E-303 idles mean as hell I thought it was a mild cam.
 

I thought my idle would be close to stock with the e-303 cam but it is pretty damn lumpy. Everything is set and tuned right on the car it is just alot more aggressive sounding than I thought it would be.

BTW: I do not reccommend this cam. It is a real PITA to get your car to idle without surging below 1000 rpms.

I had to drill a 3/16 inch hole in my throttle body flapper to get it to idle right. Anyone else have to do this?

I hope this cam performs well with my combo cause it sure was a BIOTCH to get everything right.

Later,

Are you going to have it dyno tuned? If so, a nice custom autologic chip can solve your idle woes.

E

Yeah, the 110* LSA gave for a pretty nice chop. I always got comments on my cam lope . I expected it to have a milder idle too.
I like my Comp XE 270HR a lot better, much more power in the middle and the idle has a much smaller lope.

Hey Dark
 

I know what you are talking about.
I opted for the "softer" LSA of the B-cam, but wanted the lift of the E, so I used 1.7 rr's with the B to get the E's lift.
It made tuning a lot easier. I love the way they sound though, mine idles at 750-800 and I always get some comments on it.

E-cam
 

yea i have an E-cam in my car and it sounds mean as hell....it lopes like a mad man.....i never had idle problems or anything like that ...just popped it in and ran great....much much more midrange power with 1.7 rr's.....later

I thought about going with 1.7 RR but with 2.02 1.60 valves and 54cc chambers I dont think I would have enough clearance.

I was told that the b was much more aggressive than the e. WHICH IS IT???



Oh,
Dark 5.0, I received the spacer yesterday. It's in great condition!

Unfortunately I can't use it yet. Overhead hood clearance has become an issue, but when I get a Cobra R SVO, it's going right on!

Thanks again

I run the B-cam with 1.7 rr's. It sounds nice, but like others I have trouble getting the idle just right. I kind of got sick of messing with it, so I have the idle turned up just above 1000 rpm so it doesn't surge. Sometimes the computer will kick it down to 800 or so. It sounds pretty mean then.

Re: E-303 idles mean as hell I thought it was a mild cam.
 

You thought an E-303 cam would be similar in sound to the stocker??!! :eek: Yeah, both the E & the B cams sound pretty lopey. I run the B w/ 1.72 roller rockers and love the way it sounds. I have my idle right around 1000rpms...maybe a little lower. It idles pretty smooth. Has anyone else had to drill a small hole in their butterfly of the throttle body?

I wasnt very happy about having to drill my throttle body but there was no other way.

I have heard e303 cams in stock engines and they didnt sound nearly as mean.

I think my free flowing engine and exhaust set-up have alot to do with how mean it sounds.

I like it now that I have it tuned right. But I damn sure cant get away with telling someone that its pretty much stock anymore:D

What crackhead told you it was mild? The lift is mild, but the LSA and duration show that it has a lope...I had it, hated it.

It IS a "mild" cam as far as performance goes. I commonly see B cammed cars performing better than E cammed cars on the street. Different power curve.

I never had any problems with mine though unless I ran A/C, but I fixed that because there were some busted vaccum lines coincidentally.

Did you disconnect the Idle Air Control valve to re-adjust your idle? Did you disconnect your computer so it could relearn everything? A cam is a big mod because it changes your a/f mixture.

The lope is cool, you will like it after a while....for me it actually wasn't lopey enough!

I was looking for a better than stock streetable cam and came across this e303 cam dirt cheap so I went ahead and threw it in there.

As long as I can run 12's and drive it on the street now and then I will be happy with it.

Yeah man of course I unplugged the idle sensor and reset the ecu.;)

I guess the dyno will tell the story.

e-cam
 

It is a pretty mild cam, if you guys remember i had a post about how i couldnt get my car to idle without surging/stalling?
That turned out to be the o2 sensors, also i had the idle set too low, now i have it idle about 900, sometimes it will drop down, and it sounds killer, i drive my car everyday, and havent had any idle problems since my old post.
Today my friend rolled up in his 93 gt with the new f-cam installed, that sucker was pretty lopey, made my car sound mild, but i think i can still whoop him:D

Dark5.0, it seems people that go to a bigger 2.02 valve aluminum head, and bigger cam, (like my friends 93) the exhaust note completley changes, that buddy of mine with the f-cam is about to get some turbo mufflers it's so damn loud:)
later......

I would have ran the F-cam but I dont think I have the clearance.

I may try putting 1.7 RR on the exhaust valves.

Don't Drill Holes In Your Throttle Body!!
 

Don't do it! Install an adjustable idle spacer instead. I put one on my lincoln last fall and have had no more problems setting the idle speed. There's one on e-bay for $19.00.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...category=33553

Have a geat day!
Russ

I loved my E cam it sounded good made good power and it was great for a daily driver. I then moved up to a trickflow stage 1 and it was very similar to the E cam as far as driveability and lope but it has a higher power band. I know have a B41 waiting to go in it should sound down right nasty.

Yeah the E-cam has a louder idle than the B or F cam. I think it sounds damn good. I put 1.72's on mine and it sounds real mean now. My car made great power from 2500 on up with the edelbrock intake and 1.6's on the E-cam. I switched to a systemax II intake and 1.7's and I lost a TON of lowend, probably a combo of both. I gained power maybe 300rpms higher than before. My car was dying off around 5600, now its more like 5900-6000. And now the power doesnt come on till about 3500, not nearly as fun. My buddy car has a TFS #1 and it just pulls and pulls to redline, but a little less lowend than my first combo on the E-Cam.

And yes its a ***** to get it to idle. My car idles around 1100 rpm now.

Whats the lift/duration on the TFS 1 cam? Would it go good with the Track heat intake and stock heads for now, and maybe eventually some twisted wedge/Track Heat or AFR 185's?

The trick flow stage 1 (off the top of my head) is 498 510 and 220 224

If you run the trackheat on stock heads run a 3/8 spacer to get some low end back (beause it is gonna be a mismatch with stock heads).

The F is a lopeier idle then the E....512 lift vs. .498 and 114 lobe vs. 112, and 288 duration vs. 284. I had a F and a E...the F pulls harder and lopes more.

Sky, I bet yours is louder because of the rockers...

I had an E cam in mine and I loved it with the car stock. I got a new cam that would provide higher RPM for my 306. An easy way to get a better idle for the E, is too get the Air idle bypass plate to adjust your idle. Also make sure that your TPS is set right with your throttle adjustment screw. .099 at idle and no higher than 4.50 volts at full throttle. Mine always idled well. It even sounded good in my current 306 but I needed more top end to take advantage of my stock heads that I got from Powerheads. Just thought I would add my opinion and thoughts.

Hmm Ive listened to an F-cammed car w/ flows like mine and mine was louder.

Skyler

Re: E-303 idles mean as hell I thought it was a mild cam.
 

quote:BTW: I do not reccommend this cam. It is a real PITA to get your car to idle without surging below 1000 rpms.

I had to drill a 3/16 inch hole in my throttle body flapper to get it to idle right. Anyone else have to do this?

I hope this cam performs well with my combo cause it sure was a BIOTCH to get everything right.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hey! It's really great that so many people are replying to this problem. Only one problem, though. Not one person has mentioned the obvious. The basic. Do you all need "cam swapping 101" for EFI cars. The EEC-IV must adjust itself to the new cam. It must compensate for the different vacuum, and more air that is now entering the cylinder. I've gone through 4 diff cams and each one took about 1 week or 70-100 starts before the ECU learned and made the proper adjustments. I'm not insulting anyone. I just think many of you overlooked the obvious.

I dont agree with you at all. My car idles perfectly at 750 rpms now.

We "all" understand perfectly well that the ecu has to learn with new mods but the ecu is not going to compenstae for 500 rpm surges. I gave it plenty of time. From Friday to Monday to be exact and it was still surging like a big dawg.

I have since repaired the hole I drilled in the throttle body and installed an idle adjuster. Its all good now.

Your car aint nothing like mine. 4 years, still idle problems. Tried it all. Set at 1200 rpm now, and still surges a bit.

My idle's been a little weird the last few since I advanced my timing from around 10* up to 14*advanced, the motor's completely stock and I performed the right computer reset procedure. ????? I still have to check the TPS, if it was off would that contribute to an occasional surging/high idle?

Yes it can. Especially if it over 1 volt at idle.

As goes for soon to be turbo, I would have to agree. (maybe I was lucky) but didn't have any idle problems. :confused: I also knew some tricks that worked too.
I have had several different Motorsport cams, and liked the E-cam the best. I personnaly thought the B-cam was the biggest joke,..no offense to the people running that cam. (that was also before the F-cam and Z-cam came out.) After the E-cam I always bought custom ground cams from Bennet or Panhandle Performance, with awsome luck. (Again no idle or surging problems).
Dark 5.0
As goes for the E-cam being mild,.. I don't really think it is for what you got. It all depends what you are comparing it with too. I now have a cam well over 250@ .050 duration! I now think my cam is mild at the stage I am at.
But I know the rump you are talking about and it brings back great memories. I think the E-cam gives off the best sound for a street car with out the to racey sound!;)
I don't think Dark 5.0 will have any problems running what you want with the combo you have. So good luck.
my 2 cents

Thank you,

It looks like march 13th will be my first track outting this year. Hoping for 12's......mid 12's.:D

I am with Sky...I had an E303 on my old motor(306). Before the blower it surged terrible and died when hitting corners with the A/C on...never cleared up. I tried everything, new vacuum, new ECU, different MAF and TB. They are not a good cam. MILD power at best. Dyno tests show the B making more power with the same mods.

Bigger ain't always better!

Ok, cool
Now I just want to understand something...did you use an E-cam with a supercharger??
Yes a b-cam will make more power with a power adder.
If with spray using more then 125 shot or a blower with 6 or more pounds or boost.
In a N/A combo an E-cam will make more power if tuned right with the right application, If not then it sounds like user error more then anything.
Right application is key!!!Would compose of a 5-speed, 3.73 gears or 4.10's, Good set of heads and intake., Comp. in the 9-9.5 range.
Cam installed correctley.
As goes for tune, the tps set to .950-.999, timing in the 16-19 btc. I have even seen 21! (I believe some factory balancers are off, but different subject). Right plugs for the heads and so on.

A lot of these thing I am sure you guys and girls already know.
And may have tried all of these things but still, just because you could not get it to work doesn't mean that it is a piece of shyte. All it means is that you could not tune the car! Is there easier combos to tune,...yes but still doesn't mean the other stuff is junk while a whole bunch of othere people are getting there cars to rock with the same parts as you.
later

Sorry man but I worked on it for years. I had MANY people that are fricken experts with mustangs try to tune it. The last guy did the best, and it idles steady around 1200 now with an occasional surge. Liveabile definatly but perfect no way. I like the powerband of the b-cam a lot more.

Skyler

Hey man, just out of curiosity if your still willing to give it a shot...
At your next fill up, fill it with 93 octane or more (I don't know what you have for pump gas) and fill it with that. After about a quarter tank gas, adjust your timing to 16-19 btc. (And don't forget to disconnect the spout connector;) ) Reset computer and the IAC because I want you to now, lower your idle. Set it to about 800-900 on a timing light, not your factory tach. Recheck your TPS and give it a full week. See if it helps. Can be more things but its not in front of me. (Kind of hard over the computer).
I do not claim to be an expert, and I claim to know nothing;) people tend to leave me along too. Know you say that the timing is way to much, don't stress. If it starts to ping with a moderate load then back it off 2 degrees. (But it shouldn't because I was able to run that much in an iron head combo.)
***
I assume you are not running your emission equiptment including your cats!! ****
This may all seem redundent but worth a shot.
Good luck and let me know.
Let me if you want.

Oh yea, don't get discourage if it dies out a couple of times at first. Give it 5 minutes first.

If I remember correctly I think skymans car put 330 to the wheels so the E cam is making good power even if it isnt ideal.

Strangely enough my car ran smoother with the speed density ecu:confused:

I had to jump in...
 

I have the B with 1.7's (so I get the lift of an E, but the advertised duration of the B) TW heads (not to mention supercharged) and it idles as of three hours ago, via a Snap-on 1222 Engine Diagnostic Computer between 790 and 820 RPM.
I was checking my firing(electronic) efficiency via the O-scope readout and RPM variation per cylinder.
I do have the IAB spacer with a new IAB bought about a year ago. I also have a A3M with a JMS chip setup. I am nowhere near my hp potential on my combo even at 8 lbs due to my oil issue on number 5.
After correcting my oil issue, which I hope is a valve seal, I hope to net somewhere around 10 percent more on the dyno curve.
That's with a B-cam that idles rock steady.
Good Luck... (oh, I have 44 degrees of total advance via the Snap-on too...Trick Flow recommends 36 but oh well)

44 degrees total advance with a suprcharger:eek:

Joke right??????

supercharger
 

The Vortech has been off of the car for some time until I figure out my oil loss/number 5 cylinder issue.

Since the supercharger is supplied via the same oil sump, the last thing I want to do is oil-starve it. I have heard (not personally experienced it yet) that supercharger failures due to lack of lubrication are not pretty and that it is easier to have happen than you would think. I don't want to take a chance with a 3k unit.

So, I am naturally aspirated for now, but after I fix this thing, re-install the Vortech and re-tune it, I am hoping to see somewhere around 450 rwhp @ 8 psi. I am installing "umbrella" style valve seals Friday on the problem cylinder.

What's up fellas? I just installed an E in my 92 with stock heads and rockers. Stock from the lower intake to the cats except for the headers. Can I use the 1.7 Cobra rockers and still have clearence? When I first started the car after clearing the KAM, it died a few times. I gave it a little gas until it stayed started and it doesn't surge. It's only been 2 hours though:D

Re: I had to jump in...
 

Huh?
you should be getting the lift of an f.....using 1.7's

I get more lift than b or f using mt cobra 1.7's, just not the duration.......

typo
 

good catch...
b-cam 480-480 224-224 110 LC (1.6's)
with 1.7's becomes 510...damn that's close on TF heads and Flat tops...:eek:
I think the f is 512 though? Pretty close though....

Re: typo
 

Isn't the b-cam a 112 LC & the e-cam a 110LC?

b-cam lc
 

you made me look it up to be sure...
bcam
480-480 224-224d 107-117 lc
ecam
498-498 220-220d 110-110lc
fcam
512-512 226-226d 109-109lc
xcam
542-542 224-224d 107-117lc

I read for guys with flat tops and non-stock valve angles, you can go as high a 535 and 230 duration and be okay.
But any duration over 230 becomes hard to tune for streetability (read daily driver)
I would be interested in hearing from guys with moderate lift cams over 230 duration to get some tips on tuning.

Where did you get the specs on the F cam? I heard it was a 112 LSA?

f specs
 

http://www.mindspring.com/~steveflyer/engine.htm
and the racer walsh catalog to be sure.

Thanks, for the link to the specs and that is a very nice website.

Thanks.

since u have nice heads an intake an ur gonna go with alph, cam i woulda went with X or Z far more performance than the rest especially with good flowin heads.. just my 2 cents

I dont have the clearance to run much of a a bigger cam. .530 is my limit

I run a Lunati Cam. It has .526in .530ex lift. and 221in 232ex at .050. 111 Lobe Separation. Its a really good cam.

I am surprised you can run that much lift with 49cc heads.

I check pistoin to valve and I promble could get a little more lift. The block is undecked. With those heads i have 10.5:1 compression.