street heat vs. GT-40?

[69fastback]

I have a trick flow street heat intake and a GT-40 intake and not sure which one to use? Or I was also thinking about selling both of them and going to the track heat, or perfrome rpm 2?

The car is mildly modified. Has all your basic bolt ons. Headers,
pullies, 3:73s, 65 mm tb, CAI, windsor JR. heads, a wolverine cam (need to find specs on it. it is more of a street strip type cam). All forged internals for a 150 wet nitrous kit. 24lb injectors, 77mm mass air. Typical exhuast upgrages o/r x pipe flowmaster cat back. Another thing is it is a t-5 if that matters or not. Any thoughts on this are appreciated. Anything else i left out that will help please let me know.

[Coupe50h]

I would use one or the other, and sell the one you dont use, I always liked the gt-40 looks, but to each their own.
I know a guy that runs the street heat, and i run the explorer (similar to the cobra/gt-40) and I beat him twice of course that does'nt prove anything really, although the rest of our combos are similar.

[lx mike]

sell the street heat and use the money to get the gt-40 lower ported. tmoss can help you there.

[Dark_5.0]

Originally Posted by lx mike

sell the street heat and use the money to get the gt-40 lower ported. tmoss can help you there.

Damn Mike you beat me to it.

I have a Cobra intake with a ported lower and I own everyone that also has a H/C/I 302.

[1979bruiser]

gt40-looks better and i like the idea of tubular upper seperated runners. i would think thin wall upper runners would have a cooler air temp and make more power in the long run after porting.

[tmoss]

I'd use the GT40 ov4er the Street Heat for that combo..........porting would be optional as it will work pretty well without it.

[Ninety5five0]

Is it a real gt40 ? I've heard alot of good things about the street heat, but they are both up there in the scales. Personally i'm going with trickflow street heat. Its cheaper, and personally i think it looks better. But as said above, to each their own

[69fastback]

Thanks for the input. I have been leaning towards the gt-40. Yes it is a real GT-40. I already have both maniflolds sitting in my garage and can't decied on which one. If price was an issue I would go with the street heat it is quit a bit cheaper. Been trying to find some numbers with those two competting against each other???

[HeadDoctor]

Hay FastBack

If you're going for the look I'de use the GT-40. But if you're going for the performance use the Trick-Flow, unless you want to get the GT-40 ported. Either way you're going to have to match the upper to the T-Body.

Remember that a bird in the hand is better than the one across the street - I've seen too many people continually shoot themselves in the foot by thinking "What I heve isn't good enough to get the job done" - and that is backwards thinking - you never know until you get the whole project put together and go to the track.

Denny@JDS Induction Products

[tmoss]

Windsor Jr heads don't flow enough to make the cost of porting the intake worth it imho........

[HeadDoctor]

Thanks for the info Tom

However in my opinion there is no reason not to port the intake regardless of what head you put it on.

It's obvious you don't know who I am - not that you should by any means, I'm only famous in certain circles - But just to give you an idea, I notice that you are from St Louis the home of a famous engine builder Don Kirn - now I did many of the heads on his engines for a very long time. I am sure that you have heard of Super-Flow - it just so happens that my 600 flow bench has a serial #001 built in 1983 hum. Previous to my giong into business for myself in 1980 I worked for Reed Cams where I built the head dept from scratch and trained employees; it took 15 to run that program (some of them are now famous in their own right). For its era it was known as the very best in the business. John and I poineered many of the things that are now considered common-place, such as porting manifolds, modified carbs, changing rocker ratios for the int and exh - step headers - mushroom lifters for chevies and fords and the list just goes on. One of those things was the Super-Flow 400 flow bench, which revolutionized the head industry - I don't mean to pat myself on the back, however I do have credintials. Consequently I don't talk just to hear myself speak.

If the moderators will let me I will gladly post some specific tech articles about heads and cams that can assist the forum members, so long as they agree to make them sticky!!!

Denny@JDS Induction Products

[tmoss]

Porting an intake that increases the flow efficiency is always a good move - espec ially in racing, but when it comes to the hard earned $ of these guys, I don't make recommendations that are not good HP/$ returns for s street engine. If they tell me they are racing, then the recommendations change - application is key and this guy has not said he is racing. I also have a flow bench - but it's not serial #1.

I hope the mods take you up on your offer.

Edit, it also doesn't look good when you recommend porting some marginal street applications, it looks self-serving. People have come to trust my advice and that's important to me also.

[HeadDoctor]

Tom

Now it seems that rather than trying to help "FastBack" out, you and I are having a difference of opinion. - I'm an old-fart - and I've been in this business since 1958 - but that in no way discounts what you know and understand about what you do and or say. Everyone has opinions but it is how you say that explanation - I'm not actually recomending anything because it's his money, thus his choice and his decision to make. However I'm not discounting his intelligence to make that choice, by being overly pat with my information, neither am I trying to make that decision for him by arbitraraly stating things that are not evident to me in his post.

You and I both know that all cast intake manifolds restrict the flow into the head somewhat and that is relative to the intake being discussed. Hence when you port the intake it always increases the flow into the head - Now it is not only less expensive to port the intake than it is to port the heads but the work invloved for R&R is also less time consuming, hence less expensive. Consequently when the owner decides; at a later date, to move on with hopping up the engine he can then get the heads ported, make a cam change or some other valuable HP increasing modifications.

I generally don't make recomendations unless asked for - but I do make suggestions that are relevent to the post I'm looking at - In this case I made 3 suggestions,
1) Regarding the "LOOK" verses performance
2) Performance indicated the use of the Trick-Flow intake
3) If you want both the look of the GT-40 and the performance of the Trick-Flow then you are going to have to get the GT-40 ported

Nowhere in my post did I say send it to me to have that work done - because again - it is his choice and his decision. Just because I've been in this business for 48 years doesn't mean that I have all the answers either - I learn something new every day - and that is how it should be.

Again let FastBack make his own choices and decisions - just be as honest and truthful as anyone can be every time any suggestion is made, and only give specific recomendations when asked for.

Denny@JDS Induction Products

[tmoss]

I used the term "you" actually in reference to myself - should have said that differently. Maybe you'll have a different persepctive on my answer now.........no arguements here with anything you said.

[Coupe50h]

Yea well flow #'s arent everything.
I still think a gt-40 can outperform a tfs street intake, given the right combination, and they both outperform the stocker by far.

[tmoss]

Originally Posted by Coupe50h

Yea well flow #'s arent everything.
I still think a gt-40 can outperform a tfs street intake, given the right combination, and they both outperform the stocker by far.

That statement can go either way, depending on the application of the combination of parts. The smaller cross section intake will normally produce more air charge velocity.

I did an Explorer intake for a guy who was very happy with the results. His friends all told him he'd make more power with an RPMII intake. This was an 58cc AFR165 head car with an E303 cam. I wish I had the rest of the details in my head but I don't - I'm visiting my youngest daughter in college this weekend or I'd post up the combo and comparison dyno. The dyno is on my website in the Community section in the Photos folder. Long story short, he put an RPMII on the car and lost area under the curve through the mid 5,000 rpm range and then the Explorer hung right with the RPMII through 6,200 rpm. This combo needed the smaller cross section. He put the Explorer back on the car.

So, back to my original recommedation to use the smaller cross section - this car is a street car and I think it will be more driveable in traffic and still make good power. Would it make more with a ported lower? Without a doubt. How much? Can't say because there are lots of tuning and installation/build factors that can affect it. The difference in the example above was 24lb-ft and 8HP peak numbers, but the difference was apparant across a wide rpm range.

If 69 fastback want's to shift the torque/power band to the right on the curve and make some more peak power, then use the TF intake, but it may come at a loss of average torque/power over the rpm band. One way to tell is to do some dyno testing to see. He must make a decision about where to make his power and what kind of driveability he desires.

Edit - got back home and here is the two dyno curves of that combo.........It is fortunate when you can get customer feedback that includes some dyno test results. With that said, keep in mind that dynos and flow benches are tools - the real test for both man and machine comes at the track.

[HeadDoctor]

Tom
Thats a great Post Thanks

Now all we have to do is get more people to do the same thing

Denny@JDS Induction Products

[tmoss]

Originally Posted by HeadDoctor

Tom
Thats a great Post Thanks

Now all we have to do is get more people to do the same thing

Denny@JDS Induction Products

I see lots of well intentioned advice given on the net that misses the mark, as I am sure you do too. Experience comes with the years and some "hard" lessons.

[HeadDoctor]

Tom
My biggest problem with these forums is the fact the those that give input hardly ever give the reasons for the advice, recomendation, or suggestion. As you know in order to make any engine function as intended there are a maze of compromizes to wade through and there is no real pat answer for any of them. I have a thread on here - "How to choose the best head for your engine" (Or something like that Has facts & figures) in it I describe some of these variables in a logical order.

I wonder sometimes how these guys ever get their cars going as fast as they do with the little amount of basic info available to them. The magazines don't print factual info any more, because they are too concerned with being politically correct. While some of the info in these threads is worthwhile much of it is just heresay with no real evidence to back it up except - "I have it on my car and it runs fine" - runs fine compared to what?

There has to be something to compare whatever it is to something that could be considered to be an absolute.

Example: A guy tells me his car runs 6.0 in the 1/8th (So what a lot of cars do that) How much does it weigh - how big is the engine etc etc etc "But it runs 114 MPH" he says (so what a lot of cars do that to) is it on the gas? YES?

OK! If it weighs 3000 LBS on 10.5 tires and has an all steel small block @ 350 CID or under - I might say thats an accomplishment great for you. Because it only takes 500 BHP & a 200 shot to get that done. Maybe less N2O if the guy really knows what he is doing with the chassis and the gear.

Basically I'm not impressed very much lately - so I'm looking for guys that really want to "GO FAST" What I really want is to go 10.5W Outlaw racing with a blown alcohol car - know anyone that wants to do that, and has the money? I so here's my contact info Dennyschmidt19@comcast.net

It's always great to talk to someone that is trying to help the next generation of racers.

Denny@JDS Induction Products