Progressive or Specific springs?

NorCal5.0 · 01-22-2000, 01:09 PM

Do you really need specific rate springs? I have a stock sustension, and HATE it. I want to carve, but I also want to go to the drags once or twice a year. I was thinking about adjustable shocks, so that I could loosen them up for the drags. The other question that I have is Koni reds or yellows or doubble adjustable? Tokico adj. or bilstein? To meny choices!
Thanks

Red96GT · 01-27-2000, 10:13 AM

And too many different activities. I know everyone wants a multipurpose car, but it's hard to get a good cornering suspension that's decent for drag racing too. Then there's the DD thing.

Specifics are desired for cornering, better feel. Variable are a good COMPROMISE for a street/auto X car, but basically any spring that's good for corners will be bad for drag racing. One wants to minimize weight transfer (cornering) the other wants to maximize it (drag racing). Struts/shocks control the ocillation of the springs. Without spending a lot of $, I personally don't believe you can get a suspension that will perform well in all 3 of these arenas (corners, drags, street).

Tokico does have a new set of adjustables for street/strip, but these won't be much good for cornering, they're too soft.

A good cornering set up would probably be the best thing if you only drag race every now and then. FMS "C" springs, tokico illumina 5 ways and some GW RLCA should suit you needs...

------------------
96 GT: KB subs, March pulleys, Bassani X pipe, 3.73's, alum. drive shaft, 70mm TB, K&N, KB Carbon Kevlar BP, Steeda Tri-ax shifter, Flowmasters, MSD wires, H&R springs, Tokico Illuminas

MM C/C plate & GW RLCA sitting in the garage waiting for a free weekend...

drudis · 01-28-2000, 03:13 PM

The specific rate springs are barely noticeable (to me at least) in NVH.
I had the Eibach 450-580# and went to 650# linears. Hardly a notice.
A H-U-G-E difference (worse) was the 45-series tires. I went from 245-50-16 Gatobacks to 245-45-16 A008RS-II (R1-type).
These tires are STIFF!!! I could feel if I drove over a penny!
Now I have 275-40-17's on 17x9-1/2" wheels
with g-Force R1s. These are noticeably stiff, but maybe its the taller tire that helped a bit in the road noise.

Back to the springs... I recommend a variable rate spring for a daily driver. If its only a weekend warrior, or play car, then go ahead with the specific rates.
Thats my story, and I'm stickin' to it ;-)

------------------
Darius Rudis
Home built t-arm/panhard suspension powered by an S-trimmed motor :-)
My Mustang Page

NorCal5.0 · 01-29-2000, 12:11 PM

Thanks for the advice. I guess since my 5.0 is a daily I will go with the progressive rate springs. Red 96, what is GW RLCA?

cool tan · 01-29-2000, 02:39 PM

i will have to agree with red96gt, it is almost impossible to build a suspension that does everything. one thing that a lot of people don't consider is what the sum of there bolt on parts will be for their drag setup, autocross setup,etc.

i have the ips ultra sport front and grand sport rear on my daily driver. the car will pull over 1g on street tires and has posted a 1.86 60' time with a 3.55 gear/traction lok on 245/50-16 bridgestone street tires. the car is my daily driver as well as my track car.

the suspension wasn't cheap, but if you add up the typical maxed out "bolt-on part" front and rear suspension, they aren't much cheaper in the end and typically can only perform one function well.

just something to ponder.

------------------
cool tan
5.0 cover car may 99
triple threat

ddawson · 01-31-2000, 05:27 PM

NorCal5.0

I live in San Mateo. If you want do go for a ride in a Global West sprung car let me know.

The ride is firm but not stiff and the improvement over stock was incredible.

Dan Dawson
Bay Area, California
88 5.0 LX, Special Order, No Options,
Vortech Supercharger, PowerFlex Pipe, MAX Flow 73mm MAF,
Power Pulleys, Global West LCA's, Global West Springs 800/190,
Koni Yellows, Hurst Shifter, Tri-Ax Handle, 190 Fuel Pump, 3.55 Gears,
Maximum Motorsports Full Length Subs and C/C Plates, MSD Coil,
Soon to install, 96 Cobra Rims, Nitto 555's and SN95 Rear Disks.

Red96GT · 02-01-2000, 01:32 PM

GW RLCA = Global West Rear Lower Control Arms, hence the abbreviation. IMHO, they are the best control arms on the market, for a bolt on. They'll locate the axle laterally reasonably well w/out a panhard bar.

Cooltan,
The trick with the IPS setup that you're not telling is that it isn't really "bolt on" at all. It pretty much completely re-engineers the whole suspension.

Granted, it is an awesome set up (when Corey FINALLY sends it all to you) but it isn't as easy to install. One of the prime advantages of the bolt on route that you're missing is that for poor guys like me, if done correctly with matched/complimentary pieces, is that you can put on a piece as you can AFFORD it and see improvement, yet experience an improvement greater than the sum of the parts as pieces are added. Sure, if I had $4-$5,000 all at once, I'd probably get ips (hell, who am I kidding, your DAMN right I'd get it!) but I'd like to autocross THIS season, not wait over the next 2 saving $ to afford the ips.

Please don't take this post as a bash or flame, I'm just trying to make sure everyone understands exactly what's involved.

I'll say it again, the IPS set up is tremendous and IF I had the $, it'd be on my car.

------------------
96 GT: KB subs, March pulleys, Bassani X pipe, 3.73's, alum. drive shaft, 70mm TB, K&N, KB Carbon Kevlar BP, Steeda Tri-ax shifter, Flowmasters, MSD wires, H&R springs, Tokico Illuminas

MM C/C plate & GW RLCA sitting in the garage waiting for a free weekend...

Red96GT's home page

NorCal5.0 · 02-03-2000, 10:00 AM

Dan- That would be great. I tried to email you but there is no address.

ddawson · 02-03-2000, 05:28 PM

ddawson@visa.com

Dan Dawson
Bay Area, California
88 5.0 LX, Red, Special Order, No Options,
Vortech A-Trim Supercharger, 9 PSI, PowerFlex Pipe, MAX Flow 73mm MAF,
Global West LCA's, Global West Springs 800/190, Koni Yellows, MSD Coil,
Hurst Shifter, Tri-Ax Handle, 190 Fuel Pump, 3.55 Gears,
Maximum Motorsports Full Length Subs and Caster/Camber Plates,
Five Lug Conversion, SVO Calibers, 96 Cobra Rims, Nitto 555's 255/45-17,
Work in Progress, SN95 Rear Disks.

01-22-2000, 01:09 PM	#1
NorCal5.0 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2000 Location: Redwood City, CA Posts: 23	Progressive or Specific springs? Do you really need specific rate springs? I have a stock sustension, and HATE it. I want to carve, but I also want to go to the drags once or twice a year. I was thinking about adjustable shocks, so that I could loosen them up for the drags. The other question that I have is Koni reds or yellows or doubble adjustable? Tokico adj. or bilstein? To meny choices! Thanks

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01-27-2000, 10:13 AM	#2
Red96GT Registered Member Join Date: Dec 1998 Location: Charlotte Posts: 435	And too many different activities. I know everyone wants a multipurpose car, but it's hard to get a good cornering suspension that's decent for drag racing too. Then there's the DD thing. Specifics are desired for cornering, better feel. Variable are a good COMPROMISE for a street/auto X car, but basically any spring that's good for corners will be bad for drag racing. One wants to minimize weight transfer (cornering) the other wants to maximize it (drag racing). Struts/shocks control the ocillation of the springs. Without spending a lot of $, I personally don't believe you can get a suspension that will perform well in all 3 of these arenas (corners, drags, street). Tokico does have a new set of adjustables for street/strip, but these won't be much good for cornering, they're too soft. A good cornering set up would probably be the best thing if you only drag race every now and then. FMS "C" springs, tokico illumina 5 ways and some GW RLCA should suit you needs... ------------------ 96 GT: KB subs, March pulleys, Bassani X pipe, 3.73's, alum. drive shaft, 70mm TB, K&N, KB Carbon Kevlar BP, Steeda Tri-ax shifter, Flowmasters, MSD wires, H&R springs, Tokico Illuminas MM C/C plate & GW RLCA sitting in the garage waiting for a free weekend...

01-28-2000, 03:13 PM	#3
drudis Moderator Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Livonia, MI, USA Posts: 1,194	The specific rate springs are barely noticeable (to me at least) in NVH. I had the Eibach 450-580# and went to 650# linears. Hardly a notice. A H-U-G-E difference (worse) was the 45-series tires. I went from 245-50-16 Gatobacks to 245-45-16 A008RS-II (R1-type). These tires are STIFF!!! I could feel if I drove over a penny! Now I have 275-40-17's on 17x9-1/2" wheels with g-Force R1s. These are noticeably stiff, but maybe its the taller tire that helped a bit in the road noise. Back to the springs... I recommend a variable rate spring for a daily driver. If its only a weekend warrior, or play car, then go ahead with the specific rates. Thats my story, and I'm stickin' to it ;-) ------------------ Darius Rudis Home built t-arm/panhard suspension powered by an S-trimmed motor :-) My Mustang Page

01-29-2000, 12:11 PM	#4
NorCal5.0 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2000 Location: Redwood City, CA Posts: 23	Thanks for the advice. I guess since my 5.0 is a daily I will go with the progressive rate springs. Red 96, what is GW RLCA?

01-29-2000, 02:39 PM	#5
cool tan Registered Member Join Date: Oct 1999 Location: va. beach, va. Posts: 32	i will have to agree with red96gt, it is almost impossible to build a suspension that does everything. one thing that a lot of people don't consider is what the sum of there bolt on parts will be for their drag setup, autocross setup,etc. i have the ips ultra sport front and grand sport rear on my daily driver. the car will pull over 1g on street tires and has posted a 1.86 60' time with a 3.55 gear/traction lok on 245/50-16 bridgestone street tires. the car is my daily driver as well as my track car. the suspension wasn't cheap, but if you add up the typical maxed out "bolt-on part" front and rear suspension, they aren't much cheaper in the end and typically can only perform one function well. just something to ponder. ------------------ cool tan 5.0 cover car may 99 triple threat

01-31-2000, 05:27 PM	#6
ddawson Registered Member Join Date: Apr 1999 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 42	NorCal5.0 I live in San Mateo. If you want do go for a ride in a Global West sprung car let me know. The ride is firm but not stiff and the improvement over stock was incredible. Dan Dawson Bay Area, California 88 5.0 LX, Special Order, No Options, Vortech Supercharger, PowerFlex Pipe, MAX Flow 73mm MAF, Power Pulleys, Global West LCA's, Global West Springs 800/190, Koni Yellows, Hurst Shifter, Tri-Ax Handle, 190 Fuel Pump, 3.55 Gears, Maximum Motorsports Full Length Subs and C/C Plates, MSD Coil, Soon to install, 96 Cobra Rims, Nitto 555's and SN95 Rear Disks.

02-01-2000, 01:32 PM	#7
Red96GT Registered Member Join Date: Dec 1998 Location: Charlotte Posts: 435	GW RLCA = Global West Rear Lower Control Arms, hence the abbreviation. IMHO, they are the best control arms on the market, for a bolt on. They'll locate the axle laterally reasonably well w/out a panhard bar. Cooltan, The trick with the IPS setup that you're not telling is that it isn't really "bolt on" at all. It pretty much completely re-engineers the whole suspension. Granted, it is an awesome set up (when Corey FINALLY sends it all to you) but it isn't as easy to install. One of the prime advantages of the bolt on route that you're missing is that for poor guys like me, if done correctly with matched/complimentary pieces, is that you can put on a piece as you can AFFORD it and see improvement, yet experience an improvement greater than the sum of the parts as pieces are added. Sure, if I had $4-$5,000 all at once, I'd probably get ips (hell, who am I kidding, your DAMN right I'd get it!) but I'd like to autocross THIS season, not wait over the next 2 saving $ to afford the ips. Please don't take this post as a bash or flame, I'm just trying to make sure everyone understands exactly what's involved. I'll say it again, the IPS set up is tremendous and IF I had the $, it'd be on my car. ------------------ 96 GT: KB subs, March pulleys, Bassani X pipe, 3.73's, alum. drive shaft, 70mm TB, K&N, KB Carbon Kevlar BP, Steeda Tri-ax shifter, Flowmasters, MSD wires, H&R springs, Tokico Illuminas MM C/C plate & GW RLCA sitting in the garage waiting for a free weekend... Red96GT's home page

02-03-2000, 10:00 AM	#8
NorCal5.0 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2000 Location: Redwood City, CA Posts: 23	Dan- That would be great. I tried to email you but there is no address.

02-03-2000, 05:28 PM	#9
ddawson Registered Member Join Date: Apr 1999 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 42	ddawson@visa.com Dan Dawson Bay Area, California 88 5.0 LX, Red, Special Order, No Options, Vortech A-Trim Supercharger, 9 PSI, PowerFlex Pipe, MAX Flow 73mm MAF, Global West LCA's, Global West Springs 800/190, Koni Yellows, MSD Coil, Hurst Shifter, Tri-Ax Handle, 190 Fuel Pump, 3.55 Gears, Maximum Motorsports Full Length Subs and Caster/Camber Plates, Five Lug Conversion, SVO Calibers, 96 Cobra Rims, Nitto 555's 255/45-17, Work in Progress, SN95 Rear Disks.