this is it someone better help or i am selling this car
 

Ok guys ill tell you what is going on again i have a gt40 crate motor, bbk long tube headers, stock ho intake stock throttle body took of the egr valve, got rid of the vac linefor the emmisions and this is my problem A 1800RPM IDLE! and no it is not a vacumm leak, i checked the tps seams to have no voltage going through it tryed turning i tried everything. I am completly confused, and the car has confused plenty of others already the only way i can get the car to idle at where it is suppose to be is pull out the single plug conector and pull the plug on throttle air bypass valve, i have no idea what is causing this i have tryed literly everything, i checked all of the fuses and relays no luck, except the #15 fuse was burned out and i replaced that and had not had a problem with it since


could some one please please please help me


thanks alot

raini

Call it a vacuum leak or call it an open valve that shouldn't be open, but i bet you a buck your sucking raw air someplace ?

You have no voltage at the TPS? And you "removed" the egr and "emissions vac line" (why???).

Check the orange wire at the TPS for voltage with the key on. It should be 5 volts.

Is it?

If you really don't have any voltage there, it's because you removed the egr. The orange wire is the 5 volt reference wire the ECM sends out to the sensors to play with. They send part of that voltage back to the ECM. How much depends on what's going on. That's how the ECM reads the sensors. Anyway, the orange wire to the TPS goes to the egr solenoid first, so if you removed the wiring, you cut off your nose to spite your face.

You will have to reinstall the wiring so that the 5 volt signal from the ECM (pin 26) reaches the TPS.

Why in the world did you remove the egr anyway? I mean, it's your car, but why create problems for no gain?

It is time to build a 351 Windsor stroker dude..... I hate the small stroke fords. NO POWER. I like torque and it takes long strokes and long rods to get torque.

Now for your problem, why do you want to take off or disconnect the smog. All it does is pump filtered air into your exhaust ports????

Really, the entire computer is built around looking at the air fuel mixture and adjusting fuel metering to get the O2 saturation to the algorythem set at the factory.

ARE YOU SEEING THE LIGHT?????

When you cut off the smog, you are showing the 02 sensor LESS oxygen than it expects. So it figures you need more air. So it cuts down the fuel mixture but that reduces the O2 even more, so it figures I AM UNDER LOAD OR I AM COLD. So it goes to start up mode which is FULL RICH and HIGH RPM.

DO YOU GET IT YET???? The computer is going to do what it can to get to normal. That is probably why it is pushing 1800 RPM on the idle. It has to run that much RPM to get the O2 levels to the proper saturation point. It is probably running full rich as well which is just killing your air fuel mixture, carbonizing your plugs and combustion chamber, and ruining your driveability.

DOES THIS SOUND FAMILIAR. DO NOT MESS WITH YOUR SMOG SYSTEM ON A FORD.

I saw guys try this on Ferrari's once. Get rid of the smog and the car should run like it does in Europe. Only it didn't. Ferrari charged this guy 7,000 dollars to put it back to stock so it would run 170 mph. The smog was never the issue, it was the exhaust system changes that slow down the US Ferrari's. Unless you are married to an engine tech with a chassis dyno, a programable power chip, and the time and desire to get it to run somewhat like a normal car, you are just shooting yourself in the foot.

See if you can hook the smog back up. It should completely solve your problem.

Then build a 351 stroker block, and run the trick flow fuel injection with the 90 mm MASS. This will get you to the 500 hp level with a good cam, compression, and heads. Put on a vortech supercharger and you are in the 600 hp range. That is huge. 11's are a certainty!

Sorry to pound so much on the lowly small stroke small blocks, but my engine with 3.7 gears would be running 12.5 quarter mile times with a 2500 stall converter. It is not the cubic inches doing this work. It is the power resulting from the stroke and the rod length. My stroke is 3.5 vs 3.3 and my rod is 5.95 vs 5.4 SEE what I am pointing at?


Hope this helps.

If you fix your TPS voltage you will fix your idle.

chill out man, you wil figure it out.

Easy there Jim. ;)

Getting the TPS fixed should be the cure.

E

PS - my lowly small stroke (3.25) small block makes crappy power... :rolleyes:

you said it will idle fine if you take out the spout connector and unplug the IAC?

re-check your timing with the spout out, get it at about 14deg initial. Then plug the spout back in. Now remove the IAC and clean it with carb cleaner (or replace it).

You must be right about the 302's making crap power. I mean, Jeff Chamber's car only see's 11.10's all motor with a mild H/I/C combo.

Yah and mine is running like crap too :rolleyes:

Sounds like Iac stuck...

jim_howard_pdx: There are lots of people here without smog pumps who's cars run fine.

btw, I don't like the 351W;)

ok guys with the egr in the car it also does it and still has no voltage, somthing is going on here, i got rid of the egr because it was crimping my wot vacum line to the intake, the timing is dead on. the only way it will idle is when i take out the spout connector and pull the plug on the iac, i have two iac one is new and one is the old one i tryed the new one nothing infact it made the idle worse! To top it off know the damn car blew a header gasket thank god summit is open 24/7! is there an inline fuse for the tps that maybe fried. Pkrwud when i put the egr on it idles at 2100rpms and trust me guys the car does not have a vacum leak!

well i know for a fact you can run a car without a IAB and a EGR valve in the car..i ran in both my hatch and my notch blockoff plates that i made a work many years ago(should of patent them cuz now i see them being sold!) now its wire 361(red 14-16 ga) that goes to pin 57 on the computer but splits b4 it goes to all the sensors in a parrael fasion as oposed to pulling one sensor out and having them all go out in a series setup

pkrwd is right about all engine sensors are sent out 5v and are sent back less than that witch tells the compter what is going on as all on/off stuff(injectors,coil etc) are sent constant 12v power and computer pulses the neg

now reason behind me ridding the IAB is so i could set my idle and computer would not mess with it(had troubles on botch cars) and reason ridding EGR was just caouz it wasnt used) and yes both cars ran great..one went 12's on street tires with stock tb,intake,mass air,injectors and the same car went 11.7's on a lil dry hit

so how can i bypass the egr valve? i am pos it is the the tps because it is not sending any electrical current through the orange wire. the car runs fine until it warms up, and like i said it idles perfect with the air bypass valve disconnected when i had the egr it idled at 2g now it idles at 1800 w/o the egr idles at 600-700rpm with the air bypass valve and the spout connector out


thanks again guys

when you say spout connector do you mean the plug you are pulling to set timing or something else..becasue you dont want to run around with that plug out..unless you like red glowing headers

and i saw you had off road hpipe...does that mean you have no airpump and no egr tube going from head to head?

yeah i have no smog pump, and yeah spout connector meaning the single plug wire connector that u pull when u set the timing

I don't think the engine should be able to idle without the IAB. So maybe your idle screw is set wrong?

Here's the correct adjustment procedure:

1. Place automatic transmission in PARK.
2. Engine OFF, back out throttle plate stop screw clear off the throttle lever pad.
3. With a .010 in. feeler gauge between the throttle plate stop screw and throttle lever pad turn the screw in until contact is made then turn it an additional 1-1/2 turns for High Output (HO), 1-7/8 turns for base engine.
4. Shut engine OFF and disconnect battery for 5 minutes minimum.
5. Start engine and stabilize for 2 minutes then goose the engine and let it return to idle, lightly depress and release the accelerator let engine idle. If idle problem still exists check for other possible causes.
6. On Automatic Overdrive Transmission (AOD) applications or Automatic Transaxle (AXOD) application check Throttle Valve (TV) adjustment.

Good luck,

Rich D.

This thread is turning really stupid.

You have one and only one issue to deal with right now, and that is the TPS.

I already told you what you have to do, but I'm feeling generous, so I'll tell you again.

There is an orange wire that leaves the ECM at the 60 pin connector at pin #26. From there, it goes to a junction where it splits. One wire goes to your BAP sensor, and the other goes to your EGR valve position sensor. From there, it continues on to the TPS. You need to trace this wire, and find out where it is that you cut it, and put it back together.

If it were me, I would backprobe pin 26, turn the key on, and see if there was 5 volts. If there wasn't, the ECM is junk, and needs to be thrown out. If there is 5 volts there, I would check the wire at the BAP sensor, etc., until I found the break in the wire. You could also splice into the wire at the 60 pin and run it right to the TPS.

FORGET EVERYTHING ELSE AND FIX YOUR TPS.

Take care,
~Chris

PKRWUD is absolutely right about the orange wire and i had a problem similar where the orang wire came out of my tps. the idle instantly went up about 1200 rpm.

i think it maybe the ecm i checked and there is no volatage at tps and when i checked the egr i had .030v. What is going on? oh no i am in trouble ill have to look at the 26 pin though, i didnt have time
later
raini thanks again

A stock 302 running 11.12 ets.....

Common, a stock 302 runs 15.4 ets.
A Cobra 302 runs 14.8 after super tuning.
A Cobra 4.6 runs 14.4 after super tuning.

Add slicks, pick up a few tenths.

BS is BS and power is power. The 351 W is the same engine as a 302. It is simple .995 inches taller. So the intake is a little wider? So what.

If your 302 runs 12 seconds flat, run the same configuration in a 351 windsor and you will be running 11.30's.

Now just what was STOCK about that 11.12 engine??????

The super stock world record was held for 17 years by a 428 Cobra Jet Mustang which ran 11.3 seconds. You think a stock 302 can run with a stock 428 CJ?

Man I have heard it all, but this is too thick.

I am glad you figured out the electronics issue and the vacume leak. Let us know how you RUN!

no one ever said a stock 302 will run 11.12 ets. But I did say that a 302 BLOCK with a mild heads/intake/cam combo will go that fast.

GUESS WHAT GUYS! I found out that the o/w wire was broken right before it goes into the egr valve did not get to fix it yet because i have to go to work but i'll fill u guys in tonight when i have time to fix it.

thanks alot for ur time and patiance with me, god do i feel stupid to cause this much chaos with this little of a wire

later guys thanks again

raini

I have been wrenching engines since I was 15 years old. I have wrenched on 4 cars that ran late 8's and early 9's.

Do you know what it takes to run 11 second quarter miles? Do you understand the concept of vehicle weight, parasitic power loss from the transmission, drive shaft, and rear end. Do you understand pinion angles, weight transfer, and hook up.

An 11 second car requires that EVERY engine part be properly matched, every reciprocating engine part must be properly machined, balanced, and blue printed. An oil scrapper or windage tray is nearly MANDATORY. Low friction bearings, rings, and valve train are nearly MANDATORY.

Look, I have guys coming to me with 13 and 14 second cars saying how much will it cost to modify the car to run 11's.

Do you know what it takes? Probably 12 months of chassis and drive train modifications, 4-6 thousand dollars of machining and parts, plus access to some knowledgeable engine tuners who know every little trick to help it happen.

Yes you can bolt in 500 to 800 hp in a STOCK car and probably run an 11 second time. But the clutch will fail, or the auto or manual transmission will fail, or the driveshaft will become a big heavy pretzel, or the rear end will get real noisy or stop operating at all.

I have built 426 Hemi strokers, 429 strokers, 428 strokers, 351 windsor and clevelands, 302's and 289's, and even chevy engines.

Right now I can tell you that almost any track will make you put in a 4 point roll bar, electric cut off switch, wear a helmet, use 5 point restraints, and run a driveshaft loop, chain the engine or run solid motor mounts, and have automatic cut off for the electric fuel pump. SO WHAT IS STOCK ABOUT RUNNING AN 11 Second ET.

And where do you get off saying minor head work, minor mods..... It takes 475 hp or above to even hit an 11 second quarter mile in a 2900 lb car with slicks. A 302 makes around 275 to 315 hp stock. So adding 160 hp takes some SERIOUS modifications, and some serious safety equipment.

Want to run 11 seconds stock. Buy a Turbo Porsche. I think they go for about 140,000.00 dollars. Maybe a new Shelby but they go for 150,000 with the ultra cool aluminum 427. Maybe a Viper but they go for 65,000 and up. A super charged Steeda or Saleen with 5.4 liter engines will set you back 48-55k. They will get you 11's or close to it. GET THE PICTURE!!!! Are any of these cars really STOCK at all? I don't think so.....

So my buddy is running a 1990 Civic Hatchback. He got a Japanese R model 1.8 liter engine from an Integra, runs the ultra steep 5 speed transmission with a good clutch, posi unit, headers, special intake, a nice cold air intake, and a chip set. Everything all together cost him less than 6,000 dollars. He corners at over 1.G on the skid pad. He quarters in 12.4 seconds without nitrous or blowers, and he gets over 28 miles per gallon driving too and from the track.

Show me any 302 that will match that performance? Show me any 351 or 4.6 or 5.4 liter car?

We need to go to FORD and demand a platform and a solid engine program to get into this type of performance.

With a vortec blower and nitrous assist my buddies Integra motor would be easily in the 11's and 10's would require only a couple of thousand in chassis modifications to get the front wheel drive to hold the power and the full cage for running 10's at a strip. When I drive his car and shift at 10,000 RPM the thrill is addictive. The only Ford engine I ever worked on that could do this was a FORD SOHC 427 running over 650 HP. We were running cams designed for 9,000 + RPM. That car ran 9.2's in a Factory Ford racing Fairlane. A 351 stroked to 427 in a modern chassis can run solid 8 second quarters today. A 3.6 liter Honda engine will be doing this next year.

This has got to stop. FORD must put some money and time into high rev, low displacement race engines. I am getting sick of the rice rockets looking over and even thinking they can take my Mustang. But until I have a 3.8 Liter engine capable of 600 HP and 10,000 RPM I will just be wondering if I can stay up with them.

quote
PKRWUD This thread is turning really stupid.

You have one and only one issue to deal with right now, and that is the TPS

jim_howard_pdx I have been wrenching engines since I was 15 years old. I have wrenched on 4 cars that ran late 8's and early 9's.

Do you know what it takes to run 11 second quarter miles? Do you understand the concept of vehicle weight, parasitic power loss from the transmission, drive shaft, and rear end. Do you understand pinion angles, weight transfer, and hook up.

So my buddy is running a 1990 Civic Hatchback. He got a Japanese R model 1.8 liter engine from an Integra, runs the ultra steep 5 speed transmission with a good clutch, posi unit, headers, special intake, a nice cold air intake, and a chip set. Everything all together cost him less than 6,000 dollars. He corners at over 1.G on the skid pad. He quarters in 12.4 seconds without nitrous or blowers, and he gets over 28 miles per gallon driving too and from the track.

Show me any 302 that will match that performance? Show me any 351 or 4.6 or 5.4 liter car?

Want to run 11 seconds stock. Buy a Turbo Porsche

well fisrt off finish with the wiring.

second off come look at me up in calgary with your buddies honda ???

third my Brothers turbo porshe doesnt run 11's

oh yeah and the cj only held its CLASS record

Also my bike runs 11 stock get over 28 mpg and cost less than the civic .

ps look up arcives on ford hi rpm engines any good racer knows thats not the way to go. or we would all be dropping in f1 engines

and no only high rpm engines need all that stuff you can build a junk yard ford engine that will run 11 .

stock 351 and twin turbo's no hight tech stuff .

e-mail me for the build up. 400 put me into the 11's

Ok some of the stuff you mention is ok but some of this is complete BS. About that civic I dont give a **** if its faster than my car and revs to 10,000 rpm (wow i dont care) he is still driving a CIVIC. Yes that little economy car that really was never intended to be fast. plus look around you what is the ratio of actual motorswap fast civics to all the slow *** ones that are out there.

I think you need to just calm down and stop going off on how you seem to know more than anyone else here. especially when you are pretty new to the board.

All I want to know is if that was making it suck raw air ? Gotta see if i need to send you that buck I bet ? If I was right, get back to me. If I was wrong ... take your time, no rush :p

Obviously jim_howard_pdx, some of us do have an understanding of parasitic losses, weight, balance & blueprinting, etc. It doesn't take a 358W shoehorned into the engine bay to achieve fantastic performance. The little 'ol 302 is a hefty platform for power and torque. You're right though that there's nothing stock about getting 11's out of a 302-based combination, but there's nothing stock about shoehorning a 358W into a 66 coupe either.

My puny little 306 put out 465hp & 424ft-lbs with factory cast iron heads (GT-40P) and they're UNPORTED and have the stock sized 1.84/1.48 valve combination. That's with a measly $150 Weiand Stealth intake (also unport), Holley 650, shorty headers and a .500" lift cam.

No offense man, but your attitude is what's bringing things down here. There's lots of ways to get performance, be it with a ricer or not, and the 302 is definitely one of them.

I am in no way supporting a bashing on any one's part. BUT Mr Chambers..... I am sitting at this computer so impressed with your reply. You are GREAT.... Thanks...

Exactly right. there are so many ways to make power in cars that it is almost expected for people to have different opinions on doing it. I have a friend who has run a 14.1 with his mustang and all thats really done to it is clutch and exhaust. And the altitude up here isnt ther greatest. Plus driver is a HUGE part of any car. Ive seen people who drive cars that are 12-13s capable but only manage 14-15's. And the reason i come to this site is because there are alot of people who know what they are talking about. We all have knowledge about our cars whether it is as good as some others we all know what we are talking about.

I have nothing against anyone here, and I don't like flamewars, however...

This whole thing started with what sounds like a spoiled ***** who sounds like he's had everything given to him: "this is it someone better help or I am selling this car". Hey buddy won't hurt us if you do.

I do agree and diagree with jim_howard_pdx. He has the right idea with not wanting to buy a ricer, instead hoping FORD would create a better platform for us to build off of. That is the right idea, however, I don't think that smaller displacement is the way to go. Certainly, you want the right size motor for the right size car, but c'mon.

For God's sake man, haven't you ever been frustrated ??? I'm sure he was joking about selling the car.
Let anybody here whos never cussed or thrown a wrench across the room or made a statement like "thats it i'm gettin rid of this dam thing" stand up.

Oh and anybody standin up is lying through their teeth !! :D

I dont understand this guys i make a comment on selling the car and the whole post blows into a war. Listen LX 5091 i am 17years old work 38.75 hours a week @ 9.82 dollars and hour sounds like a spoiled brat i go to school pay for my insurance when i **** up i dont have my parents to help me they go good job. And guess what u know how i am typing right now? i pay for this internet as well as the computer. I was never had anything handed to me nor given anything i will post every paycheck stubb and car payment, you know how i payed for this car i got a loan under my sisters name @ 14% intrest she has no credit she is 19. My dad just recently lost his job so i cant get any money from him and to top it off he just got out of the hospital because he was dieing of cancer. Sound like a spoiled brat man some people just really piss me off. Here i got a suggestion get a JOB! Thats right sounds pretty easy right? that is what i thought! i think u need need to drop childish **** i ask a ? about wiring and i get a answer that i am fucken spoiled bratt. If u used ur brains u would notice that i am fixing my car and not taking it to a dealer and by the way i did the motor swap myself and i dont consider myself a genuis or however u spell it. Are there any other mustang forums i am ready to move on. maybe if i was spoiled i would have a new intake too. ok what ever man


thanks alot for all the people who helped me and i hope the people who were just argueing would grow up.


thanks
raini

ps thanks for backing me up hot roddin atleast some people have a little sense

Amen brutha, Amen!

Raini (drtbiker) is one of my very good friends, and I can vouch that he works 5 days a week, almost 40 hours a week. Some of you guys have to grow up. This thread should of ended right after Pkrwud solved the problem (like he does on every other thread in here!) Hope you fix your car tomorrow man( sunday), If you need a hand, (which you probably don't) give me a call. PEACE IN THE MIDDLE EAST.

- Suave

I SAID I DON'T LIKE FLAME WARS SO THAT WASN'T MY INTENTION. I WAS SIMPLY TRYING TO POINT OUT HOW SILLY EVERYONE WAS BEING. AND I SAID YOU "SOUNDED" LIKE A SPOILED *****, I DIDN'T SAY YOU WERE. I KNOW WHAT IT FEELS LIKE BECAUSE I WORKED FOR EVERYTHING I EVER HAD, INCLUDING THE MERCEDES I DROVE IN HIGH SCHOOL, IT WAS MY HUMP EARNING GROCERY STORE PAY. AND DON'T YOU DARE TRY TO PUT SOME KIND OF GUILT TRIP THING ON ANYONE WITH THE MY CANCER RIDDEN DYING DAD BULLSHIT. HEY SORRY MAN, BUT YOU'RE OBVIOUSLY DOING THE SAME THING AS THE ORIGINAL POST. TRYING TO GUILT PEOPLE INTO HELPING YOU.

BUT ALL THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH MY INTENTION!

DAMN PEOPLE!

I'M JUST TRYING TO POINT OUT THAT EVERYONE TAKES THIS STUFF TOO MUCH TO HEART AND LET'S NOT ARGUE ABOUT DISPLACEMENT BECAUSE WE SOUND LIKE RICERS, AND LET'S NOT THREATEN OUR FELLOW MEMBERS TO TRASH OUR CAR 'CUZ THEY'RE NOT HELPING US FIX IT.

MY REPLY WAS THE ONE THAT WAS MISUNDERSTOOD, NOT YOUR POST.

I truly loved this board, but have serious doubts about how much I will participate in the future. This is not a threat, I just have to try to ignore that this post ever happened and maybe take a break and hope that when I decide to return and post something or a reply it won't be taken as a personal punch in the gut and that if I do need help that people will not shrug me off like I'm a jerk.

Have fun guys.....
take care.

C'mon, ladies, this is getting stupid again.

I will admit, the title to this thread damn near kept me from reading it at all, but Raini is a good guy that means well, he just doesn't always follow instructions real well ;) .

Anyway, he's found the problem, so let's just put this thread to rest, and pretend like most of it never existed.

Fair?

Okay then.

:)

Take care,
~Chris

thanks chris:)

PKRWUD:

What you said actually was the short version of my original reply

How old are you ????

the powers that be can throw me off here if they want, but i'm gonna say it anyway.

That goes beyond just a stupid statement, you need your *** whooped !!! :mad:

I agree, that was WAY out of line. Take a hike, we don't want people like you around here

25yo
what are you talking about?

everybody's had to deal with there stuff, some more than others, but we all have our own methods of dealing with how much we can take.

that being said, what is his telling me his life story supposed to do for me? I'm just trying to show him as far as this message board is concerned, that it doesn't matter what he or his family has dealt with. We have all dealt with our share.

I only type exactly what I would say to someone's face. So for any of you who are hiding behind your keyboard, I suggest you do it somewhere else. At all cost I avoid physical fights because they do not solve anything, however sometimes there just isn't any other way, so I've done that a couple of times.

I've never gotten into a fight because I was running my mouth, would you like to know why? Because when you are standing in front of someone speaking, you can explain yourself properly, in REAL TIME.

But when someone reads a short passage, let's say on a message board, sometimes they jump to conclusions and reply with stupid comments.

My replies and posts lately have not been intended as PERSONAL remarks designed to hurt anyone. Problem is I can in no way explain myself properly through REPLIES.

Why don't some of you guys BACK DOWN, take a chill pill, get laid or something, maybe hit a punching bag and come back to Mustang Works calm and relaxed. Then with a clear head and stable hormones read what has been said here, laugh at it's cuteness and go on with life.

lx i truely hope you're just having trouble expressing yourself. If you're not and thats just the way you view your buddies and their troubles then you need to seek professional help.

will it help any of you understand me better if I explain my life?

I aslo have had people extremely close to me die of cancer, I too will probably die of cancer, there is so much in my family. I sympathize with anyone going through it. I don't go around telling everyone because I need sympathy, but mabye that is not what dirtbiker is doing. Maybe him mentioning that goes beyond the scope of my understanding.

I am a very funny, loveable, friendly, COURTEOUS, generous, helping person who really would go out of his way for anyone. I don't have to know you to help you.

I find humor in alot of things that for some reason other people don't pick up on. I understand Tom Green, I don't neccessarily like him, but I know what it feels like to find something funny that other people think is serious.

How many times could I say that I didn't mean to hurt someone, that I thought that too many people were bickering back and forth in the post: "this is it someone better help or i am selling this car", so I tried to point that out.

Instead I get turned into a heartless devil that need to be punished.

WHAT CAN I DO TO MAKE EVERYONE HAPPY and forgive me for what I don't think I did wrong?

Shall I fly to where you all live and kiss your feet?

Please, I beg of you, to believe me when I say it was a mistake writing that reply and may I please continue to enjoy the grace of your company here at MW?

Ok i'll reply one more time then i'll shut up.
I'm truely sorry to hear about that ! I mean that from the bottom of my heart.
Now I don't believe DrtBiker was looking for sympathy? He was replying to your post saying he was spoiled and had probably had everything handed to him !! That statement came as a defense to your rather mean post.
Now let me put what he said another way ... If I came in here and said "Somebody help me or i'm gonna run this stupid thing off a cliff !" Do you think i would be trying to express how frustrated i was, or would you think I was seriously gonna drive my car off a cliff if someone didn't help me ???

Now, to the last part of your post .... yes ... and forgive me, you just need a big ole hug :D come here man !!!

:p

there is this song "lets get drunk and screw", but in this case i dont think that would be a good idea! how about we all just get drunk? Chris, what is on tap? please NO BEAST!!!

Safeway Orange Soda. Sorry James, I don't drink much these days. :(

Take care,
~Chris

The most important thing here is that the MUSTANG is FIXED lets let this one go fellas.......NO MORE POST

Man have you ever been to the track. My bone stock 88GT vert ran a 15.2 @3000ft.

My 01' 4.6 cobra runs 13.79's bone stock @3000ft.

You obviously dont know much about modern mustangs.