HP & Track Time Guesstimate???

BowTie Eater 5 Liter · 02-03-2006, 05:26 PM

just ordered all the stuff to fix my oil pump issue, and a few other goodies

please dont flame me for i ordered this stuff because i am on a budget. by the time the car is back up and running it will have the following

edelbrock 60379's(wanted afr's but the 4-6 week wait and additional 500 bucks i cant justify it on my daily driver, so i got the heads and intake for the price of a set of afr's)
box stock cobra intake
(crane)e-303
1.7rr's
73mm c&l
70mm t-body
u/d pulleys
bbk 1-5/8 equal lengths
2.5 x pipe
2.5 magnaflow cat back
3.73's

Hozer 88GTConv · 02-03-2006, 06:19 PM

what's the total lift going to be? Man, I think that's going to be close with 1.7's on stock pistons...

BowTie Eater 5 Liter · 02-03-2006, 06:21 PM

.529 lift, it "should" work. ive been running that way with the e7's for a few months now no problems

Ieatcamaros · 02-03-2006, 09:57 PM

I have read that you can go .544 with stock pistons. Thing is, I don't remeber if that was with twisted wedge heads or not. Don't those heads have 1.90 intake valves in them? The e7's have 1.78 intake valves in them.

Dark_5.0 · 02-03-2006, 10:39 PM

It should run in the 12's and have somewhere around 290RWHP.

By the way my cam has .566 lift with stock pistons and Canfield heads with 2.02 valves.

Clearance has little to do with lift it has more to do with duration.

Gearhead999 · 02-04-2006, 06:26 AM

Dark_5.0, I think you should reread what you typed about piston to valve clearance having more to do with duration than lift.

Lift is the amount, distance, the valve opens.
Duration is the number of crankshaft degrees that the valve stays open.

The valves and the pistons need to clear one another at all times, with the engine in time. If the engine goes out of time, now that's a different story. As in jumped chain/belt, broke chain/belt or poor installation.

Dark_5.0 · 02-04-2006, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gearhead999

Dark_5.0, I think you should reread what you typed about piston to valve clearance having more to do with duration than lift.

Lift is the amount, distance, the valve opens.
Duration is the number of crankshaft degrees that the valve stays open.

The valves and the pistons need to clear one another at all times, with the engine in time. If the engine goes out of time, now that's a different story. As in jumped chain/belt, broke chain/belt or poor installation.

No matter how many times I re-read it I will still be correct.

When the intake valve is open the piston is on the down stroke. It is when the valve stays open too long (Duration) that you have problems.

This is coming from Ed Curtis who is a cam building God in the mustang world.

Gearhead999 · 02-05-2006, 11:16 AM

Not to get into a flame war here.
You are right that the intake valve is opened when the piston is on its downstroke [intake stroke] and there interferance isn't a problem.

But, the intake valve, many times, on performance cams opens before top dead center [BTDC] and closes after bottom dead center [AFDC]. I pasted part of a cam spec card for a Crane Hyd Roller HR-216-325-2S-12.

You can see that the Intake valve opens at 28.0 degrees BTDC and closes at 70.0 degrees ABDC. That is why I would be concerned about valve to piston clearance at TDC. And the Exhaust valve opens 76.0 before bottome dead center [BBDC] and closes at 30.0 degrees after top dead center [ATDC]. So the valves are open at TDC, where clearance becomes an issue.

Lift: Intake @Cam 325 @Valve 520 All Lifts are based
on zero lash and theoretical rocker arm ratios.
Exhaust @ Cam 339 @Valve 542
Rocker Arm Ratio 1.60

Cam Timing: TAPPET @.004
Lift: Opens Closes ADV Duration
Intake 28.0 BTDC 70.0 ABDC 278.0 °
Exhaust 76.0 BBDC 30.0 ATDC 286.0 °

Take care, Go STEELERS !!!!

BowTie Eater 5 Liter · 02-05-2006, 11:33 PM

ok, im getting uber confused here. ive had no problems with p-v clearance with the stock heads. in running the crane 1.7rr's and crane e cam.

rwhite65 · 02-06-2006, 04:00 AM

Bascially, from what Dark 5.O is running on his combination, it looks like you SHOULD be ok with valve clearance.

I also have the e7's, but run the TFS-1. Good luck and enjoy your new heads.
Ryan

BowTie Eater 5 Liter · 02-06-2006, 01:16 PM

thanks for the help r white and everyone else!

Dark_5.0 · 02-06-2006, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gearhead999

Not to get into a flame war here.
You are right that the intake valve is opened when the piston is on its downstroke [intake stroke] and there interferance isn't a problem.

But, the intake valve, many times, on performance cams opens before top dead center [BTDC] and closes after bottom dead center [AFDC]. I pasted part of a cam spec card for a Crane Hyd Roller HR-216-325-2S-12.

You can see that the Intake valve opens at 28.0 degrees BTDC and closes at 70.0 degrees ABDC. That is why I would be concerned about valve to piston clearance at TDC. And the Exhaust valve opens 76.0 before bottome dead center [BBDC] and closes at 30.0 degrees after top dead center [ATDC]. So the valves are open at TDC, where clearance becomes an issue.

Lift: Intake @Cam 325 @Valve 520 All Lifts are based
on zero lash and theoretical rocker arm ratios.
Exhaust @ Cam 339 @Valve 542
Rocker Arm Ratio 1.60

Cam Timing: TAPPET @.004
Lift: Opens Closes ADV Duration
Intake 28.0 BTDC 70.0 ABDC 278.0 °
Exhaust 76.0 BBDC 30.0 ATDC 286.0 °

Take care, Go STEELERS !!!!

They go hand in hand you can get away with a lot of lift if you limit the duration and you can get away with alot of duration if you limit the lift.

Go Referee's

88workcar · 02-20-2006, 08:27 AM

Bow tie eater. Diff subject. Your profile says best 60ft 2.1, work on this first. You will be shocked at your 1/4 times when you start knocking down some 1.6 60fters. A good holeshot has whooped many-a-man.

BowTie Eater 5 Liter · 02-20-2006, 08:44 AM

workcar, the 2.1 was like 4 years ago with my first mustang, ive been working on the launch big time, but going to invest in some slicks or dr's

02-03-2006, 05:26 PM	#1
BowTie Eater 5 Liter Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Maple Ridge B.C. Canada, The Best Place In The World Posts: 871	HP & Track Time Guesstimate??? just ordered all the stuff to fix my oil pump issue, and a few other goodies please dont flame me for i ordered this stuff because i am on a budget. by the time the car is back up and running it will have the following edelbrock 60379's(wanted afr's but the 4-6 week wait and additional 500 bucks i cant justify it on my daily driver, so i got the heads and intake for the price of a set of afr's) box stock cobra intake (crane)e-303 1.7rr's 73mm c&l 70mm t-body u/d pulleys bbk 1-5/8 equal lengths 2.5 x pipe 2.5 magnaflow cat back 3.73's __________________ 1984 Bronco II, 36" Michelin Military Tires, 95 EFI 5.0, NP435 Tranny, NP208 Doubler, NP205 Transfer Case, Fill Size Solid Dana 44 Front End, WH Progressive Rate Rock Crawling Coils, Bronco 8.8 Rear, Skyjacker Softride Leafs, 5.13 Gears, Detroit Locker. Final Crawl Ratio Of 175:1 88 GT Best 60ft. 2.181 Best ET 14.350 Best MPH 98.01 ~WRECKED!!!!~

02-03-2006, 06:19 PM	#2
Hozer 88GTConv Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Jacksonville, FL Posts: 706	Re: HP & Track Time Guesstimate??? what's the total lift going to be? Man, I think that's going to be close with 1.7's on stock pistons... __________________ 1988 GT Convertible 331 10:1 TW heads, GT-40 intake, MSD, TRW flattops, B Cam w/ 1.7's, MAC exhaust, 24's, 70 TB, 76 MAF, 3.73's, Pro 5.0, Koni's, Anderson PMS, Wideband 02, yatta, yatta... One week with new motor, two speeding tickets...joy

02-03-2006, 06:21 PM	#3
BowTie Eater 5 Liter Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Maple Ridge B.C. Canada, The Best Place In The World Posts: 871	Re: HP & Track Time Guesstimate??? .529 lift, it "should" work. ive been running that way with the e7's for a few months now no problems __________________ 1984 Bronco II, 36" Michelin Military Tires, 95 EFI 5.0, NP435 Tranny, NP208 Doubler, NP205 Transfer Case, Fill Size Solid Dana 44 Front End, WH Progressive Rate Rock Crawling Coils, Bronco 8.8 Rear, Skyjacker Softride Leafs, 5.13 Gears, Detroit Locker. Final Crawl Ratio Of 175:1 88 GT Best 60ft. 2.181 Best ET 14.350 Best MPH 98.01 ~WRECKED!!!!~

02-03-2006, 09:57 PM	#4
Ieatcamaros Domestic Rice really sucks! Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: KY Posts: 973	Re: HP & Track Time Guesstimate??? I have read that you can go .544 with stock pistons. Thing is, I don't remeber if that was with twisted wedge heads or not. Don't those heads have 1.90 intake valves in them? The e7's have 1.78 intake valves in them. __________________ The sig says it all.

02-03-2006, 10:39 PM	#5
Dark_5.0 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Staging lane Posts: 4,337	Re: HP & Track Time Guesstimate??? It should run in the 12's and have somewhere around 290RWHP. By the way my cam has .566 lift with stock pistons and Canfield heads with 2.02 valves. Clearance has little to do with lift it has more to do with duration. __________________ 92' LX-Big brakes, Lots and lots of suspension, GT40X heads, Ported cobra intake, stock cam, Vortech SC trim. 00' Lightning-Stock 88'CRX-13 second ego killer

02-04-2006, 06:26 AM	#6
Gearhead999 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 1998 Location: Oviedo, FL Posts: 992	Re: HP & Track Time Guesstimate??? Dark_5.0, I think you should reread what you typed about piston to valve clearance having more to do with duration than lift. Lift is the amount, distance, the valve opens. Duration is the number of crankshaft degrees that the valve stays open. The valves and the pistons need to clear one another at all times, with the engine in time. If the engine goes out of time, now that's a different story. As in jumped chain/belt, broke chain/belt or poor installation. __________________ "Support our Troops" Dave 1968 Cougar 2004 Thunderbird 2007 F150 Harley-Davidson, SuperCrew 1986 LTD 1997 Ranger 1992 Honda Civic

02-05-2006, 11:16 AM	#8
Gearhead999 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 1998 Location: Oviedo, FL Posts: 992	Re: HP & Track Time Guesstimate??? Not to get into a flame war here. You are right that the intake valve is opened when the piston is on its downstroke [intake stroke] and there interferance isn't a problem. But, the intake valve, many times, on performance cams opens before top dead center [BTDC] and closes after bottom dead center [AFDC]. I pasted part of a cam spec card for a Crane Hyd Roller HR-216-325-2S-12. You can see that the Intake valve opens at 28.0 degrees BTDC and closes at 70.0 degrees ABDC. That is why I would be concerned about valve to piston clearance at TDC. And the Exhaust valve opens 76.0 before bottome dead center [BBDC] and closes at 30.0 degrees after top dead center [ATDC]. So the valves are open at TDC, where clearance becomes an issue. Lift: Intake @Cam 325 @Valve 520 All Lifts are based on zero lash and theoretical rocker arm ratios. Exhaust @ Cam 339 @Valve 542 Rocker Arm Ratio 1.60 Cam Timing: TAPPET @.004 Lift: Opens Closes ADV Duration Intake 28.0 BTDC 70.0 ABDC 278.0 ° Exhaust 76.0 BBDC 30.0 ATDC 286.0 ° Take care, Go STEELERS !!!! __________________ "Support our Troops" Dave 1968 Cougar 2004 Thunderbird 2007 F150 Harley-Davidson, SuperCrew 1986 LTD 1997 Ranger 1992 Honda Civic

02-05-2006, 11:33 PM	#9
BowTie Eater 5 Liter Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Maple Ridge B.C. Canada, The Best Place In The World Posts: 871	Re: HP & Track Time Guesstimate??? ok, im getting uber confused here. ive had no problems with p-v clearance with the stock heads. in running the crane 1.7rr's and crane e cam. __________________ 1984 Bronco II, 36" Michelin Military Tires, 95 EFI 5.0, NP435 Tranny, NP208 Doubler, NP205 Transfer Case, Fill Size Solid Dana 44 Front End, WH Progressive Rate Rock Crawling Coils, Bronco 8.8 Rear, Skyjacker Softride Leafs, 5.13 Gears, Detroit Locker. Final Crawl Ratio Of 175:1 88 GT Best 60ft. 2.181 Best ET 14.350 Best MPH 98.01 ~WRECKED!!!!~

02-06-2006, 04:00 AM	#10
rwhite65 Ride Hard Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Wyoming IL Posts: 1,094	Re: HP & Track Time Guesstimate??? Bascially, from what Dark 5.O is running on his combination, it looks like you SHOULD be ok with valve clearance. I also have the e7's, but run the TFS-1. Good luck and enjoy your new heads. Ryan __________________ 65 Fastback 91 roller 306, H/C/I AOD-Bauman, PI Stallion, 4.10's and traction loc 04 Grand Cherokee Freedom Edition 79 Ford F-250 4x4 - Restored

02-06-2006, 01:16 PM	#11
BowTie Eater 5 Liter Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Maple Ridge B.C. Canada, The Best Place In The World Posts: 871	Re: HP & Track Time Guesstimate??? thanks for the help r white and everyone else! __________________ 1984 Bronco II, 36" Michelin Military Tires, 95 EFI 5.0, NP435 Tranny, NP208 Doubler, NP205 Transfer Case, Fill Size Solid Dana 44 Front End, WH Progressive Rate Rock Crawling Coils, Bronco 8.8 Rear, Skyjacker Softride Leafs, 5.13 Gears, Detroit Locker. Final Crawl Ratio Of 175:1 88 GT Best 60ft. 2.181 Best ET 14.350 Best MPH 98.01 ~WRECKED!!!!~

02-20-2006, 08:27 AM	#13
88workcar Registered Member Join Date: Oct 1999 Location: Pierre Part, La. U.S.A. Posts: 1,850	Re: HP & Track Time Guesstimate??? Bow tie eater. Diff subject. Your profile says best 60ft 2.1, work on this first. You will be shocked at your 1/4 times when you start knocking down some 1.6 60fters. A good holeshot has whooped many-a-man. __________________ 88workcar 1988 Mustang LX 342. 417rwhp @ 6800. 28 X 10 ET Drag, 4.30s, 10.69 @ 126.43 1.42 60ft. 11.13 @ 127.7 on BFGs 1.72 60ft Rice Hater # 42 To be old and wise, You must first be young and stupid I'm somewhere in tthe middle.

02-20-2006, 08:44 AM	#14
BowTie Eater 5 Liter Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Maple Ridge B.C. Canada, The Best Place In The World Posts: 871	Re: HP & Track Time Guesstimate??? workcar, the 2.1 was like 4 years ago with my first mustang, ive been working on the launch big time, but going to invest in some slicks or dr's __________________ 1984 Bronco II, 36" Michelin Military Tires, 95 EFI 5.0, NP435 Tranny, NP208 Doubler, NP205 Transfer Case, Fill Size Solid Dana 44 Front End, WH Progressive Rate Rock Crawling Coils, Bronco 8.8 Rear, Skyjacker Softride Leafs, 5.13 Gears, Detroit Locker. Final Crawl Ratio Of 175:1 88 GT Best 60ft. 2.181 Best ET 14.350 Best MPH 98.01 ~WRECKED!!!!~

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