new engine= yay, coolant in the oil= *****!

fiveohpatrol · 07-20-2002, 11:51 PM

I just finished installing my new motor last night. Well not exactly new, its an 87 shortblock with 70k on it, I just re-ringed and bearing'd it.

Well anyway, it started on the first turn of the key, so that put a smile on my face. I let it idle for a few minutes, then i took it for a spin. It started to overheat a little, but I added more coolant and it was then fine.

Well I go to drive it today, and it would start to get pretty warm every few minutes. It would shoot to about 210-220 on my autometer gage, then back down). So I figured it was just another air pocket in the system. So I came back, topped off the coolant with mostly water, but then decided to check my oil just to make sure it was still good. Well it wasn't, it was milky brown, and we all know what that means.

So my first guess was that I didn't put enough black RTV around the coolant passages on the intake to head gaskets. So I re-did those gaskets hoping that it would fix it. But sure enough, I put a pressure tester on it, and it wouldnt hold pressure. I also had the oil drain plugs out, and it started leaking out of them as I pressurized the system.

The only other thing it could be is a head gasket right? The only thing is that they were brand new. I have ARP head bolts, and they are used, but this is the first time I've re-used them, so they should still be good. I torqued them down in the correct sequence with a brand new torque wrench.

Could the brand new fel-pro gaskets be bad?

I've had one of the worst days of my life, and I really want my car back. Time to start drinkin

HotRoddin · 07-21-2002, 12:47 AM

I think i'd look at all the plugs and see if you find any evidence of rust or rusty color ? It sounds like a big leak ! take a compression check while you have the plugs out. that way you can narrow it down to a cylinder or two.
It could be a head gasket .. it could be God forbid a cracked block. If you're pumping that much that fast then check and make sure the intake and the heads are seated right and not cockeyed.

I'll admit thats not a good day, but if its one of the worst days of your life then you're either still young or you've led a very charmed life !!!

fiveohpatrol · 07-21-2002, 12:55 AM

I really doubt the block is cracked because it came out of a car that was running just fine beforehand.

This isn't the only thing thats gone wrong today, it just added to the madness, thats why it's been so bad.

Coupe5oh · 07-21-2002, 04:41 AM

Yep, gasket it is, my friend blew one on a brand new 347, it ran hot and slowed down on the track, then we checked the oil, i blame that on 93 octane and WOT with 10:1 cprssn, he needed 99+ octane, i dont care what anyone says.

srv1 · 07-21-2002, 10:12 AM

you said you redid the intake? what intake gasket did you use? i dont think it is a head gasket even if you did reuse the headbolts unless something wasnt clean when the heads got mated to the block. what about your timing cover gasket? when working on windsors, i found out that you really have to makee sure the timing cover area is clean and also i put a thin coating of RTV in the timing cover and the block, that way the gasket stays in place and the timing cover dont leak. my bet is with the timing cover or the intake.

fiveohpatrol · 07-21-2002, 12:00 PM

The heads and the block were perfectly clean, and I did use RTV on the timing cover.

It wasnt putting any white smoke out the tailpipes, so if the head gasket is blown, then its just between an oil passage and water passage.

thanks for the suggestions

fiveohpatrol · 07-21-2002, 01:11 PM

Well maybe i was wrong about coolant getting into the cylinders, because I just pulled the plugs and coolant poured out of the #6 cylinder. I also sprayed compressed air in the spark plug holes, and a tiny bit came out of #3 as well, but could that just be what had gotten past the rings and was coating the cylinder walls?

Did I just get a bad batch of fel-pro gaskets or what?

Oldschoolpony · 07-21-2002, 02:20 PM

Pull the heads and inspect the gaskets, then toss them. Before you reinstall the heads, bring them to a machine shop. Mill. them a bit to make sure that they are perfect. Also, not sure about this, but if the deck height is dufferent on the block you are using to the block you had, you might need to machine the intake. I had that problem on a 390 with 352 hp heads.

ultraflo · 07-21-2002, 02:54 PM

What head gaskets did you install? I've had good luck with Fel-pro 9333PT-1 head gaskets, they seal-up really good... I've been through similar circumstances you are now experiencing. I didn't use RTV around the water ports on the intake gaskets... I do now

I've popped my fair share of head gaskets as well

Taking the heads to a machine shop to get them cleaned up isn't a bad idea at all... At the beginning of the year before I put my motor back together I had the heads milled to clean up the mating surface, they were off only .004" but every little bit counts... plus the freshly machined surface "grabs" onto the gasket better.

If coolant "poured" out of the #6 cylinder, I would say your head gasket is to blame... but you won't know for sure until you tear down the motor to the short block and check it all out.

fiveohpatrol · 07-21-2002, 11:21 PM

well i just got finished from the drive after putting the new gaskets on (I'm getting pretty fast at it now

)

I drove it for about 30 minutes and the temp didnt get over 185 one bit (180 thermostat).

Pulled it back in the garage and saw no signs of coolant in the oil at all. But there were a just a few bubbles coming to the top of the overflow tank, is that normal? Maybe just air bleeding out of the system?

Thanks for the help everyone, hopefully its fixed so I can make it to corral day and back

PKRWUD · 07-22-2002, 05:10 AM

You might want to replace the radiator cap.

What did the old gaskets look like? What did you find? Did you tap the threads in the block? Did you put thread sealer on the lower bolt threads? Using RTV on the head bolt threads, or failing to tap the threads in the block where the head bolts go, can give a false torque reading. Also, if it does happen again, be sure to have the heads surfaced.

Take care,
~Chris

fiveohpatrol · 07-22-2002, 11:26 AM

I did not run a tap into the head bolt holes in the block, although I knew I probably should have. I used thread sealer on the lower head bolts, not RTV.

ultraflo · 07-22-2002, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by PKRWUD
What did the old gaskets look like? What did you find?

LX5liter · 07-22-2002, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by PKRWUD
You might want to replace the radiator cap.

What did the old gaskets look like? What did you find? Did you

Take care,
~Chris

Yeah, what those guys said. Inquiring and curious minds seeking knowledge need to know!

fiveohpatrol · 07-22-2002, 04:38 PM

actually I didnt find anything wrong with the gaskets, although I didnt look REALLY hard, and I know it wouldnt take much.

I'll look at them more closely after work, and if I see anything that might have caused it, then I'll try to get a picture of it, although my digital cam doesnt have great resolution

07-20-2002, 11:51 PM	#1
fiveohpatrol I'd rather be basketweaving Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 2,551	new engine= yay, coolant in the oil= *! I just finished installing my new motor last night. Well not exactly new, its an 87 shortblock with 70k on it, I just re-ringed and bearing'd it. Well anyway, it started on the first turn of the key, so that put a smile on my face. I let it idle for a few minutes, then i took it for a spin. It started to overheat a little, but I added more coolant and it was then fine. Well I go to drive it today, and it would start to get pretty warm every few minutes. It would shoot to about 210-220 on my autometer gage, then back down). So I figured it was just another air pocket in the system. So I came back, topped off the coolant with mostly water, but then decided to check my oil just to make sure it was still good. Well it wasn't, it was milky brown, and we all know what that means. So my first guess was that I didn't put enough black RTV around the coolant passages on the intake to head gaskets. So I re-did those gaskets hoping that it would fix it. But sure enough, I put a pressure tester on it, and it wouldnt hold pressure. I also had the oil drain plugs out, and it started leaking out of them as I pressurized the system. The only other thing it could be is a head gasket right? The only thing is that they were brand new. I have ARP head bolts, and they are used, but this is the first time I've re-used them, so they should still be good. I torqued them down in the correct sequence with a brand new torque wrench. Could the brand new fel-pro gaskets be bad? I've had one of the worst days of my life, and I really want my car back. Time to start drinkin __________________ NMRA O/C 9516 NA pumpgas stickshift 347 10.65@125.6, 6.73@100, 1.41 60ft

07-21-2002, 04:41 AM	#4
Coupe5oh Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: SanAntonio, Tx Posts: 734	Yep, gasket it is, my friend blew one on a brand new 347, it ran hot and slowed down on the track, then we checked the oil, i blame that on 93 octane and WOT with 10:1 cprssn, he needed 99+ octane, i dont care what anyone says. __________________ Police package 5spd 90 Lx, Stock original motor, 3.27grs, BM fan, fms 10.5 clutch, D&D quadrant, and adjuster, ADS chip, 180 stat, mac cai, mac h-pipe, mac subframe connectors, ASP crank pulley, ripper shifter, 26x10.5 M/T sport pros welds. 246 hp according to analyzer Race weight: 3,120 E.t-13.57 with 26x10.50's e.t. streets. 1.88 60' mph- 99.92 mph

07-21-2002, 10:12 AM	#5
srv1 Get down..... Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Room 103 Posts: 2,095	you said you redid the intake? what intake gasket did you use? i dont think it is a head gasket even if you did reuse the headbolts unless something wasnt clean when the heads got mated to the block. what about your timing cover gasket? when working on windsors, i found out that you really have to makee sure the timing cover area is clean and also i put a thin coating of RTV in the timing cover and the block, that way the gasket stays in place and the timing cover dont leak. my bet is with the timing cover or the intake. __________________ Cobra brakes are on! Finally..... ------------------------------------------------

07-21-2002, 01:11 PM	#7
fiveohpatrol I'd rather be basketweaving Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 2,551	Well maybe i was wrong about coolant getting into the cylinders, because I just pulled the plugs and coolant poured out of the #6 cylinder. I also sprayed compressed air in the spark plug holes, and a tiny bit came out of #3 as well, but could that just be what had gotten past the rings and was coating the cylinder walls? Did I just get a bad batch of fel-pro gaskets or what? __________________ NMRA O/C 9516 NA pumpgas stickshift 347 10.65@125.6, 6.73@100, 1.41 60ft

07-21-2002, 02:20 PM	#8
Oldschoolpony Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Gainsville,Fl Posts: 229	Pull the heads and inspect the gaskets, then toss them. Before you reinstall the heads, bring them to a machine shop. Mill. them a bit to make sure that they are perfect. Also, not sure about this, but if the deck height is dufferent on the block you are using to the block you had, you might need to machine the intake. I had that problem on a 390 with 352 hp heads. __________________ http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/...splay.cgi?1546

07-21-2002, 12:47 AM	#2
HotRoddin cranky old man Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Longview Texas Posts: 683	I think i'd look at all the plugs and see if you find any evidence of rust or rusty color ? It sounds like a big leak ! take a compression check while you have the plugs out. that way you can narrow it down to a cylinder or two. It could be a head gasket .. it could be God forbid a cracked block. If you're pumping that much that fast then check and make sure the intake and the heads are seated right and not cockeyed. I'll admit thats not a good day, but if its one of the worst days of your life then you're either still young or you've led a very charmed life !!!

07-21-2002, 12:55 AM	#3
fiveohpatrol I'd rather be basketweaving Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 2,551	I really doubt the block is cracked because it came out of a car that was running just fine beforehand. This isn't the only thing thats gone wrong today, it just added to the madness, thats why it's been so bad. __________________ NMRA O/C 9516 NA pumpgas stickshift 347 10.65@125.6, 6.73@100, 1.41 60ft

07-21-2002, 12:00 PM	#6
fiveohpatrol I'd rather be basketweaving Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 2,551	The heads and the block were perfectly clean, and I did use RTV on the timing cover. It wasnt putting any white smoke out the tailpipes, so if the head gasket is blown, then its just between an oil passage and water passage. thanks for the suggestions __________________ NMRA O/C 9516 NA pumpgas stickshift 347 10.65@125.6, 6.73@100, 1.41 60ft

07-21-2002, 02:54 PM	#9
ultraflo NX dealer-man Join Date: Sep 1998 Location: Peoria, Illinois Posts: 977	What head gaskets did you install? I've had good luck with Fel-pro 9333PT-1 head gaskets, they seal-up really good... I've been through similar circumstances you are now experiencing. I didn't use RTV around the water ports on the intake gaskets... I do now I've popped my fair share of head gaskets as well Taking the heads to a machine shop to get them cleaned up isn't a bad idea at all... At the beginning of the year before I put my motor back together I had the heads milled to clean up the mating surface, they were off only .004" but every little bit counts... plus the freshly machined surface "grabs" onto the gasket better. If coolant "poured" out of the #6 cylinder, I would say your head gasket is to blame... but you won't know for sure until you tear down the motor to the short block and check it all out. __________________ RLS Racing! 93 LX 9.20 @ 147mph 03 Mach 1 12.39 @ 116mph

07-21-2002, 11:21 PM	#10
fiveohpatrol I'd rather be basketweaving Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 2,551	well i just got finished from the drive after putting the new gaskets on (I'm getting pretty fast at it now ) I drove it for about 30 minutes and the temp didnt get over 185 one bit (180 thermostat). Pulled it back in the garage and saw no signs of coolant in the oil at all. But there were a just a few bubbles coming to the top of the overflow tank, is that normal? Maybe just air bleeding out of the system? Thanks for the help everyone, hopefully its fixed so I can make it to corral day and back __________________ NMRA O/C 9516 NA pumpgas stickshift 347 10.65@125.6, 6.73@100, 1.41 60ft

07-22-2002, 05:10 AM	#11
PKRWUD Junior Member Join Date: Mar 1999 Location: Ventura, California Posts: 8,981	You might want to replace the radiator cap. What did the old gaskets look like? What did you find? Did you tap the threads in the block? Did you put thread sealer on the lower bolt threads? Using RTV on the head bolt threads, or failing to tap the threads in the block where the head bolts go, can give a false torque reading. Also, if it does happen again, be sure to have the heads surfaced. Take care, ~Chris __________________ Webmaster: Rice Haters Club Jim Porter Racing Peckerwoods Pit Stop Support Your Local RED & WHITE!

07-22-2002, 11:26 AM	#12
fiveohpatrol I'd rather be basketweaving Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 2,551	I did not run a tap into the head bolt holes in the block, although I knew I probably should have. I used thread sealer on the lower head bolts, not RTV. __________________ NMRA O/C 9516 NA pumpgas stickshift 347 10.65@125.6, 6.73@100, 1.41 60ft

07-22-2002, 04:38 PM	#15
fiveohpatrol I'd rather be basketweaving Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 2,551	actually I didnt find anything wrong with the gaskets, although I didnt look REALLY hard, and I know it wouldnt take much. I'll look at them more closely after work, and if I see anything that might have caused it, then I'll try to get a picture of it, although my digital cam doesnt have great resolution __________________ NMRA O/C 9516 NA pumpgas stickshift 347 10.65@125.6, 6.73@100, 1.41 60ft

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