What's wrong with my setup?

PAUL-90GT · 06-11-2001, 11:36 PM

last month I took car to track for first time
ran a best time of 14.4@95mph, had car dynoed also and got 216wrhp. those # are worse then a stock mustang. What could be the problem? ran a code scan -NO CODES,
ran a compression test - 140psi
vacuum was 14psi, timing is set at 14. Anybody have any Idea's what could be wrong?
here's a list of mods I have done.
performer heads,TFs street intake,1.6 rockers,e-cam,65mm TB,76mm MAF,19IB inj,headers,h-pipe,flowmasters,underdrive pullies,2800 stall TC,4:10's,control arms.

The car's a 90GT AUTO with 110,000 miles

TJR · 06-12-2001, 06:12 AM

Whats your fuel pressure set at?

------------------
1989 lx notch
89,000 miles
bolt-ons,stock heads/cam
60'- 2.07, 8.90@78, 13.93@99

PAUL-90GT · 06-12-2001, 09:31 AM

fuel pressure is set at 34

TJR · 06-12-2001, 10:10 AM

34 with 19lb injectors sounds lean to me. Stock is 38 - 40. What do your plugs look like? Do you still have the stock fuel pump? What altitude are you at?

------------------
1989 lx notch
89,000 miles
bolt-ons,stock heads/cam
60'- 2.07, 8.90@78, 13.93@99

PAUL-90GT · 06-12-2001, 10:43 AM

I have the 190-lph fuel pump
I believe the track is near sea level.
I know I need to bump up my fuel pressure, I just changed my inj back to 19Ib from 30Ib
so thats why the fuel pressure is at 34

jimberg · 06-12-2001, 10:49 AM

Did you lower your fuel pressure when "tuning" it at the dyno? If so, you probably were running rich because of bad O2 sensors. When's the last time you replaced them? If you replaced them recently and your car runs better lean, you may want to get a custom chip burned.

The problem with twiddling with fuel pressure is that the computer will just compensate by changing injector pulse width. Read the article about Adaptive Strategy in Articles/Electronics on this site.

You could also try just resetting your computer at the track. This will clear any adaptation values. If you do tune at the dyno, you should reset the computer before every run, too. This will make every thing consistent from the dyno to the track.

------------------
351W 89 Mustang GT Convertible

TJR · 06-12-2001, 11:39 AM

Is the mass air calibrated for the 19lb injectors?

------------------
1989 lx notch
89,000 miles
bolt-ons,stock heads/cam
60'- 2.07, 8.90@78, 13.93@99

PAUL-90GT · 06-12-2001, 12:09 PM

the mass air is calibrated for 19IB injectors

NOphonyponys · 06-12-2001, 12:16 PM

Keep in mind that 216RWHP means you have about 290HP +/-10HP at the flywheel. Your AOD drivetrain wil cause you to loose about 80-90 HP, compared to the T-5 which only looses about 50-60 HP thru the drivetrain.

And 290 flywheel HP on that car isn't TOO bad, even with your mods...

------------------
ONLY 325 RWHP??? DAMN...

TJR · 06-12-2001, 12:43 PM

What do your plugs look like? Did you check them immediately after your runs at the track?

------------------
1989 lx notch
89,000 miles
bolt-ons,stock heads/cam
60'- 2.07, 8.90@78, 13.93@99

PAUL-90GT · 06-12-2001, 01:28 PM

the plugs where tan when I pulled them
also didnt do a dyno tune the shop felt it would have been a waste of money since HP was so low
the 02 sensors are about a year old

exgmguy · 06-12-2001, 02:01 PM

Maybe your valvetrain is not adjusted properly? If your rockers are too tight you will lose significant power.

------------------
1988 Mustang GT
12.0 @ 122
1992 BadAzz Wrangler
1993 Explorer

TJR · 06-12-2001, 04:01 PM

Was the cam degreed when it was installed? The cam timing could be off.

Did you pull the spout connector when you set the timing? You may want to recheck it because it is an easy fix.

Also, try what exgmguy said and readjust the valves.

------------------
1989 lx notch
89,000 miles
bolt-ons,stock heads/cam
60'- 2.07, 8.90@78, 13.93@99

302 LX Eric · 06-12-2001, 04:11 PM

216 rwhp and 14.4 @ 95 sound way off from where you should be. The only thing I can thing of is that your Automatic is stealing lots of HP. Is your stall set correctly?

Also, 24 # injectors would probably be ideal for your set-up with stock fuel pressure. Maybe you have a bad injector? Does your engine eat oil?

Man, this one has me stumped!

Sorry I couldn't help more. Maybe a few more details could helps us figure out your problem.

E

------------------
1991 5.0 LX Coupe - 38,000 miles

13.17 @ 106.14 mph w/ 2.138 60'

SaleenGTS · 06-12-2001, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by NOphonyponys:
Keep in mind that 216RWHP means you have about 290HP +/-10HP at the flywheel. Your AOD drivetrain wil cause you to loose about 80-90 HP, compared to the T-5 which only looses about 50-60 HP thru the drivetrain.

And 290 flywheel HP on that car isn't TOO bad, even with your mods...

216 rwhp is FAR from 290 crank hp. 216 rwhp is more like 260 bhp.

last month I took car to track for first time
ran a best time of 14.4@95mph, had car dynoed also and got 216wrhp. those # are worse then a stock mustang.

Stock GT's push around 190-195 rwhp, so I'd say that 216 is awfully low for a car with Performer heads and a TFS intake. Did you personally install them? Or did someone sell it to you like that?

You should be around 260-270 rwhp with the AOD.

The 19#ers are killing you, you also need a higher fuel pump too.

Is your converter working properly?

Just some things to check over.

Good luck.

------------------
Dustin
Saleenized 89 GT,428 rwhp,TFS Street Heat Intake,TFS TW Heads,TFS #2 cam,BD-11A 9 psi,FRPP 1.6 rr's,BBK 70mm TB,Pro-M 75mm Bullet,MSD 6BTM, FMS 9mm wires,BBK longtubes,BBK Short H-pipe,American Thunder cat back,3.55's

12.3@119

[This message has been edited by SaleenGTS (edited 06-12-2001).]

[This message has been edited by SaleenGTS (edited 06-12-2001).]

dinomite · 06-12-2001, 05:18 PM

Ya, you need some 24* injectors.

TJR · 06-12-2001, 05:48 PM

Granted 24lb injectors would be better, but wouldn't it run alright with increased fuel pressure with the 19s. Maybe the wire harness going to one of the injectors isn't connected all the way.

Didn't 88workcar run 12.20 @ 112 with the Eldlebrock heads, 19lb injectors, and stock fuel pressure?

------------------
1989 lx notch
89,000 miles
bolt-ons,stock heads/cam
60'- 2.07, 8.90@78, 13.93@99

TJR · 06-12-2001, 06:00 PM

Thought of another possibility, maybe the ports don't match up between the intake and heads. I don't think this is the case here but I'm running out of ideas.

------------------
1989 lx notch
89,000 miles
bolt-ons,stock heads/cam
60'- 2.07, 8.90@78, 13.93@99

PAUL-90GT · 06-12-2001, 07:05 PM

I had the car in shop on monday, they took apart the top half and checked the cam to see if it was installed correctly, it was. The only thing he found was that the rockers wernt set properly so he reset them.
when I had car dynoed I had th 30Ib injectors in it, since then i took them out and put back my 19Ib (as per avdice from a lot of people telling me 30ib inj were over kill)
the 19ib should be more then enough for my setup.
just about everything on the engine is new except for bottom half (pistons,rings bearings)
Most of the engine work was done by a friend who races a Nova he built himself so
I'm assuming he did the work rght.
when I called lentech to order a torque converter they asked me about the mods I did to engine and what cam I have in it and based on that info they recommended a 2800 stall TC, i can't see where the TC may be problem.

jimberg · 06-12-2001, 07:20 PM

With 34 psi and 19# injectors, you can only support about 228 hp reliably at 80% duty cycle. Raise your fuel pressure to 49 psi. You should probably get a 155lph fuel pump, too. 24# injectors are the right size for you setup. 30# probably was too big and 19# are too small.

------------------
351W 89 Mustang GT Convertible

06-11-2001, 11:36 PM	#1
PAUL-90GT Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Not of this world Posts: 6	What's wrong with my setup? last month I took car to track for first time ran a best time of 14.4@95mph, had car dynoed also and got 216wrhp. those # are worse then a stock mustang. What could be the problem? ran a code scan -NO CODES, ran a compression test - 140psi vacuum was 14psi, timing is set at 14. Anybody have any Idea's what could be wrong? here's a list of mods I have done. performer heads,TFs street intake,1.6 rockers,e-cam,65mm TB,76mm MAF,19IB inj,headers,h-pipe,flowmasters,underdrive pullies,2800 stall TC,4:10's,control arms. The car's a 90GT AUTO with 110,000 miles

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06-12-2001, 06:12 AM	#2
TJR Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Bowling Green, OH Posts: 270	Whats your fuel pressure set at? ------------------ 1989 lx notch 89,000 miles bolt-ons,stock heads/cam 60'- 2.07, 8.90@78, 13.93@99

06-12-2001, 09:31 AM	#3
PAUL-90GT Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Not of this world Posts: 6	fuel pressure is set at 34

06-12-2001, 10:10 AM	#4
TJR Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Bowling Green, OH Posts: 270	34 with 19lb injectors sounds lean to me. Stock is 38 - 40. What do your plugs look like? Do you still have the stock fuel pump? What altitude are you at? ------------------ 1989 lx notch 89,000 miles bolt-ons,stock heads/cam 60'- 2.07, 8.90@78, 13.93@99

06-12-2001, 10:43 AM	#5
PAUL-90GT Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Not of this world Posts: 6	I have the 190-lph fuel pump I believe the track is near sea level. I know I need to bump up my fuel pressure, I just changed my inj back to 19Ib from 30Ib so thats why the fuel pressure is at 34

06-12-2001, 10:49 AM	#6
jimberg Registered Member Join Date: Oct 1998 Location: Rogers, MN Posts: 2,089	Did you lower your fuel pressure when "tuning" it at the dyno? If so, you probably were running rich because of bad O2 sensors. When's the last time you replaced them? If you replaced them recently and your car runs better lean, you may want to get a custom chip burned. The problem with twiddling with fuel pressure is that the computer will just compensate by changing injector pulse width. Read the article about Adaptive Strategy in Articles/Electronics on this site. You could also try just resetting your computer at the track. This will clear any adaptation values. If you do tune at the dyno, you should reset the computer before every run, too. This will make every thing consistent from the dyno to the track. ------------------ 351W 89 Mustang GT Convertible

06-12-2001, 11:39 AM	#7
TJR Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Bowling Green, OH Posts: 270	Is the mass air calibrated for the 19lb injectors? ------------------ 1989 lx notch 89,000 miles bolt-ons,stock heads/cam 60'- 2.07, 8.90@78, 13.93@99

06-12-2001, 12:09 PM	#8
PAUL-90GT Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Not of this world Posts: 6	the mass air is calibrated for 19IB injectors

06-12-2001, 12:16 PM	#9
NOphonyponys Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Posts: 11	Keep in mind that 216RWHP means you have about 290HP +/-10HP at the flywheel. Your AOD drivetrain wil cause you to loose about 80-90 HP, compared to the T-5 which only looses about 50-60 HP thru the drivetrain. And 290 flywheel HP on that car isn't TOO bad, even with your mods... ------------------ ONLY 325 RWHP??? DAMN...

06-12-2001, 12:43 PM	#10
TJR Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Bowling Green, OH Posts: 270	What do your plugs look like? Did you check them immediately after your runs at the track? ------------------ 1989 lx notch 89,000 miles bolt-ons,stock heads/cam 60'- 2.07, 8.90@78, 13.93@99

06-12-2001, 01:28 PM	#11
PAUL-90GT Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Not of this world Posts: 6	the plugs where tan when I pulled them also didnt do a dyno tune the shop felt it would have been a waste of money since HP was so low the 02 sensors are about a year old

06-12-2001, 02:01 PM	#12
exgmguy Registered Member Join Date: Feb 1999 Location: Utica, Michigan Posts: 2,631	Maybe your valvetrain is not adjusted properly? If your rockers are too tight you will lose significant power. ------------------ 1988 Mustang GT 12.0 @ 122 1992 BadAzz Wrangler 1993 Explorer

06-12-2001, 04:01 PM	#13
TJR Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Bowling Green, OH Posts: 270	Was the cam degreed when it was installed? The cam timing could be off. Did you pull the spout connector when you set the timing? You may want to recheck it because it is an easy fix. Also, try what exgmguy said and readjust the valves. ------------------ 1989 lx notch 89,000 miles bolt-ons,stock heads/cam 60'- 2.07, 8.90@78, 13.93@99

06-12-2001, 04:11 PM	#14
302 LX Eric or '331 LX Eric' Join Date: Jan 1999 Location: Columbus, Ohio Posts: 2,142	216 rwhp and 14.4 @ 95 sound way off from where you should be. The only thing I can thing of is that your Automatic is stealing lots of HP. Is your stall set correctly? Also, 24 # injectors would probably be ideal for your set-up with stock fuel pressure. Maybe you have a bad injector? Does your engine eat oil? Man, this one has me stumped! Sorry I couldn't help more. Maybe a few more details could helps us figure out your problem. E ------------------ 1991 5.0 LX Coupe - 38,000 miles 13.17 @ 106.14 mph w/ 2.138 60'

06-12-2001, 05:18 PM	#16
dinomite The Dude Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Arlington, VA Posts: 1,262	Ya, you need some 24* injectors.

06-12-2001, 05:48 PM	#17
TJR Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Bowling Green, OH Posts: 270	Granted 24lb injectors would be better, but wouldn't it run alright with increased fuel pressure with the 19s. Maybe the wire harness going to one of the injectors isn't connected all the way. Didn't 88workcar run 12.20 @ 112 with the Eldlebrock heads, 19lb injectors, and stock fuel pressure? ------------------ 1989 lx notch 89,000 miles bolt-ons,stock heads/cam 60'- 2.07, 8.90@78, 13.93@99

06-12-2001, 06:00 PM	#18
TJR Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Bowling Green, OH Posts: 270	Thought of another possibility, maybe the ports don't match up between the intake and heads. I don't think this is the case here but I'm running out of ideas. ------------------ 1989 lx notch 89,000 miles bolt-ons,stock heads/cam 60'- 2.07, 8.90@78, 13.93@99

06-12-2001, 07:05 PM	#19
PAUL-90GT Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Not of this world Posts: 6	I had the car in shop on monday, they took apart the top half and checked the cam to see if it was installed correctly, it was. The only thing he found was that the rockers wernt set properly so he reset them. when I had car dynoed I had th 30Ib injectors in it, since then i took them out and put back my 19Ib (as per avdice from a lot of people telling me 30ib inj were over kill) the 19ib should be more then enough for my setup. just about everything on the engine is new except for bottom half (pistons,rings bearings) Most of the engine work was done by a friend who races a Nova he built himself so I'm assuming he did the work rght. when I called lentech to order a torque converter they asked me about the mods I did to engine and what cam I have in it and based on that info they recommended a 2800 stall TC, i can't see where the TC may be problem.

06-12-2001, 07:20 PM	#20
jimberg Registered Member Join Date: Oct 1998 Location: Rogers, MN Posts: 2,089	With 34 psi and 19# injectors, you can only support about 228 hp reliably at 80% duty cycle. Raise your fuel pressure to 49 psi. You should probably get a 155lph fuel pump, too. 24# injectors are the right size for you setup. 30# probably was too big and 19# are too small. ------------------ 351W 89 Mustang GT Convertible