TB Coolant Passage

pac663 · 02-24-2002, 01:07 AM

Is it ok to bypass the passage for the coolant through the throtle body? If so, why is it there? Is there any benefit? Thanks.

avbcon12 · 02-24-2002, 09:16 AM

its there to cool down the EGR spacer. if you still have the EGR operable then leave it alone!!
otherwise you will be heating up the intake with hot gases from the EGR.

adam

Hozer 88GTConv · 02-24-2002, 01:24 PM

I agree with leaving the coolant lines attached to your EGR spacer. The coolant is hot, true, but it is far cooler and still acts as a heat exchanger for EGR air which is considerably hotter than coolant.

pac663 · 02-24-2002, 07:29 PM

"COOL" Thanks.

StreetStang37 · 02-25-2002, 05:08 PM

I disconnected my lines and my EGR spacer and intake manifold run much much cooler now and on average I run about .2-.3 Mph faster on the GTECH with them disconnected. No dyno runs done, but my car runs better with it off, I haven't had any problems with it. It's your choice if you want a HOT or COOLER egr to COOL those gasses.

gtsr515 · 02-25-2002, 07:40 PM

Hozer said it right, the lines are to add heat for cold-start up, disconnecting then will increase heat transfer, not cool transfer.

I remember an article in 1987 MM/FF, the top 10 things not to do, and that was number 2 on the list.

Mach 1 · 02-26-2002, 12:16 AM

Heat for cold start up? There shouldnt be any heat there if its cold and then the coolant is also cold.

I would leave it connected if you have the EGR functional(although the cobra intake has EGR and doesnt use the coolant line) and disconnect it if the egr is non-functional.

Hozer 88GTConv · 02-26-2002, 02:38 PM

The coolant flowing through the EGR spacer COOLS the high-temperature air of the EGR system. If you disconnect it and your EGR system is intact, you are in effect superheating your intake charge of air, decreasing its density and robbing yourself of horsepower.

joe4speed · 02-26-2002, 04:59 PM

Get a Cobra intake and don't worry about it... They didn't!!

StreetStang37 · 02-27-2002, 05:48 AM

what would make the Cobra intake so special as to not need to "cool" the incomming gasses with the hot coolant then? Did Ford forget them? They must have done it for a reason.

Mach 1 · 02-27-2002, 11:30 AM

well, for one reason the cobra intake uses a "built in" EGR spacer.

It doesnt have the separate EGR plate that contains the cooling lines and the fluid path for the coolant.

Why did Ford do this?

Who knows? Probably cheaper to manufacture or something.

gtsr515 · 02-27-2002, 01:05 PM

Hozer is right on again, the coolant lines help with heating the air on cold-start up AND cool the super heated air when hot, MACH 1!, think about it, yes the car is bone cold upon start-up, but, the second you start the car, the water pump is distributing the warming coolant. And the reason Ford made the one piece Cobra intake/EGR was to eliminate tooling costs.

I've seen holes drilled into opposite sides of the EGR area, tapped, then a 1/4" threaded hose barb TO BOTH SIDES, and coolant lines plumbed into the system. ANYTHING to help cool the air is worth the trouble. KEEP THE LINES CONNECTED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

LX XLR8R · 02-27-2002, 01:15 PM

no egr no coolant lines and a plenum spacer =very cool intake..proof is in the doing..not reading and retyping what someone else has posted in the past..do it yourself and post logically or dont post at all..not trying to be a d1ck but way 2 many people on all BB(not just mworks) post something and ague that they are right but never have actally did it themselfs(not saying that all you guys havent)

gtsr515 · 02-27-2002, 01:43 PM

You should take your own advice, I was clearing up confusion for MACH 1, and answered very logically, and I have done this myself, for 15 years now. No EGR, etc, is a very cool intake, but that is not what Pac663 asked, he asked if it was okay to "bypass", not "eliminate" the coolant lines. Read the post before you mouth off and accuse me of arguing, I was just replying to a post, excuse me!

The reason I repeated what Hozer said was thats exactly what I was gonna say, sorry, I'll never do it again okay?

Mach 1 · 02-27-2002, 02:14 PM

I dont think I was ever confused...but anyway...cold coolant is not going to help cold air get warm when the engine is cold, along with the coolant. By the time the coolant is warm, so is the engine. The engine gets warm before the coolant.

And why would ford want to heat the incoming air? Is that why they put the air filter in the fender, away from heat, just so they could heat it up anyway with hot coolant and lose performance. I could see heating the cold air at cold start up only to facilitate engine warm up for emissions and gas mileage concerns, but the system doesnt work that way. It constantly routes hot coolant through the passage after the car is warmed up.

The coolant is there to cool the EGR gas only. If you have EGR leave it, if you have internally blocked off the EGR passages and there is no hot gases going to that area of your intake, then cap off the coolant lines to the EGR spacer.

Pretty straightforward if you ask me.

LX XLR8R · 02-27-2002, 02:20 PM

i wasnt directed my post to you..i was stating 2 facts..one being the first line of my post and the 2nd being that there is alot of bolt on bultinboard racers out there..i know you are not one of them..i have seen your posts and i know you know your stuff

LX XLR8R · 02-27-2002, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mach 1

The coolant is there to cool the EGR gas only. If you have EGR leave it, if you have internally blocked off the EGR passages and there is no hot gases going to that area of your intake, then cap off the coolant lines to the EGR spacer.

Pretty straightforward if you ask me.

all summed up right there..i should of just posted that

gtsr515 · 02-27-2002, 02:55 PM

Your right that the coolant lines cool the EGR gasses, but your wrong that it doesn't help cold start up, your forgetting the 5.0 owner in Alaska in winter time, there, the coolant is warming faster than metal surroundings, it serves the same purpose as a heat riser tube from an exhaust manifold on a carburated car.

LX XLR8R · 02-27-2002, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gtsr515
Your right that the coolant lines cool the EGR gasses, but your wrong that it doesn't help cold start up, your forgetting the 5.0 owner in Alaska in winter time, there, the coolant is warming faster than metal surroundings, it serves the same purpose as a heat riser tube from an exhaust manifold on a carburated car.

i never had a EGR valve or a IAB on my intakes either..made block off plates because cold winter starting never affected me..but when i did start her in the cold i would just have to give her some revs till she idled on her own

Mach 1 · 02-27-2002, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gtsr515
Your right that the coolant lines cool the EGR gasses, but your wrong that it doesn't help cold start up, your forgetting the 5.0 owner in Alaska in winter time, there, the coolant is warming faster than metal surroundings, it serves the same purpose as a heat riser tube from an exhaust manifold on a carburated car.

That is incorrect the way I see it. The heat riser tube from the exhaust manifold on a carbed car had a valve which would close the exhaust gas heat to the intake after warmup. There is no way to close the coolant flow off on the EGR spacer. And also, the exhaust gases heat up immediately, therefore sending warm air to the intake immediately. The coolant does not warm up immediately and would not serve the same purpose as the exhaust riser on a carbed car from that perspective at all. Once the coolant is hot, so is the engine. It makes no sense to pipe cold coolant to facilitate cold start up, and once the coolant is warm, the engine is warm, so I dont see the logic from that angle eithier.

Coolant is warming faster than metal surroundings? By the time that coolant in Alaska is warm enough to do any good, the engine is also warm enough to not need it at the intake.

I can see your point to a degree, but it just doesnt add up.

02-24-2002, 01:07 AM	#1
pac663 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Anaheim,CA Posts: 77	TB Coolant Passage Is it ok to bypass the passage for the coolant through the throtle body? If so, why is it there? Is there any benefit? Thanks. __________________ 92GT KB Ram Air, C&L 76mm MAS, 70mm TB, KB(Blowzilla) 8psi, E-Cam, Headers,Stock Cats, Borla mufflers,3.73's "Dont Do Drugs-You Might Buy An Import"

02-24-2002, 09:16 AM	#2
avbcon12 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: West Bloomfield, MI Posts: 391	its there to cool down the EGR spacer. if you still have the EGR operable then leave it alone!! otherwise you will be heating up the intake with hot gases from the EGR. adam __________________ 90 GT black/ grey leather ported GT-40 heads w/ 1.7RR, Cobra intake w/ ported lower, 24# injectors, 190LPH pump, 75mm Pro-M MAF, 65mm TB, K&N panel, BBK long tubes, Off road H-pipe, 2 ch. Flowmaster, Black magic fan, Kirban FPR, 180 deg. T-stat, 3.73's, Steeda Tri-Ax, 130 amp alt. Accell 8.8 race wires/cap/rotor, motorcraft plugs, Factory Five suspension, etc etc etc.... http://avbcon12.stangnet.com

02-24-2002, 01:24 PM	#3
Hozer 88GTConv Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Jacksonville, FL Posts: 706	Not worth it... I agree with leaving the coolant lines attached to your EGR spacer. The coolant is hot, true, but it is far cooler and still acts as a heat exchanger for EGR air which is considerably hotter than coolant. __________________ 1988 GT Convertible 331 10:1 TW heads, GT-40 intake, MSD, TRW flattops, B Cam w/ 1.7's, MAC exhaust, 24's, 70 TB, 76 MAF, 3.73's, Pro 5.0, Koni's, Anderson PMS, Wideband 02, yatta, yatta... One week with new motor, two speeding tickets...joy

02-24-2002, 07:29 PM	#4
pac663 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Anaheim,CA Posts: 77	"COOL" Thanks. __________________ 92GT KB Ram Air, C&L 76mm MAS, 70mm TB, KB(Blowzilla) 8psi, E-Cam, Headers,Stock Cats, Borla mufflers,3.73's "Dont Do Drugs-You Might Buy An Import"

02-25-2002, 07:40 PM	#6
gtsr515 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Sunny, Hot, Sebring, Florida Posts: 725	Hozer said it right, the lines are to add heat for cold-start up, disconnecting then will increase heat transfer, not cool transfer. I remember an article in 1987 MM/FF, the top 10 things not to do, and that was number 2 on the list. __________________ Remember...2nd place is 1st place for losers!

02-25-2002, 05:08 PM	#5
StreetStang37 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: San Jose, California USA Posts: 275	I disconnected my lines and my EGR spacer and intake manifold run much much cooler now and on average I run about .2-.3 Mph faster on the GTECH with them disconnected. No dyno runs done, but my car runs better with it off, I haven't had any problems with it. It's your choice if you want a HOT or COOLER egr to COOL those gasses.

02-26-2002, 12:16 AM	#7
Mach 1 Registered Member Join Date: May 1999 Location: Georgia Posts: 3,866	Heat for cold start up? There shouldnt be any heat there if its cold and then the coolant is also cold. I would leave it connected if you have the EGR functional(although the cobra intake has EGR and doesnt use the coolant line) and disconnect it if the egr is non-functional. __________________ 2002 GT 1993 GT (SOLD) '93 Mustang GT RHC member #142

02-26-2002, 02:38 PM	#8
Hozer 88GTConv Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Jacksonville, FL Posts: 706	Coolant lines... The coolant flowing through the EGR spacer COOLS the high-temperature air of the EGR system. If you disconnect it and your EGR system is intact, you are in effect superheating your intake charge of air, decreasing its density and robbing yourself of horsepower. __________________ 1988 GT Convertible 331 10:1 TW heads, GT-40 intake, MSD, TRW flattops, B Cam w/ 1.7's, MAC exhaust, 24's, 70 TB, 76 MAF, 3.73's, Pro 5.0, Koni's, Anderson PMS, Wideband 02, yatta, yatta... One week with new motor, two speeding tickets...joy

02-26-2002, 04:59 PM	#9
joe4speed He said Member...heh, heh Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: Jupiter, Florida U.S.A. Posts: 3,718	Get a Cobra intake and don't worry about it... They didn't!! __________________ *Joe!* 1988 GT, 13.58@101mph Check out my listing! Click here! Or my website:www.joe4speed.com

02-27-2002, 05:48 AM	#10
StreetStang37 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: San Jose, California USA Posts: 275	what would make the Cobra intake so special as to not need to "cool" the incomming gasses with the hot coolant then? Did Ford forget them? They must have done it for a reason.

02-27-2002, 11:30 AM	#11
Mach 1 Registered Member Join Date: May 1999 Location: Georgia Posts: 3,866	well, for one reason the cobra intake uses a "built in" EGR spacer. It doesnt have the separate EGR plate that contains the cooling lines and the fluid path for the coolant. Why did Ford do this? Who knows? Probably cheaper to manufacture or something. __________________ 2002 GT 1993 GT (SOLD) '93 Mustang GT RHC member #142

02-27-2002, 01:05 PM	#12
gtsr515 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Sunny, Hot, Sebring, Florida Posts: 725	COOLANT PASSAGE Hozer is right on again, the coolant lines help with heating the air on cold-start up AND cool the super heated air when hot, MACH 1!, think about it, yes the car is bone cold upon start-up, but, the second you start the car, the water pump is distributing the warming coolant. And the reason Ford made the one piece Cobra intake/EGR was to eliminate tooling costs. I've seen holes drilled into opposite sides of the EGR area, tapped, then a 1/4" threaded hose barb TO BOTH SIDES, and coolant lines plumbed into the system. ANYTHING to help cool the air is worth the trouble. KEEP THE LINES CONNECTED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! __________________ Remember...2nd place is 1st place for losers!

02-27-2002, 01:15 PM	#13
LX XLR8R Dirk Diggler Join Date: Feb 1999 Location: SLOATSBURG, NY Posts: 1,931	no egr no coolant lines and a plenum spacer =very cool intake..proof is in the doing..not reading and retyping what someone else has posted in the past..do it yourself and post logically or dont post at all..not trying to be a d1ck but way 2 many people on all BB(not just mworks) post something and ague that they are right but never have actally did it themselfs(not saying that all you guys havent) __________________ 95 undecided cubes, AFR 185s,undecided cam, undecided intake, and a 150 hit 89 "turbonotch" 2.3T You might want to hold on..i saw this on a cartoon once

02-27-2002, 01:43 PM	#14
gtsr515 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Sunny, Hot, Sebring, Florida Posts: 725	You should take your own advice, I was clearing up confusion for MACH 1, and answered very logically, and I have done this myself, for 15 years now. No EGR, etc, is a very cool intake, but that is not what Pac663 asked, he asked if it was okay to "bypass", not "eliminate" the coolant lines. Read the post before you mouth off and accuse me of arguing, I was just replying to a post, excuse me! The reason I repeated what Hozer said was thats exactly what I was gonna say, sorry, I'll never do it again okay? __________________ Remember...2nd place is 1st place for losers!

02-27-2002, 02:14 PM	#15
Mach 1 Registered Member Join Date: May 1999 Location: Georgia Posts: 3,866	I dont think I was ever confused...but anyway...cold coolant is not going to help cold air get warm when the engine is cold, along with the coolant. By the time the coolant is warm, so is the engine. The engine gets warm before the coolant. And why would ford want to heat the incoming air? Is that why they put the air filter in the fender, away from heat, just so they could heat it up anyway with hot coolant and lose performance. I could see heating the cold air at cold start up only to facilitate engine warm up for emissions and gas mileage concerns, but the system doesnt work that way. It constantly routes hot coolant through the passage after the car is warmed up. The coolant is there to cool the EGR gas only. If you have EGR leave it, if you have internally blocked off the EGR passages and there is no hot gases going to that area of your intake, then cap off the coolant lines to the EGR spacer. Pretty straightforward if you ask me. __________________ 2002 GT 1993 GT (SOLD) '93 Mustang GT RHC member #142

02-27-2002, 02:20 PM	#16
LX XLR8R Dirk Diggler Join Date: Feb 1999 Location: SLOATSBURG, NY Posts: 1,931	i wasnt directed my post to you..i was stating 2 facts..one being the first line of my post and the 2nd being that there is alot of bolt on bultinboard racers out there..i know you are not one of them..i have seen your posts and i know you know your stuff __________________ 95 undecided cubes, AFR 185s,undecided cam, undecided intake, and a 150 hit 89 "turbonotch" 2.3T You might want to hold on..i saw this on a cartoon once

02-27-2002, 02:55 PM	#18
gtsr515 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Sunny, Hot, Sebring, Florida Posts: 725	Your right that the coolant lines cool the EGR gasses, but your wrong that it doesn't help cold start up, your forgetting the 5.0 owner in Alaska in winter time, there, the coolant is warming faster than metal surroundings, it serves the same purpose as a heat riser tube from an exhaust manifold on a carburated car. __________________ Remember...2nd place is 1st place for losers!

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