Is an auto-matic faster?
 

I can buy a AOD. It is built to the hilt, 2 converters, flex plate, c-4 gear ratio, oil cooler, shifter,SEF bell housing or scatter shield thing, ect... In my car with the ET and MPH that I run, Lets use the 11. 90s pass, Will an auto make a better ET? I know it will kill MPH, but WILL the ET pick up? Also will this tranny live under every-day use?

My car ran faster with an AOD than it did with a T-5, 13.34@105 with the T-5, and 13.22@ 109 with an AOD and stock torque converter, 12.70@108 with a 3800 stall converter. How do you have c-4 gears in an AOD?

YES

ok, this is the way that i look at it.

if someone can drive a 5 speed perfect, then it will go good until about 12.20's then after that i think its time to go auto. i would look into a c4 though instead of the aod, but you said everyday use so your most likely gonna want the od.

so in your case yeah i would go auto

I was always taught that 5 spds are quicker if you can drive them, but autos are more consistent. If you are bracket racing and trying to match your dial in, go auto. If you are just a speed freak, I would stay 5 spd, but thats just me.

Caymon

I manual trans will take less power to drive, and put more to the ground. It will also give you a extra gear to keep in in the power longer. If you are a exellent driver with a good clutch setup you will always be faster then a auto on the same car.

A auto will last longer with the hard abuse on the track, and is easier to stay consistent. I manual can be just a consistent but you have to be good. A auto can be bolted in and go which is nice. A manual needs to be tweaked a little before you can get the best out of it.

If you are faster in a auto this is why...
1. You can't drive good
2. The weight break you get
3. inproper clutch setup

This will apply to a hard core race car to. You can take your fully worked auto with all the bells and whistles, and I'll take a liberty 5 speed. We will see who wins.:D

I'm partial to liberty's myself too. :D

i just might have to get me some straight cut gears :D

OK, Why does and auto 11.60 @ 113 and me and several others run 111-113 and run 12.20 - 11.90s. My 60ft is better than the guy with the auto, .05 better. Why does he Et so good. I also know someone that runs 12.0 at 99, with an auto.

I'm not saying that a auto will make your car slow, I am just saying that it will be faster with a manual and a good driver.

There is so much stuff to look at in finding out why your friend is faster. Are you sure the cars weigh the sams? Are you sure they make the exact same power throughout the rpm range? Are you sure you are shifting at the right time? Are your shifts fast? This is just the tip if the iceburg for the problem solving.

I never said it was easy to be faster with a manual, there is allot of work to get it all right. If the question was "what is the most simple way to go fast" I would say go with the auto.

To do some bench racing here there was a artical that i read in carcraft. They had a 70 something camaro with a built motor runing in the 10's someware (i think). They had a fulley worked auto just for drag racing, and a jerico DR4 with a adjustable clutch to swap in and test which one will NET more power, and a better ET. The jerico freed up like 15hp to the wheels and was a .10 faster at the big end then the auto. It took them a while to get all the bugs worked out, but when they did it was always faster then any time thay could lay down with the auto.

A manual isnt always faster no matter what the driver. A c-4 with the proper convertor/ cam/ gearing combination will fly. With an auto with a high stall it allows you to reach your powerband much faster and stay in it much longer. I actually had talked to Ed Curtis about this the other day and he said that with my combiniation after i get my heads on and get one of his cams in it, I would be faster with the c-4 because of where my powerband is and how long I will be in it, and how fast i will get to it. I mean granted, driver makes a big difference but I have raped alot of
5-speed cars with similar combinations. Actually the only 2 mustangs that Ive lost to were two of my friends who both run mid 11's with there c-4 all motor 302's. I should be right there with them after i get my AFR's on and my Systemax and FTI cam.

A manual will always show higher H.P. numbers on a dyno but high H.P numbers dont always = low e.t.'s
Another full wieght foxbody car Ed told me about was a c-4 car that he had in the 11's that only had 293 RWHP on the dyno. Peak horsepower isnt everything. Look at the horsepower made across the rpm band and take an average at 500 rpm intervals.

just my thoughts...


'

As stated above, you can stay in the peak power zone all the way down the track with a auto.

How much HP you are planning to make will determine what type of trans you should use.

If you are not making gobs of HP then a manual and lots of practice are the best method for getting down the track fast. You dont want to lose any of your valuable horsepower in an automatic setup.

On the other hand if you are making some really big numbers on the dyno sacraficing some of that power to have the easy launches....and if its a good trans it should shift fast enough to still rip the tires(about as fast as you could want it to shift). While a perfect launch and perfect shifts will still be faster...I would take an automatic with this kind of 500hp beast in a race with an automatic 9 times out of 10.

Ed knows his stuff but I don't agree with him. Yes I know max hp will not win the race, and i also know that a auto can keep it in the power curve eaiser. While the auto is keeping it in the power it is doing it by leting the converter slip which is pissing all that hp out the window.
Ed is also comparing a full race C4 to your tipical 5 speed, yes that would be faster. I am saying if you want to compare lets do it fair. A tipical 5 speed (t5, tremec, etc...) is comparable to a aod with a 3000rpm stall and a good valve body, do we agree? Good, because the 5 speed will be a better choice in that situation. Ok, if you want to through in a 5500-6500 stall, trans break, and a airshifter It is only fair that I get to run a liberty 5-speed, with a multi disk clutch, and a v-gate shifter. There is no way in hell that a the auto would win. While the auto is slipping the converter with it's 3 little gears to keep it in the power the manual will have a direct drive with the trans and 5 gears to keep it in the power.

I cant speak for the AOD but when I changed out my Tremec for a C4,my times got better,I ran a previous best of 12.40 with the Tremec and first pass with the C4 was a 12.21,and improved to 12.11,I have a TCI C4 with a 3800 stall 10" converter,I also thought my times would suffer going to Ao\uto but they didnt ,was a pleasant suprise,your situation may be different but I am very pleased with the auto conversion and my times have crunched up very consistently.( and before anyone says it,yes I can drive the hell out of a clutch)...LOL this is my FIRST race auto,I have been racing Jericho's for years. and Merry Christmas to everyone :)

The guy I am refering to has more power than me. I am a 1000 lbs lighter. I have a simple tremac 3550. The auto I am getting is a AOD, c-4 gear ratio, trans brake, 3000-3500, and 4500-5000 converters, scattershield, oil cooler, and quite a few other pieces. This is why I am asking, will this be ok for every day use? I an also adding 100hp to my package:D

Just an example for you guys to ponder....

I have been looking into getting involved in the NMRA Renegade class, but found out that they will only allow auto's next year.

I inquired as to the reason they changed the rules, and the response I recieved was that the stick cars have an advantage over the autos ;)

Simple enough. All things being equal, a stick car has an advantage over an auto car. Nuff said. :cool:

-Ryan

In Street Warrior this year, AODs won seven of the ten events. Our Lentech equipped car qualified #1 at six of seven events attended and brought home two of those wins. The AODs enjoyed a 200-lb weight advantage, 2900# versus 3100# for the sticks, but in 2003 that has been reduced to 100#. With S/W cars going in the mid-10's next season, I really look for more cars to make the switch to the AOD. Since our class rules state that the stick cars cannot be clutchless, the AOD has an efficiency advantage IMHO. With the lock-up of my Lentech, I'm at 1:1 in third gear with no converter slip....just like the stick guys. But I get a softer hit on the tires out of the hole and get the torque multiplication of the converter to help get me rolling. My car had some of the best 60' times in the class this year. We set the ET record twice and MPH record at least five times, and held both when the record books were written at the end of the season.

Just like anything else with your car, it works for some but not for others. You won't find an absolute answer to your questions on the message boards.

Can't argue with that! Well, maybe I could bring up the use of adjustable pressure plates and sintered iron discs that allow for some initial slippage off the line, not hitting the tires as hard.... apparently the question at hand isn't a yes-no type of question. Too many variables to take into consideration. Although, you did mention that the autos get a weight break. ;) 200 lbs. = ~.20 sec. (all things being equal?)

Now, if I could only talk those NMRA boys into allowing my clutch assisted Jerico in the S/R class. :rolleyes: There's always FFW Renegade... or bracket racing. Heck, I just want to race, period.

They were actually talking about this today on Hot rod tv. They just ended up saying they felt that an auto is faster at the track and a stick is faster on the street. But there are so many variables that go in to this there isnt a yes or no answer.