Modded 90 LX vs 98 GT?
 

Just curious about how I should fair against my friends car. He has a 98 GT (4.6L V8) with a manual that runs strong, but is completely stock.

My car:
3.55 Gears
MAC Cold Air Intake
MAC 2.5 Cat-Back Exhaust
All ford racing wires
Auto tranny in perfect condition
runs strong
Michelin Pilots on stock 15" rims
Cobra Mass Air Flow Sensor
Other suspension stuff and some other small stuff.

Also, I was thinking about selling my car and getting a 93 cobra. How would my car fair against the cobra, and how would the cobra fair against the 98 GT.

Thanks!
Sonics2042

Just a note...my car is the 90 LX :)
Thanks

You should be about 7 or 8 tenths faster than your friend your car is lighter and more powerfull.

Bet some cash if you can.

A 93 cobra would not be much faster than your 90LX with the mods you have.

Get a shift kit and a stall converter and your car will fly.

I know what you mean though there is just something about a cobra..;)

I know! I love my car, it has been good to me :)

But the Cobra is just calling for me. I also want the manual. Also, what is a stall converter and what does it do? I am pretty familiar with stang mods, but I am unfamiliar with that one.

Also, I have the car bug, so I am willing to put more $$ into the Cobra...In fact, I have a hard time not putting more $$ into the LX even though I know I plan to sell it. I am that bad.

Thanks,
DoranW

How do you figure? 90 LX Auto vs. 98 5-speed, I think it'll be real close, both being in the 15's.

I haven't ran my stang since it was stock, but I would expect to run about a 14.7

And I think the 98 GT runs about a 15.2 with a good driver. And I sincerely doubt he knows the optimal shift points. Actually I know he doesn't :)

However, we will probably only be going 0-60 or 0-70.

I dont know how often you get to the track but LX's with gears run mid 14's in the quarter @3000 ft where I race. (yes even the auto's) A guy I know ran a 14.6 @ 96 nearly bone stock with a 90 LX auto

But your right the 98 GT is a low 15 sec car

I've been to the track ALOT, that is basically my home away from home. Maybe with some 4:10's, it would be in the 14's. I've driven a quite a few auto 5.0's, and they are not 14 second cars nearly bone stock. With his mod's he's probaly around 14.8-14.9 maybe, Give the 98 GT a 15.1(maybe faster)and that is just a few tenths not, 7 or 8.

By telling him that, your basically saying his car runs a 14.3-14.4, and that is just not going to happen with his mod's.

Sonics2042 a 93 Cobra would be awesome, if you can find one, cheap enough. Most people from what I've seen want 12,000-18,000 for one with decently low miles.

Hmm I think it would be pretty close! Your downfall is that AOD!

Your 90 will beat the 98. Hell i beat a 98 with my L at the track and I'm a good 1000 pounds more weight at least and only mods were K&N open cone, FMS 9mm wires, MSD 6A and Blaster TFI coil (my time was a 15.3@90 with 2.3 60 ft.). I used to have a 96 and the early 4.6s suck in the GT's. Yeah the 98 has 225 vs the 215 stock hp of my 96 but they are also heavy and the 4.6 sucks badly for torque performance. Your 90 has the better gear and torque, though if I was you I'd put in some 4.10s if you keep the car. Your car is also lighter and with the auto you won't miss a shift. From what you've told us about your friend, he will miss a shift :D. He's running a 2.73 rear gear if he's still stock. My 96, with totally stock and 2.73s ran a 15.4 @ 94 with a 2.4 60ft. But also mine was probably about 200 or so pounds less than that 98 will be (it was a GTS version, weighed a little over 3200 without me in it and 3/4 tank of gas). Though once I put in my 3.73s (I had the T45 5speed) I dropped to a 15.0@92 with a 2.3 60 ft. My bet is you'll take him pretty good.

Good call, Adam, I mean 96GTS, hehe!

Hey Johnny, what's up??? Didn't see ya online, hehe.

WTF is that all about?

Go 5.0
 

Bad89, You say you have been to the track, but I see plenty of 5.0 with auto and mininal mods in the low 14's. My friends 93 ran a best of 14.1@98 with 373s, Mac cold air and full exhuast and trans-go - not really modded at all. However, without the exhuast he ran a 14.4@96. In any event no 96-98 will be close to him, even with similar mods.
My money is on the 5.0.

You guys keep acting like I've never been to the track, I've ran 15's, 14's, 13's, 12's, 11's, a 10 second 1/4 mile times. I'm an avid drag racer, if you'd like to come down here I'd be glad to show you. 99.9% of the fox auto's with just gears and exhaust are not going to run 14.1's. I'm really calling BS on that one. But it really doesn't matter to me about arguing if someone ran a 14 second 1/4. LOL. And I really ? that .1% did. I don't know.... maybe it's your elevation where these auto's are running low 14's with a cold air that basically does nothing vs. a removed air silencer, exhaust(not going to knock off .3's and 2 mph like you stated.) and gears that is not going to knock
off .8's. (because a stock one is running 15's.) :rolleyes: :rolleyes: I think your being a ricer. I could really care less what your car runs or your friends car ran, if your "fast" come show me at my track. ;)

Class act
 

Well, those are the numbers. I am honest on this board and don't cotton to lying. I am not a ricer and I did not intent to say you havent seen 15 sec autos out there, but I HAVE seen low to mid 14 sec ones nor that you were not an avid racer. It is just hard to believe with all that experience you have not run across what seems to be fairly normal.
My elevation is sea level and those times were on hot humid summer days.
Think what you want but dont name call, it is petty and I am the furthest thing from a ricer, I know what adds HP to a mustang and what is vapour ware.
And if I was closer I would gladly run your LS1 for fun.

;) I have never seen a auto 5.0 all stock run anything but 15+, and I've driven probaly 5+different ones and I'd say they were 15+second cars.

I really don't race the SS too often, it's my daily driver, but I have before and it runs consistent 13.1's N/A. I'd be happy to race you in my S-10 also for fun too.;)

Nobody at 1BAD89's track has ever run a good time in their Mustang. Only the almighty LS1 is fast. Note: His LS1 runs MUCH quicker than most, but nobody's Mustang could possibly run a good time.

Unit answer me this, is a 90 LX auto, witth 3:55's mac cold air, and exhaust going to run 14.1's?

That's my car...and I sincerely doubt it would. I would guess....14.6-14.8...

I barely ran a 14.1 and that was without the weight and bad gearing of an AOD.

Yeah most AOD cars I see at the track are going 15's too. Ive heard about a lot of fast close to stock ones, but I havnt seen one. Doesnt mean I dont doubt they are out there, its just not the norm.

Skyler

Well, in response to 96GTS, I can guarantee you that I won't miss a shift. Also, don't be too hasty to compare your care with mine stock, because remember, yours does have less bhp. I don't think that I will necessarily win against sonics2042's LX, but I do feel confident that I won't lose by any more than a few tenths. Soon, however, all of this debating will all be over, because we will do our race this weekend (assuming the weather is good). Once we do, we'll let you know who wins.

Bad89, I holeheartedly argree, bone stock AOD will run 15+. However, I stated my experience with full exhaust, trans-go, 373s and cold air.
The race we are all talking about, with his mods will be a high 14sec car.
I'll race your truck if you give me a eight mile lead lol :)

:)

That's good that you won't miss a shift. One big thing I would recommend in helping with saving that crap T45 and improving shifting even more would be for you to get an aftermarket shifter such as the Steeda Tri-ax. Your stock shifter is crap. I had to have my T45 rebuilt with only around 40,000 miles on it. Anyways, I was just going off what your friend said about your driving and I quote:

[QUOTE]And I think the 98 GT runs about a 15.2 with a good driver. And I sincerely doubt he knows the optimal shift points. Actually I know he doesn't.[QUOTE]

Sounds like he wasn't too sure about your shifting abilities which is why I commented about it. Yes mine had 10 hp less stock. That's hardly a difference. It was also 200-300 pounds lighter than yours is so that makes up for it and then some so I will compare. Power to weight ratio makes a big difference. I don't think you'll lose by much either. I never said that you would. But, it's also more than likely that you will lose by a few car lengths. How many? I don't know. You'll just have to race and let us know how it goes. Also get some gears in that thing. Go with at least 3.73s. You will be much much happier :D. Good luck. If he drives bad you'll kick his butt and vice versa. Driver plays a part, too. But car vs car I give it to the 90 LX.

Dan (98gt5sp),

You may not miss a shift, but I know your shifts won't be perfect...How long have you had your car now? 3 days? Have you mastered the shifting at high RPMs? No. Also...you BARELY have more hp than 96 GTS, but his car is lighter...just like mine. Also...for people who have gone to the track... :) a few tenths is a fair amount at 95+...

Also, let's see how well you can launch your car. A fine line between peeling out all over the place and a great launch...
AutoX I would rape your car though :)

1-3 your car is pretty strong and since we won't go a full 1/4...should be interesting.

Get ready to lose...j/k (have to keep smack talk up),
Sonics2042

98gt5sp: 3 days? Have you ever owned a 4.6 before? Let me give you a couple hints to help you race your 4.6. Shift around 5300-5500 rpm. That's where your powerband gives out. Also launch at around 2000 rpms. Don't dump the clutch either. Ride it out a bit to try to keep the tires from breaking free. You should be low to mid 90's mph and in upper 3rd gear at the end of the 1/4 with those 2.73 stock gears.

SHHH!!!! This is his first 4.6. Don't give him any help. You should tell him to shift and ~3000 and to dump his clutch :)

Well, in 110* heat my Uncle ran a 15.2 with his bone stock AOD 89 GT Vert, with non functioning traction lock yielding *** launches.

I would agree the Fox AOD 5.0 is a very high 14/low 15 car with a good driver, but with some gears and mild bolt ons (like this one), it should be a solid 14sec car with a good driver.

well 98gt5sp woussed out. He says he wants to wait until SIR (Seattle International Raceway) opens...By then I will hopefully have my 93 cobra. (fingers crossed).

Chicken'd out huh?:rolleyes:

And I even gave him some tips to help him. What the heck??

98 GT 5sp Transmission type
 

96GTS... Thank you for the tips, they really are appreciated. I have a few questions that someone can hopefully clear up for me...

Quote 96GTS:
"I would recommend in helping with saving that crap T45 and improving shifting even more would be for you to get an aftermarket shifter such as the Steeda Tri-ax."

I thought that I had a tremec T-5 transmission. Are you sure you aren't mistaken about me having a T-45? Do you know where I can look this up? I looked all over the net and couldn't find a good specs sight. Also, I already purchased an American Thunder flowmaster cat-back exhaust, am getting a mac cold air intake soon, and next on the list is the Steeda Tri-Ax shifter and new gears (not sure what order for these last two). I'm wondering what you recommend, 3.73 or 4.10 for gears considering my car is my street driver as well. 4.10 would probably be too intense... but I think 3.55 wouldn't be worth the $500. What are the stock gears at (I have heard conflicting pieces of info on this)? Thanks a lot for the help,

-98gt5sp

Trust me, you have a T45 made by Borg Warner. The 99-up stangs have a Tremec T45 up untill I think 01 and then it's a Tremec 3560 5-speed. They didn't change to a Tremec brand untill after 99. The Tremec T5 was in the 95-earlier stangs.

The Steeda is an excellent choice. Also go with the 3.73s with your daily driver. I think you'll probably like those best. That's what's recommended for the 4.6 5speed daily driver. Though 4.10s probably wouldn't be a bad choice either if you aren't too particular about gas mileage. Your stock gearing is a 2.73. You can look on the rear of the differential. There's a metal tag on there that'll tell you. I don't remember if it's the top or bottom line but it'll say 2L73 on it. The L means you have the traction lock rear and the 2 73 is the gear ratio. If it had something different it would be like 2 73, 3L08, 3 08, 3L27, 3 27. Standard gearing was a 2.73. Looks like you're on the right track. The Modular Madness forum on here is specifically for the 4.6 motors. You should definitely hang out there for a ton of info. Have fun. :D

98gt5sp (dan),

If you ever want to AutoX, I would stay with 3.73 or ever 3.55s...Top speed is important to me...I don't need to go 170 or anything, but with 4.10s I would guess ur top speed would be about 90-100.

LOL, Your top speed would be faster than 90, or 100 with 4:10's.

4.10s wouldn't knock the top speed to 90-100. No way. If that was so that's as fast as he could ever get in the 1/4. Shoot with my 3.73s I could cruise down the highway at 120mph and still have plenty to go. Did that a few times :D. Makes 30 min. trip into about 10 mins. Not too bad.

With the 5speed you don't have a speed limiter either.

No power mods with manual with 4.10 gears? I would be pretty surprised to see him break ~105. Now if he gets to 90 in a hurry, then it takes like 5 min to get to 120, that's different. 90 is probably pretty-really conservative, but I don't think he could get to 120.

Plus, if he did get 4.10s, he would be shifting...a lot around town.

With 4.10s he could easily see 120 and VERY quickly at that. He could hit 105 in 4th gear man. Say he drops in a set of 4.10s he'll be crossing the 1/4 line in 4th and in the mid 90's (say round 94mph). If he keeps on going and get's in 5th there's not much problem reaching the 120mph mark but that's probably about all that'll be gotten untill he upgrades to more power. But on stock hp he'll see that quite easily.

As far as shifting with the 4.10s if he uses 1st, which you pretty much won't need to except for racing, then yeah he'll shift alot. Otherwise it'll be like driving a 4 speed around town when starting out in 2nd. 2nd will roughly be around how his first gear operated with the stock 2.73s. 3.73s or 4.10s are very good gears for the 4.6. Like I mentioned in an earlier post the power band of the 4.6 is way up there in the rpms so they need some gearing to get the motor wound up there to get the power. My personal recommendation is 3.73s unless you frequent the strip alot then go with the 4.10s. If you plan on a blower in the future actually the 3.73s would be the better gear to get a bit better top end mph because the blower makes up for the low end torque. When I jumped from my stock 2.73s to my 3.73s my ET dropped .4 from a 15.4 to 15.0 but my mph also dropped, instead of increased, from 94 to 92 mph. It won't make much difference really.

there is always gonna be someone who can afford to be faster than you so bracket race and find out who is the better racer regardless of make of car

just my 2cents

Well...we went to the track and I forgot about this post. The conditions were pretty bad. First day and the track was pretty slick (worse than street)...I ran a 15.02 with 8* timing. With drag radials and slightly better conditions, I don't think a 14.7-8 is unreasonable... 98GT5SP ran a best of 15.6 or 15.7...And despite his earlier quote about guarenteeing not missing a gear...he missed third :) and stalled once :) (but the stalling was kind of not his fault...just to be fair).

My info:
15.02
2.3-something 60'
Low 93s trap.

NOTE: The run was not made with what is in my profile currently :). (had 3.55s, 8* timing, catback, MAF, cold air intake).

Thanks,
DoranW

Why only 8* timing?

These cars run best around 14-16*. You'll pick up noticeable power by bumping your timing.

Absolute minimum timing should be 10*. That's what the stock timing is supposed to be. Like 89 Cobra said bump it up to around 14* and drop in some 91 or so octane (what ever you can run without getting detonation). What's your elevation out there in WA? Both of ya'll will gain some better ET with some driving practice. Now 98's car is bone stock right (gears included)? That stock shifter is a pain to race with. Been there, done that. I'd bet he also had around a 2.4-2.3 60 ft.

Man I hate being right :D

My timing chain was on it's way out. I just ordered a new one, and I will be putting it in with my cam and all that stuff... I turned it down to 8* just to be safe, but I have run 18* with 92 octane w/o any problems!! :)

I couldn't have imagined that we would have been more than a few hundred feet above sea level. (We were in Kent, WA at Pacific Raceways...formally Seattle Internation Raceways (SIR)).

His time was with JUST exhaust and the cold air induction setup. He got gears after that run. You are right about his 60' times...one or two of the runs were actually higher I think.

Thanks,
DoranW

NW Stangs
 

Sonics, good to see someone from the NW. Im stationed at Ft. Lewis, though Im at Ft Benning, GA for training. Just bought a '91 LX that is all engine( less that 2000 miles on it). The guy didnt get to the AOD tranny. That is my weak link with that car rite now. It does shift perfectly though. This is my first ford so I know very little about their Auto Trannies. The lentec valve body someone was talking about on another thread sounds interesting though.

question
 

I've read that borg-warner made the T5..

but I've also read that the Tremec 3650 is a more "upgraded" newer-style T5?

which is true??

thanks

Tremec purchased the trannies, or the entire company Borg Warner a few years back.

I don't know anything about the Tremec 3650. The 3550 isn't anything close to a T-5. It has much more in common with the Ford toploader and SROD transmissions.