im having the same problem, at idle is surges but i think it only does it when its cold?

it just started to do this, i have a K&N filter too but i only have had it for about 6mos, how often are you supposed to clean those things?

Thanks guys

bigred90gt · 10-11-2002, 01:44 PM

I had the same problem, except mine was after it wared up. After a month or so, it started falling off even worse, until one day she kicked the bucket. I ended up replacing the dist and the EGR valve and cleaning out my intake manifold and IAB valve. I don't know what fixed it, I just know it wouldn't crank till I replaced the dist. I would have to say it was the EGR valve. Disconnect the vacuum line to the EGR valve and hook up a vacuum pump. Pull 10" of vacuum. The engine should stumble heavily. If not, replace the EGR valve.

MEDIK418 · 10-11-2002, 11:14 PM

My son's 89 was doing the same thing after he added a conical K&N filter. The problem was he added it to the plumbing just ahead of the Pro-M bullet. It would surge so bad that after about three-four cycles it would just die. I took the filter off and left the intake open and it died on the first surge. Adding a 7 inch "play-pipe" between the MAF and the filter almost stopped the surge but it's still there every once in a while. I put the stock airbox back on and it stopped completely. I am guessing here but, you can do the same thing to a flow meter run on a fire pump. If the fluid flow is turbulent enough it will intermittently miss the metering part of the pipe and cause a bad reading. This apparently does the same thing with the MAF. Adding enough smooth pipe ahead of the MAF smooths out the flow enough so that the small portion of the pipe that actually takes the airflow sample will get plenty of air sample. Anyway, it worked for my particular application. Not advocating doing away with the cold
air but it might explain why this causes surges.

Superpromustang · 10-11-2002, 11:52 PM

Honestly guys, I think anything other than a stock cam, we're gonna have surging problems at idle when the motor is cold. It takes mine about two minutes or so to stop surging after it warms up. But I think the way you set the idle has alot to do with it. If setting the idle at 1000 doesn't work, set it a little higher. Also I noticed something else, when the motor is at operating temperature, the IAB is inactive, at least mine is. I unplugged it after the motor warmed up, and it didn't change the idle at all. And don't use any TPS but a Motorcraft, the one's you get at autozone and Oreilly's are a joke.

MEDIK418 · 10-12-2002, 12:04 AM

I guess there's something to that theory. I failed to mention the engine has an F-303 cam in it but it didn't surge at all until the filter change and after replacing the stock airbox. . .it went away.

10-10-2002, 05:23 PM	#1
chuck88 Registered Member Join Date: May 1999 Location: Wood Ridge NJ USA Posts: 341	To all Members A surgeing idle seemed to be a common problem. Please list your solutions, whether you are mass air or not, and the modifications you have. Thanks Chuck88GT

10-10-2002, 06:10 PM	#3
88workcar Registered Member Join Date: Oct 1999 Location: Pierre Part, La. U.S.A. Posts: 1,850	Mine still surges. I did do the same as super pro. That works great. Mine only surges s o m e t i m e so I don't worry about it. I hope you do get yours perfect. __________________ 88workcar 1988 Mustang LX 342. 417rwhp @ 6800. 28 X 10 ET Drag, 4.30s, 10.69 @ 126.43 1.42 60ft. 11.13 @ 127.7 on BFGs 1.72 60ft Rice Hater # 42 To be old and wise, You must first be young and stupid I'm somewhere in tthe middle.

10-11-2002, 03:22 AM	#4
joe4speed He said Member...heh, heh Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: Jupiter, Florida U.S.A. Posts: 3,718	LOL I converted to mass air as well, it surged for about 20 miles after that and it never did it again! __________________ *Joe!* 1988 GT, 13.58@101mph Check out my listing! Click here! Or my website:www.joe4speed.com

10-11-2002, 01:18 PM	#5
ImportKiller Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Chula vista, CA Posts: 67	Hey im having the same problem, at idle is surges but i think it only does it when its cold? it just started to do this, i have a K&N filter too but i only have had it for about 6mos, how often are you supposed to clean those things? Thanks guys __________________ "Of all the gin joints in all the towns in all the world, she walks into mine." http://geocities.com/team340maxim 1989 Mustang LX 5.0 JBA Headers, Bassani X-Pipe Mac 3' Catback system.

10-11-2002, 01:44 PM	#6
bigred90gt 2 Stangs in the Stable Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Baytown, TX Posts: 1,209	I had the same problem, except mine was after it wared up. After a month or so, it started falling off even worse, until one day she kicked the bucket. I ended up replacing the dist and the EGR valve and cleaning out my intake manifold and IAB valve. I don't know what fixed it, I just know it wouldn't crank till I replaced the dist. I would have to say it was the EGR valve. Disconnect the vacuum line to the EGR valve and hook up a vacuum pump. Pull 10" of vacuum. The engine should stumble heavily. If not, replace the EGR valve. __________________ '90 GT Under construction Best E.T. = Fast @ High Speeds - OK So I Lie. So What!!! 04 F-150 STX 4.2L 5 spd Rice Haters Club Member #128

10-10-2002, 05:42 PM	#2
Superpromustang Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Carthage, MO Posts: 59	I converted my 88 to mass air because of the surging idle problem. After I did the conversion I noticed it idled better, but was still surging a bit. I set the timing to what I wanted to run, then I disconnnected my IAB and set the idle to 1000 rpm's (recommended for any cam other than stock), then I shut the motor off, turned the key on, but didn't start it, and set my TPS voltage to .99 volts. This fixed my surging idle. Later on about three months later it started surging again, I called Pro-M to see if they had any suggestions, and they said that the oil from the K&N was causing the mass air sensor to take falst readings. they told me to spray the element with glass cleaner and let it dry, and wash all the oil out of the filter, every since then my car has idled just fine, and I'm running the trickflow stage 2 cam. I still can't do a running test on it though. Hope this helps. Kenny

10-11-2002, 11:14 PM	#7
MEDIK418 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 1999 Location: Amarillo, Texas, USA Posts: 780	My son's 89 was doing the same thing after he added a conical K&N filter. The problem was he added it to the plumbing just ahead of the Pro-M bullet. It would surge so bad that after about three-four cycles it would just die. I took the filter off and left the intake open and it died on the first surge. Adding a 7 inch "play-pipe" between the MAF and the filter almost stopped the surge but it's still there every once in a while. I put the stock airbox back on and it stopped completely. I am guessing here but, you can do the same thing to a flow meter run on a fire pump. If the fluid flow is turbulent enough it will intermittently miss the metering part of the pipe and cause a bad reading. This apparently does the same thing with the MAF. Adding enough smooth pipe ahead of the MAF smooths out the flow enough so that the small portion of the pipe that actually takes the airflow sample will get plenty of air sample. Anyway, it worked for my particular application. Not advocating doing away with the cold air but it might explain why this causes surges. __________________ 1986 four-eyed LX coupe, 358 Cleveland, Tremec TKO600/centerforce clutch, dish cut Probe forged pistons, comp cams hyd.roller cam, .579/.588@224/230, Edel.performer, 670 holley street avenger, CPR custom built long tubes, ported and polished 4bbl heads, manley valves, beehive springs, MSD peo-billet dist/MSD6AL, fluidamper, 5 lug conv. with 17x8 bullits there's more but it's still not finished yet. Oh, and the oldest boy is turning his 89 GT into a FFR cobra this next summer.

10-11-2002, 11:52 PM	#8
Superpromustang Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Carthage, MO Posts: 59	Honestly guys, I think anything other than a stock cam, we're gonna have surging problems at idle when the motor is cold. It takes mine about two minutes or so to stop surging after it warms up. But I think the way you set the idle has alot to do with it. If setting the idle at 1000 doesn't work, set it a little higher. Also I noticed something else, when the motor is at operating temperature, the IAB is inactive, at least mine is. I unplugged it after the motor warmed up, and it didn't change the idle at all. And don't use any TPS but a Motorcraft, the one's you get at autozone and Oreilly's are a joke.

10-12-2002, 12:04 AM	#9
MEDIK418 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 1999 Location: Amarillo, Texas, USA Posts: 780	I guess there's something to that theory. I failed to mention the engine has an F-303 cam in it but it didn't surge at all until the filter change and after replacing the stock airbox. . .it went away. __________________ 1986 four-eyed LX coupe, 358 Cleveland, Tremec TKO600/centerforce clutch, dish cut Probe forged pistons, comp cams hyd.roller cam, .579/.588@224/230, Edel.performer, 670 holley street avenger, CPR custom built long tubes, ported and polished 4bbl heads, manley valves, beehive springs, MSD peo-billet dist/MSD6AL, fluidamper, 5 lug conv. with 17x8 bullits there's more but it's still not finished yet. Oh, and the oldest boy is turning his 89 GT into a FFR cobra this next summer.

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