fuel injection problem. Need help? - Page 2

PKRWUD · 08-11-2002, 01:59 AM

I may have some bad news for you. If you installed a 5spd ECM into your car, and didn't disconnect the wire at pin 30 (in the 60 pin ECM connector), you are frying your ECM, and have possibly damaged it allready. You need to unplug the 60 pin connector from the ECM, turn the key on, and check for voltage at pin 30.

I will be around tomorrow to help you if you need it.

Take care,
~Chris

grant66 · 08-11-2002, 06:16 AM

So I put my car on a lift last night and I could find the VSS. If I remember the AOD used the same hole as the gears for the speedometer. I believe PRKWUD said that the VSS was on the passenger side of the car. I did find a weird bolt that uses a male star bit. I did find the numbers on the transmission. Maybe we can start their. Borg Warner 13-52-066-919. Is this a t-5 transmission?

I sure hope I didn't fry my new computer. I will hopefully have that tested. I am going to be up set at these mechanics that have gone through three computers and two months of not having a car. They charge me $2,500. They did do some wiring work so hopefully it is good. I will test #30.

grant66 · 08-11-2002, 08:48 AM

65 DC Volts on pin 30 on the harness side of the engine. What do you think?

PKRWUD · 08-11-2002, 10:44 AM

If your tranny doesn't have a VSS, then that's a problem. Your ECM needs the input from a VSS to help it make decisions. Look again, and write down the all of the electrical connections that your tranny has. Write down how many wires go to each, and what color they are.

Read the voltage at pin 30 again. There is no way you have 65 volts there. Make sure it's disconnected from the ECM when you test it.

Take care,
~Chris

USMC302 · 08-11-2002, 02:51 PM

Chris,
If you remember a while back I was having the problem with the 88GT only firing four cylinders. I also did the aod to t5 swap and am about to replace the computer on it since I never did it before, could this maybe be my problem, do I need to disconnect the #30 pin wire? I put a A9L in it out of my perfectly running 88 5speed coupe and now the coupe is running like crap with it back in there, I swapped them hoping it was the computer that was the problem on the GT. I think there is some wire somewhere shorting it out and frying the computer. Any input would be great, I have spent so much $ trying to fix this, I should have gave it to Ford for $70 an hour a long time ago

PKRWUD · 08-11-2002, 06:26 PM

Yes, you will have a problem. Unplug the 60 pin connector, turn the key to ON, and check pin 30 for voltage. If you find none, have someone turn the key to START while you watch the DMM, and see if it has any voltage then. If not, you're good. If there is, let me know.

Take care,
~Chris

grant66 · 08-11-2002, 08:26 PM

I tested pin 30. Did you get my message? Is my transmission a t-5. How can I hook up a VSS?

PKRWUD · 08-11-2002, 08:29 PM

Grant, scroll up and read my reply to you.

USMC302 · 08-12-2002, 08:02 AM

Chris,

Just to be clear which pin is #30, is there a specific color that it is on all of the mustangs, is the 60 pin connector numbered? I will be doing this on Sat, the car is in a garage in Tx right now. If you remember I was going to pull the motor, but decided to get it running first. I am going to try to double ground the injector wire also. I will perform the self code reader test Sat also and maybe that will get us somewhere, please don't forget about me and my problem I am about to push it off into a river. You are my last hope! I will let you know Sat, thanks Chris for everything so far.

PKRWUD · 08-12-2002, 08:58 AM

LOL. No pressure.

Last I remember, I was waiting for you to test each injector with a noid light, when you decided to do something else.

Anyway, this should help:

USMC302 · 08-12-2002, 09:36 AM

I will do the noid light test Sat also. I hate to get my hopes up but i think we might get something this weekend. I will let you know Sat the codes I pull, the noid light test results, and if I have voltage on #30. Thanks again Chris.

USMC302 · 08-17-2002, 04:35 PM

Chris,

I tested the #30 pin and had 12.1 volts from it with the key in the on position. SHould I dosconnect it and leave it or what? Tha codes I pulled were as follows
#22
#14

Now the 12 and 14 were hard to tell , it was either a 12 and a 2 or a 14. There was a slight pause between 12 and 13, so we didn't know if we should keep counting or start over, if you keep going it is a 14, if you start over then we had a 14 only and a 22 only

Please let me know what is going on. Thanks

PKRWUD · 08-17-2002, 10:29 PM

You have probably damaged your ECM. You need to cut and tape the wire going to pin 30, reset the ECM, and see what happens, but odds are you've already damaged it.

Take care,
~Chris

USMC302 · 08-19-2002, 06:24 AM

Chris,

Ok, I will run the tests again after taping off #30. You said before that I most likely damaged it if it was a 5 speed computer, but it is still the automatic computer, I was told in the swap from aod to T5, you didn't need to swap computers so I never did and really never had any problems. I am hesitant putting another computer in it because I am afraid I will just fry it again. I will let you know about the tests tonight or tomorrow. Thanks for all of your help so far. Oh yeah, we tried reseting the ECM and that didn't work either...

PKRWUD · 08-19-2002, 09:47 AM

Then don't worry about the wire at pin 30. I thought I made it clear that this is only a problem if you have a 5 speed ECM in an AOD car (even if you now have a 5 speed). If the ECM is still an AOD ECM, it doesn't matter.

Go back to where we were before: get the noid light.

Take care,
~Chris

USMC302 · 08-19-2002, 10:06 AM

That explains why it fried the ECM I put in it, it was from a 5speed. Ok, I will test the harness with the noid light.

USMC302 · 08-27-2002, 02:16 PM

OK, as much as I wanted to find something wrong with the noid light test I didn't. All injector wires were pulsing..... Now what? Could it maybe be the pickup or the dist? Thanks for all of the help so far.

PKRWUD · 08-27-2002, 03:10 PM

That surprises me. If it was the distributor, it wouldn't always be the same plugs that didn't fire, it would be a wandering miss. Have you tried changing plugs?

USMC302 · 08-27-2002, 03:19 PM

yes sir, twice.

USMC302 · 08-27-2002, 03:24 PM

My uncle just called and said that the spark from the dist would not jump out as far as the ones that were firing ok when he unpluged the non-firing cylinders. He said when grounded a screw driver out and then he held it over a terminal without the wire on it and it would spark up to it about an inch on the good ones, but on the bad ones, he said it would spark as far at all. Said it was an orange spark too.

08-11-2002, 01:59 AM	#21
PKRWUD Junior Member Join Date: Mar 1999 Location: Ventura, California Posts: 8,981	I may have some bad news for you. If you installed a 5spd ECM into your car, and didn't disconnect the wire at pin 30 (in the 60 pin ECM connector), you are frying your ECM, and have possibly damaged it allready. You need to unplug the 60 pin connector from the ECM, turn the key on, and check for voltage at pin 30. I will be around tomorrow to help you if you need it. Take care, ~Chris __________________ Webmaster: Rice Haters Club Jim Porter Racing Peckerwoods Pit Stop Support Your Local RED & WHITE!

08-11-2002, 08:48 AM	#23
grant66 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Avon, CO, USA Posts: 63	Pin 30 Test 65 DC Volts on pin 30 on the harness side of the engine. What do you think? __________________ If it isn't broke you are not trying.

08-11-2002, 10:44 AM	#24
PKRWUD Junior Member Join Date: Mar 1999 Location: Ventura, California Posts: 8,981	If your tranny doesn't have a VSS, then that's a problem. Your ECM needs the input from a VSS to help it make decisions. Look again, and write down the all of the electrical connections that your tranny has. Write down how many wires go to each, and what color they are. Read the voltage at pin 30 again. There is no way you have 65 volts there. Make sure it's disconnected from the ECM when you test it. Take care, ~Chris __________________ Webmaster: Rice Haters Club Jim Porter Racing Peckerwoods Pit Stop Support Your Local RED & WHITE!

08-11-2002, 02:51 PM	#25
USMC302 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Gallatin, Tn Posts: 1,326	Chris, If you remember a while back I was having the problem with the 88GT only firing four cylinders. I also did the aod to t5 swap and am about to replace the computer on it since I never did it before, could this maybe be my problem, do I need to disconnect the #30 pin wire? I put a A9L in it out of my perfectly running 88 5speed coupe and now the coupe is running like crap with it back in there, I swapped them hoping it was the computer that was the problem on the GT. I think there is some wire somewhere shorting it out and frying the computer. Any input would be great, I have spent so much $ trying to fix this, I should have gave it to Ford for $70 an hour a long time ago __________________

08-11-2002, 06:26 PM	#26
PKRWUD Junior Member Join Date: Mar 1999 Location: Ventura, California Posts: 8,981	Yes, you will have a problem. Unplug the 60 pin connector, turn the key to ON, and check pin 30 for voltage. If you find none, have someone turn the key to START while you watch the DMM, and see if it has any voltage then. If not, you're good. If there is, let me know. Take care, ~Chris __________________ Webmaster: Rice Haters Club Jim Porter Racing Peckerwoods Pit Stop Support Your Local RED & WHITE!

08-11-2002, 06:16 AM	#22
grant66 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Avon, CO, USA Posts: 63	Can't find VSS So I put my car on a lift last night and I could find the VSS. If I remember the AOD used the same hole as the gears for the speedometer. I believe PRKWUD said that the VSS was on the passenger side of the car. I did find a weird bolt that uses a male star bit. I did find the numbers on the transmission. Maybe we can start their. Borg Warner 13-52-066-919. Is this a t-5 transmission? I sure hope I didn't fry my new computer. I will hopefully have that tested. I am going to be up set at these mechanics that have gone through three computers and two months of not having a car. They charge me $2,500. They did do some wiring work so hopefully it is good. I will test #30. __________________ If it isn't broke you are not trying.

08-11-2002, 08:26 PM	#27
grant66 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Avon, CO, USA Posts: 63	Did you get my last message? I tested pin 30. Did you get my message? Is my transmission a t-5. How can I hook up a VSS? __________________ If it isn't broke you are not trying.

08-11-2002, 08:29 PM	#28
PKRWUD Junior Member Join Date: Mar 1999 Location: Ventura, California Posts: 8,981	Grant, scroll up and read my reply to you. __________________ Webmaster: Rice Haters Club Jim Porter Racing Peckerwoods Pit Stop Support Your Local RED & WHITE!

08-12-2002, 08:02 AM	#29
USMC302 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Gallatin, Tn Posts: 1,326	Chris, Just to be clear which pin is #30, is there a specific color that it is on all of the mustangs, is the 60 pin connector numbered? I will be doing this on Sat, the car is in a garage in Tx right now. If you remember I was going to pull the motor, but decided to get it running first. I am going to try to double ground the injector wire also. I will perform the self code reader test Sat also and maybe that will get us somewhere, please don't forget about me and my problem I am about to push it off into a river. You are my last hope! I will let you know Sat, thanks Chris for everything so far. __________________

08-12-2002, 09:36 AM	#31
USMC302 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Gallatin, Tn Posts: 1,326	I will do the noid light test Sat also. I hate to get my hopes up but i think we might get something this weekend. I will let you know Sat the codes I pull, the noid light test results, and if I have voltage on #30. Thanks again Chris. __________________

08-17-2002, 04:35 PM	#32
USMC302 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Gallatin, Tn Posts: 1,326	Chris, I tested the #30 pin and had 12.1 volts from it with the key in the on position. SHould I dosconnect it and leave it or what? Tha codes I pulled were as follows #22 #14 Now the 12 and 14 were hard to tell , it was either a 12 and a 2 or a 14. There was a slight pause between 12 and 13, so we didn't know if we should keep counting or start over, if you keep going it is a 14, if you start over then we had a 14 only and a 22 only Please let me know what is going on. Thanks __________________

08-17-2002, 10:29 PM	#33
PKRWUD Junior Member Join Date: Mar 1999 Location: Ventura, California Posts: 8,981	You have probably damaged your ECM. You need to cut and tape the wire going to pin 30, reset the ECM, and see what happens, but odds are you've already damaged it. Take care, ~Chris __________________ Webmaster: Rice Haters Club Jim Porter Racing Peckerwoods Pit Stop Support Your Local RED & WHITE!

08-19-2002, 06:24 AM	#34
USMC302 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Gallatin, Tn Posts: 1,326	Chris, Ok, I will run the tests again after taping off #30. You said before that I most likely damaged it if it was a 5 speed computer, but it is still the automatic computer, I was told in the swap from aod to T5, you didn't need to swap computers so I never did and really never had any problems. I am hesitant putting another computer in it because I am afraid I will just fry it again. I will let you know about the tests tonight or tomorrow. Thanks for all of your help so far. Oh yeah, we tried reseting the ECM and that didn't work either... __________________

08-19-2002, 09:47 AM	#35
PKRWUD Junior Member Join Date: Mar 1999 Location: Ventura, California Posts: 8,981	Then don't worry about the wire at pin 30. I thought I made it clear that this is only a problem if you have a 5 speed ECM in an AOD car (even if you now have a 5 speed). If the ECM is still an AOD ECM, it doesn't matter. Go back to where we were before: get the noid light. Take care, ~Chris __________________ Webmaster: Rice Haters Club Jim Porter Racing Peckerwoods Pit Stop Support Your Local RED & WHITE!

08-19-2002, 10:06 AM	#36
USMC302 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Gallatin, Tn Posts: 1,326	That explains why it fried the ECM I put in it, it was from a 5speed. Ok, I will test the harness with the noid light. __________________

08-27-2002, 02:16 PM	#37
USMC302 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Gallatin, Tn Posts: 1,326	OK, as much as I wanted to find something wrong with the noid light test I didn't. All injector wires were pulsing..... Now what? Could it maybe be the pickup or the dist? Thanks for all of the help so far. __________________

08-27-2002, 03:10 PM	#38
PKRWUD Junior Member Join Date: Mar 1999 Location: Ventura, California Posts: 8,981	That surprises me. If it was the distributor, it wouldn't always be the same plugs that didn't fire, it would be a wandering miss. Have you tried changing plugs? __________________ Webmaster: Rice Haters Club Jim Porter Racing Peckerwoods Pit Stop Support Your Local RED & WHITE!

08-27-2002, 03:19 PM	#39
USMC302 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Gallatin, Tn Posts: 1,326	yes sir, twice. __________________

08-27-2002, 03:24 PM	#40
USMC302 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Gallatin, Tn Posts: 1,326	My uncle just called and said that the spark from the dist would not jump out as far as the ones that were firing ok when he unpluged the non-firing cylinders. He said when grounded a screw driver out and then he held it over a terminal without the wire on it and it would spark up to it about an inch on the good ones, but on the bad ones, he said it would spark as far at all. Said it was an orange spark too. __________________

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