AOD or T-5 for my 306

01-09-2001, 12:05 PM

My username is misleading-not running a big block--staying with 306. Anyway, I'm gonna build a car according to the rules of the FFW Trophy Stock class. Cars run 11-12's on the motor in this class. I am up in the air on which way to go with a tranny. It was a 5 spd until I swapped in the big block for a few months and now it is set up for an Auto but I still have the 5 spd pedal assy to convert back if I decide to. I've seen both work well but I'm also curious about the longevity of each. The T-5 is so violent when launching that I think it might break faster-plus there is a 200 lb weight break if I run an AOD. Flood me with opinions and facts guys and gals, thanks!!
(BTW-it will be a carbureted 88 GT...)

Jeff Chambers · 01-09-2001, 12:17 PM

I broke three T5's last year so I'm making the switch to an Lentech AOD. Some people have great luck with the T5 or Tremec but I found that I couldn't shift it as fast as it needed to be shifted...hence the breakage. Some guys are great at it, but I wasn't. I'm hoping that the AOD will get me back into the lead pack again.

------------------
Jeff Chambers
Trophy Stock #3
11.97 Seconds / 114.5 MPH
Chambers Racing Team

NOS_Notch · 01-09-2001, 10:21 PM

I broke 3 AOD's in a basically stock, mid-14 sec. GT
1 was setup w/ low gear set, 2200 tci conv.,
redline clutches etc......
I know you have to have an AOD for the weight break, but i personnally don't think it's worth it.
I broke 3 w/in 5 years.
All were done from a trans shop, not shadetree mechanic.
If you go auto,go c-4. no weight break but,
but it won't cost you $2000 a year either.

------------------
4.10's,long tubes & 75 shot...Goes 12.50's
Check it out at http://www.burnouts.webprovider.com

Mach 1 · 01-10-2001, 06:04 AM

Forget the T5. You should be asking Tremec or AOD? What do you prefer?

------------------
1993 GT/AOD
'93 Mustang GT

Jeff Chambers · 01-10-2001, 07:37 AM

The T5 >>WILL<< hold up to T/S racing if you're good with it. Out of the 11 events in '00, nine were won by cars with T5's. One was won with a Tremec and one with a Lentech AOD. At least five of those nine events were with T5's that WERE NOT pro-shifted. The two top dogs in the class both ran T5's, but the key was that they could really drive them. I think that's the most important factor when you get into the ET range that we're talking about. Its real obvious watching the cars go downtrack who's the better/best guys on the shifter.

C4's aren't legal in T/S. The only auto allowed is the AOD, but you can modify it internally, run any stall and run a transbrake. The Lentech is pricey, but it has proven itself to be about the toughest (if not the outright toughest) AOD on the market.

------------------
Jeff Chambers
Trophy Stock #3
11.97 Seconds / 114.5 MPH
Chambers Racing Team

Dangerous Dave · 01-10-2001, 09:24 AM

This is my normal username-I ditched Big Block...
Anyway, so, I realize T-5 breakage is due to a combination of things. Well I am not trying to sound like a hot shot but I do know that I am good at shifting the 5 spd. I don't miss gears, and I can make the shifts quick and precise. If this is the biggest cause of busted T-5's...then I will probably go with that-especially pricewise. I guess the biggest question in my mind was the actual cause of broken T-5's-I realize it is a combo of things but if it is happening more not because of launching but shifting...--BTW when you say "Pro-shifted"-what exactly do you mean by that?
After reading the rules of T/S a little closer...I am not sure I would be able to take advantage of the weight break even if I wanted to. Not much I am allowed to lose on the car. Thanks.

------------------
1988 GT-under construction

Jeff Chambers · 01-10-2001, 12:42 PM

You'll rarely see a T5 break at launch. Third gear is the natural weak spot in the T5 and from my experience it usually breaks from missing the 2-3 shift or even just consistently being late on the shift. After a while, being late takes the edge off the teeth and starts cracks in them. Then one day.....BOOOOOOOOM......all the teeth come off right along with all of the third gear teeth on the countershaft. Number one mode of failure in the T5. The gate in the tailshaft housing can also help promote this when you begin to wear off that sharp point that makes the clean shift from second to third. That's why people are always looking for new tailshaft housings.

Pro-shifting is when they modify the gearset so that the synchros are no longer needed. Very light clutch effort is required to disengage the current gear and then it slides right on into the next gear. Does away with the ability to downshift though so its not recommended for street driven cars. Liberty and Hanlon both sell pro-shifted gearsets.

------------------
Jeff Chambers
Trophy Stock #3
11.97 Seconds / 114.5 MPH
Chambers Racing Team

Dangerous Dave · 01-10-2001, 02:14 PM

Well...I think the T-5 is the way to go for my project. I haven't had any problems with them in the past so we'll see how far I can go. A Tremec is out of my price range right now. I would want to buy a new one and they are sort of spendy. I was going to buy a AOD core and have a friend build it. Thank you for your help guys. Now...Jeff Chambers...Do you still have that T-5? email me. Thanks again.

------------------
1988 GT-under construction

Jeff Chambers · 01-10-2001, 02:58 PM

I've still got a T5...email me at jchambers@kellnet.com. I'm currently in discussions with a prospective buyer, but sometimes things don't work out. I also know of another person who has a perfectly good T5 they're looking to sell, so I can also put you in touch with him.

------------------
Jeff Chambers
Trophy Stock #3
11.97 Seconds / 114.5 MPH
Chambers Racing Team

Mach 1 · 01-10-2001, 08:58 PM

You can get a new tremec for around $1100.00 I think. Try D&D motorsports. How much is a new t-5?

Jeff Chambers · 01-11-2001, 07:41 AM

I got a new WC (Cobra) T5 from D&D for something like $699 but they're starting to get to be hard-to-find. Hanlon had them for about $1000 back in September. Remember if you go the Tremec route though that you'll also need a bellhousing, clutch fork, and different shifter. If you go with the TKO, you'll have to have a different clutch as well since it uses the Chebbby spline pattern. You may also need a new crossmember with the Tremec, but I'm not completely sure on that one.

When I looked at going Tremec, it was going to cost me about $1700 to $1800 to make the swap, but that was a few years ago.

------------------
Jeff Chambers
Trophy Stock #3
11.97 Seconds / 114.5 MPH
Chambers Racing Team

Mach 1 · 01-11-2001, 09:01 AM

No, you dont need a new crossmember with the tremec.

01-09-2001, 12:05 PM	#1
Big Block Guest Posts: n/a	AOD or T-5 for my 306 My username is misleading-not running a big block--staying with 306. Anyway, I'm gonna build a car according to the rules of the FFW Trophy Stock class. Cars run 11-12's on the motor in this class. I am up in the air on which way to go with a tranny. It was a 5 spd until I swapped in the big block for a few months and now it is set up for an Auto but I still have the 5 spd pedal assy to convert back if I decide to. I've seen both work well but I'm also curious about the longevity of each. The T-5 is so violent when launching that I think it might break faster-plus there is a 200 lb weight break if I run an AOD. Flood me with opinions and facts guys and gals, thanks!! (BTW-it will be a carbureted 88 GT...)

01-09-2001, 12:17 PM	#2
Jeff Chambers Moderator Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Milan, OH Posts: 2,699	I broke three T5's last year so I'm making the switch to an Lentech AOD. Some people have great luck with the T5 or Tremec but I found that I couldn't shift it as fast as it needed to be shifted...hence the breakage. Some guys are great at it, but I wasn't. I'm hoping that the AOD will get me back into the lead pack again. ------------------ Jeff Chambers Trophy Stock #3 11.97 Seconds / 114.5 MPH Chambers Racing Team

01-09-2001, 10:21 PM	#3
NOS_Notch Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Fresno,CA. USA Posts: 384	I broke 3 AOD's in a basically stock, mid-14 sec. GT 1 was setup w/ low gear set, 2200 tci conv., redline clutches etc...... I know you have to have an AOD for the weight break, but i personnally don't think it's worth it. I broke 3 w/in 5 years. All were done from a trans shop, not shadetree mechanic. If you go auto,go c-4. no weight break but, but it won't cost you $2000 a year either. ------------------ 4.10's,long tubes & 75 shot...Goes 12.50's Check it out at http://www.burnouts.webprovider.com

01-10-2001, 06:04 AM	#4
Mach 1 Registered Member Join Date: May 1999 Location: Georgia Posts: 3,866	Forget the T5. You should be asking Tremec or AOD? What do you prefer? ------------------ 1993 GT/AOD '93 Mustang GT

01-10-2001, 07:37 AM	#5
Jeff Chambers Moderator Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Milan, OH Posts: 2,699	The T5 >>WILL<< hold up to T/S racing if you're good with it. Out of the 11 events in '00, nine were won by cars with T5's. One was won with a Tremec and one with a Lentech AOD. At least five of those nine events were with T5's that WERE NOT pro-shifted. The two top dogs in the class both ran T5's, but the key was that they could really drive them. I think that's the most important factor when you get into the ET range that we're talking about. Its real obvious watching the cars go downtrack who's the better/best guys on the shifter. C4's aren't legal in T/S. The only auto allowed is the AOD, but you can modify it internally, run any stall and run a transbrake. The Lentech is pricey, but it has proven itself to be about the toughest (if not the outright toughest) AOD on the market. ------------------ Jeff Chambers Trophy Stock #3 11.97 Seconds / 114.5 MPH Chambers Racing Team

01-10-2001, 09:24 AM	#6
Dangerous Dave Registered Member Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: Minneapolis, MN Posts: 121	This is my normal username-I ditched Big Block... Anyway, so, I realize T-5 breakage is due to a combination of things. Well I am not trying to sound like a hot shot but I do know that I am good at shifting the 5 spd. I don't miss gears, and I can make the shifts quick and precise. If this is the biggest cause of busted T-5's...then I will probably go with that-especially pricewise. I guess the biggest question in my mind was the actual cause of broken T-5's-I realize it is a combo of things but if it is happening more not because of launching but shifting...--BTW when you say "Pro-shifted"-what exactly do you mean by that? After reading the rules of T/S a little closer...I am not sure I would be able to take advantage of the weight break even if I wanted to. Not much I am allowed to lose on the car. Thanks. ------------------ 1988 GT-under construction

01-10-2001, 12:42 PM	#7
Jeff Chambers Moderator Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Milan, OH Posts: 2,699	You'll rarely see a T5 break at launch. Third gear is the natural weak spot in the T5 and from my experience it usually breaks from missing the 2-3 shift or even just consistently being late on the shift. After a while, being late takes the edge off the teeth and starts cracks in them. Then one day.....BOOOOOOOOM......all the teeth come off right along with all of the third gear teeth on the countershaft. Number one mode of failure in the T5. The gate in the tailshaft housing can also help promote this when you begin to wear off that sharp point that makes the clean shift from second to third. That's why people are always looking for new tailshaft housings. Pro-shifting is when they modify the gearset so that the synchros are no longer needed. Very light clutch effort is required to disengage the current gear and then it slides right on into the next gear. Does away with the ability to downshift though so its not recommended for street driven cars. Liberty and Hanlon both sell pro-shifted gearsets. ------------------ Jeff Chambers Trophy Stock #3 11.97 Seconds / 114.5 MPH Chambers Racing Team

01-10-2001, 02:14 PM	#8
Dangerous Dave Registered Member Join Date: Sep 1999 Location: Minneapolis, MN Posts: 121	Well...I think the T-5 is the way to go for my project. I haven't had any problems with them in the past so we'll see how far I can go. A Tremec is out of my price range right now. I would want to buy a new one and they are sort of spendy. I was going to buy a AOD core and have a friend build it. Thank you for your help guys. Now...Jeff Chambers...Do you still have that T-5? email me. Thanks again. ------------------ 1988 GT-under construction

01-10-2001, 02:58 PM	#9
Jeff Chambers Moderator Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Milan, OH Posts: 2,699	I've still got a T5...email me at jchambers@kellnet.com. I'm currently in discussions with a prospective buyer, but sometimes things don't work out. I also know of another person who has a perfectly good T5 they're looking to sell, so I can also put you in touch with him. ------------------ Jeff Chambers Trophy Stock #3 11.97 Seconds / 114.5 MPH Chambers Racing Team

01-10-2001, 08:58 PM	#10
Mach 1 Registered Member Join Date: May 1999 Location: Georgia Posts: 3,866	You can get a new tremec for around $1100.00 I think. Try D&D motorsports. How much is a new t-5?

01-11-2001, 07:41 AM	#11
Jeff Chambers Moderator Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Milan, OH Posts: 2,699	I got a new WC (Cobra) T5 from D&D for something like $699 but they're starting to get to be hard-to-find. Hanlon had them for about $1000 back in September. Remember if you go the Tremec route though that you'll also need a bellhousing, clutch fork, and different shifter. If you go with the TKO, you'll have to have a different clutch as well since it uses the Chebbby spline pattern. You may also need a new crossmember with the Tremec, but I'm not completely sure on that one. When I looked at going Tremec, it was going to cost me about $1700 to $1800 to make the swap, but that was a few years ago. ------------------ Jeff Chambers Trophy Stock #3 11.97 Seconds / 114.5 MPH Chambers Racing Team

01-11-2001, 09:01 AM	#12
Mach 1 Registered Member Join Date: May 1999 Location: Georgia Posts: 3,866	No, you dont need a new crossmember with the tremec.