Q about starter heat shields

[5.0 Fiend]

I have changed the battery, got a new starter cable, and the car still persists to not want to start when it gets warm. When you try to start it, it sounds like a dead battery, (very slow rpms), but if you come back when it's bone cold, it will start back up. I really dont feel like removing the starter to have it rebuilt, (damn cold, no garage), and I would love to have a mini torquer, but the money just isnt in the cards, will a heat shield solve my problems?

[KiltedBanshees93GT]

It couldn't hurt, how old is the starter and are you running long tubes? My 66 has the same problem or as we called it the "Semi-Annual starter-feeding". You could get a shield and see if it helps, but if that starters too far gone, you might still need to replace. Word of advice, Lifetime warrenties: GOOD. I had to do that on the 66 not too long after I got her, popped for the extra $, and next time it happened, just pulled it, went to the store and got a new one for free.
Hope it helps, and let me know how well the shield/wrap works.

J

[82 GT]

What year mustang do you have? If it's a pre-'92 you can get one from a '92-95 mustang that comes factory with a mini starter.
You would need slight wire modifications to have it work. Nothing major though.
I might be wrong with when they started with the mini starters but I know they had them in '94-95
I had the same problem with my car and I bought one for a '94GT and it works fine on my 351w even.

[~The Jester~]

These guys hit the nail on the head with the starters. Another thing to check, might want to reach in there and yank a couple degrees timing out of it too.

[Ieatcamaros]

Jester beat me to it. I was thinking the same thing as I was reading. What is your timing set at? Heat shields do wonders too.

[5.0 Fiend]

The car is an 84, so I imagine thr starter is that old, also I am running shorty headers.
What do you guys mean by timing? Ignition? Cam? I dont have a timing light, should probably get one, I just take the number one plug out, jump the starter solenoid to get the cylinder on the compression stroke to top dead center, then I point the rotor to that wire and do a quarter mile run (estimated), and keep adjusting the dist. till I am happy with the results. Why would the timing affect the engine when hot, but not cold? The next time it happens, should I try to retard the dist timing a little bit? I guess I'll try a heat shield to see If I can pull a little more life out of the starter.

[andy669]

Advanced ignition timing will cause the slow crank syndrome like you are experiencing. That would have been my first guess.

Andy

[5.0 Fiend]

Why would advanced timing do this? Are you saying that if the advanced timing was the culprit, that it would still only happen when hot? Would the answer be that when the engine is turning over it has to work harder because the compression and power stroke are getting pushed closer together? (meaning that when the engine is trying to compress, the advanced spark wants to start the power stroke thus causing strain for the weak stock starter)?

[82 GT]

First of all, every guy that works on his own car should at least have a timing light.
If your timing is too high, your engine will struggle to turn over even when cold and damn near impossible when hot.
My guess is that your starter is getting heat soaked now that you have shorties and I'm assuming flowmaster exhaust.
Get rid of that big bulky starter and buy a mini starter for a '94GT.
I had this same problem with starters when I got my flowmaster exhaust and shorties. Since I switched to a mini starter, my problem is gone. I'm willing to bet that you have the same problem.
Trust me, get rid of that antique starter you have.
I can tell you what wires you need to switch around if you decide to go with a mini starter from a newer mustang.

[rwhite65]

First, the mini starter is nice, bought one out of the junk yard for $35 and it now rest in the 65.

I can not explain as nearly as good as these guys as to why the advanced timing makes it start slow, but I can tell you this. If it is advanced to far, it will do it when the car is hot vs. cold.
Ryan

[5.0 Fiend]

Yeah, I guess I'll need a timing light, where do you point the gun at after you hook it up? The harmonic balancer? I never noticed any numbers on it.
Next up, what year stangs had the mini starters? 94-95?
As for my exhaust, it came on the car when I bought it, the headers are rusted, so they must be old, (did 84's come stock with headers?), then I've got the standard exhaust going down by the front wheels where it connects to 60 inch six sided glasspack chrome shielded side dumps.

[82 GT]

I know for sure the '94-95's had the mini starter...they may have started in '92 but I'm not positive about that.
It's hard to see the numbers on the balancer...especially after road grime and gunk gets on there.
Buy some timing tape for about $6 and put it on your balancer. It goes all the way around the balancer and the numbers are much easier to read/see(that's what I did).
Yes, you point the light at the balancer. There should be some type of pointer attached to the timing cover.
I would get the mini starter first and see how it starts after that...and then mess with the timing.
So...set the timing at "zero". The spark plug method you're using now should get you in the ballpark.....get a starter(which should cure your problem)...and then set your timing with a light to get it where you want it.
I'm willing to bet anything that your old starter is getting "heat soaked". The mini starter will gve you more space between the exhaust pipes and the starter.

[82 GT]

BTW, where exactly are you in "central Pa." How far are you from Danville?

[rwhite65]

sorry I can not remember for sure what years, but the mini starter came on the 92 93ish and up ford trucks with a 302.
Ryan

[5.0 Fiend]

Originally Posted by 82 GT

BTW, where exactly are you in "central Pa." How far are you from Danville?

I'm about 20 miles north of State College (Penn State), if I'm not mistaken Danville is fairly close to Knoebles (Elysburg), so I bet I'm about 60-70 miles away from you.
Also, Ive seen the timing tape, is there a wrong way to install it, (i.e. do the numbers have to be at a certain spot on the balancer, or does the timing light flash out the number no matter how you installed the tape)?

[82 GT]

You're going to have to find TDC first and then install the tape.
In other words, "zero" on the tape need to match up with actual TDC on the balancer. So, yes, it can be installed wrong.
BTW, I'm about 20miles from Knoebles.

So what are you going to do? Get a mini starter?

[5.0 Fiend]

I think I'll try the heat wrap first, and try checking some junkyards for a decent priced mini, I dont drive the stang too much right now, being that the tires are damn near bald, and the shitty weather.