How to be 11sec fast?

[90dpscoupe]

Look, some arrogant a$$ ls1 and other drivers around here that need to be beat, what could i do to run 11.9-12.0 with just motor? 331...351..? aluminum heads? anyone know any tried and true combos? and ran on e/t streets? i know a SC would be great too, but any ideas? sorry about another topic like this again, but i have nowhere to turn.

How many thousands$ will it take?

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90 lx coupe: Mac cold air fenderwell, accel supercoil,advncd ignition,3-core radiatr, FMS alum D/S, Black magic fan, 3.27grs, 3chbr flows.
Best time: 13.9116(on 225/60/15 firehawks)
Best mph: 97.80
Best 60': 2.0047

next mods: subframes, mac h-pipe

[WADS56]

I'm sure you no what it takes, but you are wishing for someone to give you a magical combo that only cost $19.95
If you want to stay NA you will need- intake,heads,full exhaust, fuel upgrades, and a good cam to complament all of the choices you will make. Pluss, you will need to ditch the 3.27's and get some 4.10's Lot's of people have done it with the stock bottom end, but a stroker with the parts listed above will put you where you want to be for sure. I am taking a guss off the top of my head, but I think you will need atleast 4000.00

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Blown 347 W/Canfield heads, solid roller cam, track times this spring mid 10's or bust

93lx 5.0 daily driver

[WADS56]

Now that I think of it, you should post this in the drag racing forum. Jeff Chambers is in the high 11's on his trophy stock car. He would know what it takes and how much cash.

[Smokedawg]

I just finished all my modifications as you can read in my signature line. The final cost for the project is approx $3000. Thats really not to bad. I mean this car was completly stock except for gears, flowmaster and cobra transmission when I started so ALL other mods listed only costed $3000.

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347 Stroker Motor: Balanced, 30lb Bosch Injectors, Cobra Computer, Cobra Transmission, GT40 Ported and Polished Upper and Lower, GT40 Milled Ported and Polished Heads, B303 Cam, BBK 1 5/8 Headers, March Underdrive Pulleys, Electric Fan, Accel Performance Coil, Accel 300+ Racing Wires, NGK Plugs, Ram Air, K&N Filter, 77mm Mass Air Unit, FlowMaster Exhaust w/offroad H-Pipe, Hurst Short Throw Shifter, 3:55 Gears, Ram Clutch, Cross Drilled Rotors, High Tolerant Painted Calipers and Drums.

[This message has been edited by Smokedawg (edited 02-13-2001).]

[NOS_Notch]

3.27's?????????? Must be an AOD car.
Better add about $2500 to whatever figure you come up with.
AOD car to go 11's....I'd say $5k-$6k



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4.10's,long tubes & 75 shot...Goes 12.50's
Check it out at http://www.burnouts.webprovider.com

[1989GT]

Depends on if you want to stay NA or if you want a power adder. You have to drop 2 full seconds to get there.

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89GT,T-5Z, D.S.S. 306 shortblock w\main support, B-303 cam, Cobra intake, GT40P heads, 1.72rr, MAC "P" headers, MAC off-road H-Pipe, MAC true-fit w\tips, 373's...and the list goes on!
Throttle Junkie Powered by Ford!
12.824 @ 107.05 MPH
PVT Blankenship leaving for BCT 14MAR01
MOS 67 Romeo

Hey whats up man!

Got some LS1s to beat? Just call me (kidding-flame suite on)

With your car, and millage, I will say just start afresh. A 331 stroker kit (with your stockblock), TFS heads 300cfm-int/230cfm-exh) @500 lift, Victor jnr intake, 75mm TB, 80mm mass-air, custom cam (call Houston performance or Ed Curtis of FTI fame), 1 3/4 longtube headers.

With that setup u will be running mid to low, low 11s with some sticky tires. Trapping @ 116mph-120mph (depending on weight of car. U might have to shift @6200-6500RPM though. But a 28ounce balanced crank will take that without a problem.

Hey guess what? 2 weeks after I went to the track and posted these # (in sig), My cats would not let my car run (been running too rich). I gutted them ut and the car is a new monster. Haven't been to the track since (busy with school) but hopefully will visit soon.

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TFS heads, Holley intake, AFM B-2 cam, 77mm MAF, 65mmTB, Bassani X-pipe with cats and Autologic custom chip. NOS dry kit, 80hp shot just installed.
Black SN95
13.8 @105mph NA
13.2 @112mph 80hp NOS
Wet track, running on NOS setting on NA runs (pig rich and 8 deg timing)

[Skyman]

Im sorry, but there is on way you got a 347 with those heads and the transmission put together for only $3000.

I agree, I think you will know what it takes to hit 11's. I would not go with a 331 or 347 stroker. Thats maybe another 40-50hp at best, and its going to cost a lot more.

Your either going to need a lighter car with a high compression 306 with a high revving cam and heads, and deep gears with suspension work, or a power adder.

Skyler

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-1989 Saleen Mustang #406-
TFS Heads, Edelbrock intake, E-303, 3.73's, 1 5/8 shortys, Offroad-H, 2chamber flows, 36psi FPR, 15degrees timing, 70mm tb, 73mm maf, 24lb inj, Crank pulley, MSD6A, Alum driveshaft, ripper shifter, and turndowns.
13.2@106mph

Daily Driver
STOCK-1994 Integra LS
15.48@91mph

[Smokedawg]

Skyman..I just finished my mods so I dont think you have the right to tell ME that it didnt cost me that much. I can list you the price of every item if you like. And if you would have read farther into my listing you would have read that I already had the cobra transmission. Also I didnt have to pay for installation or have to pay to have it put together because my dad owns his own machine shop.

Thanks alot.

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347 Stroker Motor: Balanced, 30lb Bosch Injectors, Cobra Computer, Cobra Transmission, GT40 Ported and Polished Upper and Lower, GT40 Milled Ported and Polished Heads, B303 Cam, BBK 1 5/8 Headers, March Underdrive Pulleys, Electric Fan, Accel Performance Coil, Accel 300+ Racing Wires, NGK Plugs, Ram Air, K&N Filter, 77mm Mass Air Unit, FlowMaster Exhaust w/offroad H-Pipe, Hurst Short Throw Shifter, 3:55 Gears, Ram Clutch, Cross Drilled Rotors, High Tolerant Painted Calipers and Drums.

[This message has been edited by Smokedawg (edited 02-14-2001).]

[LX XLR8R]

suspenion tires and a good breathing 302..im hoping to hit the 11.99 mark with my current mods after i tune it..

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1987 black notch(ex 4 banger)
DSS 306 w/ main support...Elderbrock 6028 heads..gt-40 intake..24# injectors...70 mm tb..77 pro-m...accel 300+..mac full legnth..tremec w/ pro5oh...full MAC exhaust,off road h-pipe,long tubes, catback...ron davis radiator..subframes, control arms...CFDF II..o yea holley FPR sucks..dont buy one..

[Smokedawg]

A 347 adds more than 40 to 50 horse skyman. I seriously think you have no idea what you are talking about. A 347 will give you 375HP. Proven Fact. With my setup I am pushing over 440HP.

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347 Stroker Motor: Balanced, 30lb Bosch Injectors, Cobra Computer, Cobra Transmission, GT40 Ported and Polished Upper and Lower, GT40 Milled Ported and Polished Heads, B303 Cam, BBK 1 5/8 Headers, March Underdrive Pulleys, Electric Fan, Accel Performance Coil, Accel 300+ Racing Wires, NGK Plugs, Ram Air, K&N Filter, 77mm Mass Air Unit, FlowMaster Exhaust w/offroad H-Pipe, Hurst Short Throw Shifter, 3:55 Gears, Ram Clutch, Cross Drilled Rotors, High Tolerant Painted Calipers and Drums.

[Unit 5302]

Smokedawg, based on the information in your signature, I'd say a 302 would be making at least 350hp, if you are making 440hp, that'd be a 90hp advantage. The 331 or course wouldn't make much more than 50hp more N/A over the 302 if the 347 is only giving you 90hp. I'm sure what Skyman is saying is that the 331-347 will only give 50hp over a 302 in a light modded equal configuration. IE: GT-40 302 vs GT-40 347. Course, I don't pay any attention to strokers, I can't afford them, I wouldn't be likely to buy one based on reliability issues. So I'm certainly no master on that subject.

I do know the more mods you make, the more the 347 is going to benefit over the 302, but it will never be as reliable as the 302, and you shouldn't add forced induction to a 347. The 331 and lower strokers can be put on the squeeze though.

As far as your combo costing $3k, I have no idea, if the heads are irons for sure, if they are aluminum it's harder to compute, obviously with new units most people would be riding over the 3k pretty decent, but whatever. You're right about Sky missing the fact that your tranny was a freebie though, oh well, everybody makes an error sometimes. Gasp, shock, horror, even the almighty Unit 5302. No, no, don't try and stop me, I can admit it, even I can sometimes, rarely, possibly make an error.

I'll have to say Skyman has been researching combos for a good minute and he's been a very productive member of this board, to have him flamed by a new member is kinda hard to ignore.

[SaleenGTS]

Hey...you can just spend ONLY $19.95. Just go buy some Giant sticker, and japanese writing...then get some clear lights and neons underneath....that is good for atleast 11.50's.

Really though, I'd get a good stroker(coast has a good kit)heads that flow 270+ int, .550-.560 cam, good intake(Holley,Saleen/Vortech,TFS TH...) and long tubes, with the other givens...with 10.5-11.0 comp you should have 375-390 rwhp...I've seen it done mesef

SMOKEDOG- like unit said, don't start that here and with our bud Sky. He DOES know what he is talking about, and is in-fact correct. a 347 vs.302 will net you about a 40-50 hp gain with everything that was in the 302 swapped over to the 347....what do you actually think that by just installing a 347 you will magically have a 11 sec car?? hell no. My bud has a 300 rwhp 347, so there is proof there. And he is right on another issue. Cost of getting a stroker to run good times....I'll list it for ya so there isn't any arguement. I'll even list the cheapest prices I have seen.

347: $1500 from Summit
HEADS: $950(TFS from Saleen)
INTAKE: $400(TFS or Cobra)
CAM: $150(TFS from Summit)
RR's: $200
TB: $200
MAF: $200
HEADERS: $200(shorties)
H-PIPE: $150(MAC)
CAT-BACK:$180(Dynomax)
GEARS: $300 installed

I'm sure I forgot some stuff, but that alone is $4,400, and that doesn't include shipping or having the motor built. So Sky was very much right


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Dustin
1993 Cobra #1926

Bassani Full lengths,Bassani short X-pipe, American thunder Cat back, 3.55's. More to come...

[This message has been edited by SaleenGTS (edited 02-19-2001).]

[Smokedawg]

How experienced are you people with building mustang motors. I have rebuilt nearly 25 302 mustangs. Now if your friend has a 302 and made it a 347 and he is getting 300hp then that is a giant jump, because they only have 225hp. Now I am not for sure but if my math is correct thats 75 HP. Like I said My father and I own and work in our own shop so we get all parts free shipping and no labor for motor build. We ported and polished my heads. Ported and polished upper and lower intake. They port job on the head is worth 500. and 150. for the intakes. So Like I said I only have cost in new parts estimating around 3000.

Ross Racing Forged Pistons 500
Eagle Forged 5.400 Rods 320
Motor Bored 100
Melling High Vol Oil Pump 30
Rings 30
Barrings 30
Fel-Pro Gasket Rebuild Kit 90
B303 Cam 160
Heads and Intakes 350
BBK Headers 160
Off Road H-Pipe 130
Cobra Computer Stole It
Accel wires 80
Accel Coil 50
Ram Air 150
Underdrive Pulleys 90
Roller lifters 160

See Thats quite a bit of stuff there and still not close to 3000.00



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347 Stroker Motor: Balanced, 30lb Bosch Injectors, Cobra Computer, Cobra Transmission, GT40 Ported and Polished Upper and Lower, GT40 Milled Ported and Polished Heads, B303 Cam, BBK 1 5/8 Headers, March Underdrive Pulleys, Electric Fan, Accel Performance Coil, Accel 300+ Racing Wires, NGK Plugs, Ram Air, K&N Filter, 77mm Mass Air Unit, FlowMaster Exhaust w/offroad H-Pipe, Hurst Short Throw Shifter, 3:55 Gears, Ram Clutch, Cross Drilled Rotors, High Tolerant Painted Calipers and Drums.

[Smokedawg]

Now check out this site for 347 Horsepower
http://www.ford-power.com/370-347.htm

everything in this I have accept the heads and mine are gt40 iron Fully ported and polished

Now plus my other mods
77Mass Air
Ram Air
Underdrive Pulleys
Cobra Computer
Ported and Polished Upper and Lower Intake
Off Road H Pipe
Headers
Accel Distibutor, COil, Wires
BM Electric Fan

And I am not an inexperienced poster, I have been posting here for months. Like you said you dont have much knowledge in stroker motors so how can you say the HP difference.

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347 Stroker Motor: Balanced, 30lb Bosch Injectors, Cobra Computer, Cobra Transmission, GT40 Ported and Polished Upper and Lower, GT40 Milled Ported and Polished Heads, B303 Cam, BBK 1 5/8 Headers, March Underdrive Pulleys, Electric Fan, Accel Performance Coil, Accel 300+ Racing Wires, NGK Plugs, Ram Air, K&N Filter, 77mm Mass Air Unit, FlowMaster Exhaust w/offroad H-Pipe, Hurst Short Throw Shifter, 3:55 Gears, Ram Clutch, Cross Drilled Rotors, High Tolerant Painted Calipers and Drums.

[SaleenGTS]

I'm not saying that a 347 can't make serious HP. I did forget to mention that he also has the SystemMax 2 kit with his 347, now that isn't so impressive is it?

Your list of info is good, but until I see a dyno sheet, I don't see your 440 hp, but for now I'll have to take your word for it.

Like you said, you get stuff for cheap and free because your dad has a shop. This guy doesn't, and will have to pay the full prices for stuff if he wants to do it right. So your prices don't really hold water, do they?

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Dustin
1993 Cobra #1926

Bassani Full lengths,Bassani short X-pipe, American thunder Cat back, 3.55's. More to come...

[Skyman]

I didnt intend to start a flame here or straight out attack you, but that looks like what you have done to me here.

First off, sorry I didn't notice that you already had the Z spec tranny.

Heres your first quote of ignorance...
"A 347 adds more than 40 to 50 horse skyman. I seriously think you have no idea what you are talking about. A 347 will give you 375HP. Proven Fact. With my setup I am pushing over 440HP."

Adds more than 40 or 50 horse to what? Im talking on a well breathing 302 given around 300hp w/ heads, cam, intake etc. You add a 347 its going to add roughly 50hp just given the cubes. Your saying a 347 will give you 375hp proven fact? With what heads is that? E7TE's? I highly doubt it. With what cam? What compression? What intake? So I can just go get me a 347 slam it all together and make 375hp. Oh jeeze I wish building engines was that simple. And don't go quoteing how much horse power you have untill you dyno your car. I'm willing to bet you your first pull wont even net you 390hp.

Now I'm looking at your parts list. Doesn't seem like your engine is going to be running very well here with out a crank. Doesn't that usually cost some money? That puts you over $3000 right there. Also were those 30lb Injectors free? I doubt it. You say you got your heads and intakes for only $350. Thats damn cheap, but I can't argue with you on that really. Oh by the way, my off road H-pipe was only $89 and I didn't get any special discount. No fuel pressure regulator? Going to be tough tuneing that beast with out one of those.

Also looks like your running that stolen Cobra computer. Anyone thats been around stangs know the cobra computers are sh*t. I would think someone that has rebuilt 25 5.0's would atleast not to know to use a Cobra computer. You ought to go get yourself a A9L (Just a peice of friendly advice).

Your using a B-303 cam in that car. You dont mention 1.6 or 1.7 rockers. If your running 1.6's theres no way that cam is going to be enough to get 400+ hp out of that 347. Even with 1.7's it may not be enough. The high duration maybe the only thing that gets you there if you use 1.7's.

Also what kind of compression are you running? 13.5:1? Then you may make 400+hp. You never specified this.

This link you show of a 370hp 347 engine uses World prodcuts heads with 2.02" valves. MUCH larger valves then your GT40 heads have. Though with porting they should flow about the same. So where does the extra 70hp come from? Are you going to rev your engine to the moon? It sure isn't going to make power that high with that B-303 cam. Also this engine is just magically rated at 370hp. They give you no dyno #'s or actual real life facts. Yes, it will probably make that much power once setup right with all the right components and tuned well, but this is no way in hell to gauge what kind of power your engine is making.

I'm not normally an ******* . But when someone comes out and attacks me when they don't even know theyre own crap or have anything to back up what they are saying then I do get a little irritated.

Honestly though, no flame intended.

Skyler

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-1989 Saleen Mustang #406-
TFS Heads, E-303 Cam, Edelbrock Intake, and a whole lot more.
13.2@106mph
-Shooting for 12's and a 351 slowly in the works!

Stock-94 Integra 15.48@91mph

[SaleenGTS]

Damn, Sky, go bud.

My thoughts exactly, I just didn't want to type all night, lol j/k.

Seriously though, if SmokeD has built 25 motors like he described, then hell, I bet he has a few pi$$ed customers...it's like:"hey man your motor is done!" "cool, I'll come pick it up" "OK for the 347 it will cost you $2000 with labor, heads, Intake, .300" cam, but you won't have the benefit of rockers, or a crank...hope you like it!!!"

I just hope that nobody on here lives by Smoke, because of this little scrub, his dad could have possibly lost s ton of business because of an arrogant kid that thinks he knows more than ME!!! And that surely is a mistake J/K Seriously though, if you are going to preach motor construction, atleast get your dad to look over your post before you insert your foot in your mouth so you don't make him look bad...k?

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Dustin
1993 Cobra #1926

Bassani Full lengths,Bassani short X-pipe, American thunder Cat back, 3.55's. More to come...

[Smokedawg]

Ok, Lets get it going here. The 30lb Injectors were free w/my 77 C&L Mass Air. I got the Heads and Intakes used for 350 plus all the race prepped porting and polishing was free. My compression ratio is 12.5:1. The reason my whole 347 stroker project started is because I received the crank on a liquidation. So I got the Eagle Crank for 300. The reason my H-pipe was more expensive is because it has a powerbox on it. You got a good deal no yours for 89, I’ve never saw one for under 100.

The duration of the cam is 289, that is enough to get me there for you opinion. I have net gain HP up to 6500RPM with my comp. Springs and retainers. I have 1.72 Comp Cams roller rockers.

The heads in the url I addressed were IRON, and my ports are bigger than those. If you read down farther you could receive ALUMINUM heads for an addition 600. And anyone w/computer knowledge knows the bad years for cobra computers were 94 and 95 smartone, I have 3 A9L but to run mass air need better set up, you should all know this come on now. This is all in fun but know your stuff before you try to catch me in something. And by looking at your stats you people havent done enough mods to know how to change a set of spark plugs. And one of your friends must have helped that other guy put that 347 together w/that systemMax 2 kit because that is just plain out pathetic.

"I'm not normally an ******* . But when someone comes out and attacks me when they don't even know theyre own crap or have anything to back up what they are saying then I do get a little irritated."

So lets keep your little questions coming so I can keep answering them and prove you guys wrong.


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347 Stroker Motor: Balanced, 30lb Bosch Injectors, Cobra Computer, Cobra Transmission, GT40 Ported and Polished Upper and Lower, GT40 Milled Ported and Polished Heads, B303 Cam, BBK 1 5/8 Headers, March Underdrive Pulleys, Electric Fan, Accel Performance Coil, Accel 300+ Racing Wires, NGK Plugs, Ram Air, K&N Filter, 77mm Mass Air Unit, FlowMaster Exhaust w/offroad H-Pipe, Hurst Short Throw Shifter, 3:55 Gears, Ram Clutch, Cross Drilled Rotors, High Tolerant Painted Calipers and Drums.

[1989GT]

Okay my $.02. If you have your own machine shop and get really good deals on everything. You can build a stroker for 3 grand, but for everyone else it's gonna cost you atleast 4 grand. Give or take a little.

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89GT,T-5Z, D.S.S. 306 shortblock w\main support, B-303 cam, Cobra intake, GT40P heads, 1.72rr, MAC "P" headers, MAC off-road H-Pipe, MAC true-fit w\tips, 373's...and the list goes on!
Throttle Junkie Powered by Ford!
12.824 @ 107.05 MPH
PVT Blankenship leaving for BCT 14MAR01
MOS 67 Romeo