450 HP from a 302 all engine

[vetteeatr]

K i know a maniac who has a 450+ 302. Ive checked it out and qutie frankly its scary. Not only that he stuffed it in a MG midgit.

Quite frankly i dont like being beat........


SO i need ot knwo how to take him. I know ill allways weigh more but still by some freak incident i may be able to compete.

So far I have windsor senior heads,march pulleys, 36 ibs injectors, 10:1 SRP flat tops, MSD ignition, harland sharpe rockers, BBK longtubes and h pipe wiht flowmaster mufflers, a dual friciton clutch form centerline, K&N filter, hurst shifter, oh and hte motor and bored .30 over. Anyway as im sure youve noticed i dont have a intake i had one but sold it in favor of a newer one wiht a larger throttle body.

What do you guys suggest a holley systemax II wiht a 75mm throttle body?

Also i knwo i need a diffrent camshaft as its stock but i hear there are gonna be clearence inssues wiht the heads? anyone know?

Am i gonna be anywhere near 450 on the motor?
i knwo its possible but quite frankly im now near broke....

Thanks for the help..

Oh also those dman injectors are flooding my damn cylinders. How much power do oyu htink im losing?

[Rick 91GT]

I'd get a Holley and a 75mm Accufab and go to a set of 30# injectors. 450hp from a 302 is very hard to do and it must have a ton on compression and one healthy cam, heads, and intake. Is it a carb motor or EFI?

As for cam go custome, but you are going to need something very aggresive with 230 degrees intake duration so it pulls to 6500ish. I fly cut my pistons so that mt AFM N-61 cam would work with my 2.02s valves, you may need to do the same. And to compete with a car that weighs hundreds of pounds lighter you are going to need more power 500-525 if his car hooks good or concentrate on getting the power you have to the ground.

Bolt on some N20 and fry him.

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Check Out My Site 91GT,Holley SysteMAX II Kit-Heads 2.02" x 1.60" port matched to a 1262,Anderson N-61,24#,76mm C&L,Full MAC, No A/C or PS or emissions, 12" K&N Filter,RNH PERFORMANCE Ram Air,Ron Davis Radiator,Full Suspension, SPEC stage III clutch, Lakewood SFI bell, S&W 8pt "X" brace,JAZ seats,3:73's,Welds..etc,4:30's and 31 splines coming very soon!
<B>12.16 @ 113.5, 1.78 60ft..no traction in the 90 degree

[This message has been edited by Rick 91GT (edited 10-12-2001).]

[blue oval 50h]

Yes, quite frankly all you need is a 150 shot.....

[5.0mgb!?!]

A 302 in a Midget!!! Is there any way you can get some pictures sent this way? I would love to see how he got it in there! Also, what rear end is he using? What are his 1/4 times and MPH?

Anyway, my MGB weighs about 2200 lbs. The Midget has to come in under 2000. You are already giving up over 1000 lbs. This means that by my math, with the traction variable being equal, you will need about 550+ horsepower. Good Luck!

[5ohCOUPE]

Yep, I totally agree with the 150 shot !! You can get a good kit for about 300 to 350 bucks used. But be very carefull about buying used nitrous kits. i got mine used and there is nothing wrong with it.

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91 LX COUPE, 3.73 gears, 2 1/2 inch full exhaust, 1 5/8 shorty headers, 73 MM C&L MAF, 70 MM MAC TB, LUNATI cam, Windsor jr heads, GT 40 intake with ported lower, world class T5 with PRO 5.0 shifter, Griffin aluminum radiator, Fluid Damper, SSM traction bars, 150 HP shot N2O kit, 190 GPH in tank fuel pump with Paxton T-Rex external pump. And more to come.
BEST TIME ON BOTTLE---11.51 @123
BEST TIME ON MOTOR---12.63 @109

[todd95GT]

Originally posted by blue oval 50h:
Yes, quite frankly all you need is a 150 shot.....

blue oval, i got the humor there, and quite frankly, i think it's very funny.

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Todd
1995 GT/T-5
Pulleys; 65 mm TB; Flowmaster cat-back; Mac off road H-pipe; FMS aluminum driveshaft; short-throw shifter; HD clutch; Cobra R's; Cobra front and wing

[vetteeatr]

Quite frankly i dont get the humor??? :P

Damn you guys LOL

there are sites ont eh net wiht kits ot put a 350 in a MG and a 302. Actually they have stuffed evrything into these things, i even saw a big block stffed in one on the web.

a 9 inch ford rear end i believe.

Oh he whooped the **** out of a viper....... and i mean he blew him away

Yeah its fuel injected...... oh also should i make my engine a strker to more easily attain the power?

[NotchJohnson]

Man if you've got the money stoke it. But if youve got any connections a 351 can make some serious power as well. One of my buddies has a carbed 351 with stage 2 canfields, victor jr intake, and a bg 750. He runs real low 11's. OH yeah and a 150 shot as well!

[90dpscoupe]

Hmm why is it the ls1 can make 450 hp with just bolt ons? well, they do have 10:1 compression, there heads flow like 240 intk im guessing stock, but my friend has a 347 with stage 3 tw heads, 10:1 comp, mild cam, about 224 duration 530 lift, and its carbed, im guessing it is around 400-430 hp at the flywheel, it will go 11.7-11.9 if he had a bigger slick, right now going 12.1 @ 114 shifting at 6k, with a poor 60' and ac compressor still intact and working in a 5spd 85 coupe, has most of its interior, except backseat.

Bottom line, it does take some time and money to get even just 400 hp out of a 302, without adders.

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90 lx coupe: 5spd, energy susp trans mounts, fms hd clutch, Mac coldair fenderwell, Mac h-pipe, supercoil, ADS chip, 160 stat, aluminum D/S, Black magic fan, 3.27grs.
Best time: 13.9116(on 225/60/15 firehawks)
Best mph: 98.17
Best 60': 1.9607

someday mods:4.10's, slicks.

[90dpscoupe]

Hmmm, well according to the analyzer, his car (my friend) isnt making that much power as i thought, close enough though, but to achieve that with hydraulic roller cam, you would need at least 10:1 compression, and heads flowing around 290-300cfm, and a baddazz cam custom ground.

[SaleenGTS]

I love this topic....cause I have had so much experience with it lately.

You will not hit 450 hp with a 302 N/A. 400 is about all you can muster out of a 302 N/A and keep i streetable.

Now if you want to stay with a 302....get good heads, Intake, Cam, TB, MAF, Exhaust, and all that little stuff, and a good 8-9 psi blower. On my car I made 3different power levels with 3 different pullies. I made 388 rwhp with a 6#, 428 rwhp with a 9# and right under 470 with a 11, but I blew out my tranny with that one.

If you want to stay N/A....go 347 with some goot porting and a good cam. 347 power levels vary widely. Some hit 390 rwhp, some hit 430-440 rwhp.

385-390 rwhp should hit right around 450 fwhp.

Good Luck

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Dustin
89 Saleen GT Sport,347, TFS Street Heat Intake(port matched),TFS TW Heads(Stage 2),TFS #2 cam,BD-11A 9 psi,Crane 1.6 rr's,BBK 70mm TB,Pro-M 80mm MAF,MSD 6BTM, FMS 9mm wires,BBK longtubes,BBK Short H-pipe,American Thunder cat back,3.55's

12.3@119 street tires OLD MOTOR

11.496@121.08slicks OLD MOTOR

[This message has been edited by SaleenGTS (edited 10-14-2001).]

[Unit 5302]

I concur with the streetable N/A 450hp 302 being very hard to build. The only 302 that will pull that out of it's arse is the Boss 302. If you could find one, it'd set you back at least 6k fully assembled.

[2FastLX]

If you are low on money the only suggestion I see here that might actually work is the juice. Everything else mentioned is going to cost you an arm, a leg, one big toe, and maybe a few little ones. Go for a 150hp shot and you should be close enough that you can still read his license plate when he beats you. I mean, with an MG being that light making 450HP you'll never be able to do it with you current engine and stay N/A, unless your friend has some serious traction issues, and you're going to have to make a helluva lot more than 450HP to beat him if he doesn't.

Also... Get us some PICS (or better yet a video)!!!! I gotta see this MG!

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Gunning for 12's!

Buy your parts here
ICQ# 42269241

[MiracleMax]

http://www.airflowresearch.com/ford_dyno.htm

In EFI trim your looking at something like a Vic 5.0 manifold, and a 75mm or better T-body with 36 lbs or better injectors with a mass-air.

Are you looking for 450 @ the crank or wheels?

[MiracleMax]

Originally posted by 90dpscoupe:
Hmm why is it the ls1 can make 450 hp with just bolt ons? well, they do have 10:1 compression, there heads flow like 240 intk im guessing stock

Probably 2 things work in the LS1's favor, in stock form its probably the best pushrod engine ever to see the light of day, and next to god, nobody else knows more about engine airflow than Ken Sperry. Thats the guy in charge of GM's airflow department.

Airflow by itself isn't the whole picture when it comes to power. just because a head flows "X" amount of air doesn't mean its going to make "X" amount of power. combustion in rapidly accelerating/de-accelerating cylinders are a dynamic environment and there are about ah gajillion variables invovled as a piston moves from BDTC to TDC. things like mixture homgenization, how it blows across the spark plug, where it goes in the chamber, yadda, yadda, yadda. This all effects net pressures in the cylinder.

Combine this with things like frictional HP losses, less efficient thermodynamic design, ect. and the bits and pieces start to add up to a sizable chunk of HP gone.

The windsor engines where designed like almost 40 years ago? The LS1 is at best 10 years old counting when some guy with a slide rule got a stiffy thinking about it.

So the bottom line result is an engine that is easier to get bigger numbers from without as many mods.