When is it time to change to synthetic oil?

Stang_ROTY · 08-24-2004, 07:02 PM

I have about 1500 miles on the engine and I this is a street/drag the car. The last time I changed the oil was in early spring and I've more than 10 passes since. Should I change from to a synthetic oil?? If so, what oil weight??

88fivepointoh · 08-24-2004, 08:10 PM

well using 3 months 3000 miles, I would change it.. I like that royal purple that just came out... It seems to quiet noisy lifters on some cars, its pretty neat, purple oil, all synthetic. if your hard on the motor change it often, i mean they say sythetic you can go to 5000miles, I would never do that.. i used to change mine every 1500 as well. if you race it on the track 10W40 or 20W50 is best.. I would go 20W50 just becuase Synthetic oils are generaly thinner then conventinal oils so a 20w50 synthetic is more or less, a 10w40 weight oil. I used 20w50 and it works great.

andy669 · 08-24-2004, 08:30 PM

You dont need to put that molasses in your engine. I use Royal Purple Racing 9. Its equivalent to 0W10.

Andy

88fivepointoh · 08-24-2004, 08:43 PM

10 weight motor oil? That is the thinest oil out there.. why would you run such a thin oil in a racing motor? I think we need some explination on oil weights and viscosities... the lower the numbers the thinner the oil, a stock motor uses 10W30 .. A racing motor requires a thicker oil...

88fivepointoh · 08-24-2004, 08:48 PM

Here is the Information on oils from

http://www.hawayaracing.com/Lubricants.htm

ROYAL PURPLE "9" RACING OIL - 9' is an ultra-light viscosity racing motor oil formulated for motorcycle and small to medium displacement car engines. An excellent drag racing motor oil and performance proven in road race motorcycle engines. A Drag Racers Oil of Choice. Don't pre-stage without it! Available in quart bottles and 5-gallon pails Viscosity typical of a OW10 Oil.

ROYAL PURPLE "11" RACING OIL - 11' is a light viscosity racing motor oil formulated to withstand exotic fuels including NO2. Designed for the small displacement motors. Performs wellin a methanol environment. A versatile race oil. Available in quart bottles and 5-gallon pails. Viscosity typical of a 5W30 Oil.

ROYAL PURPLE "21" RACING OIL - 21' is the choice of NASCAR and late model dirt car teams. A horsepower and torque generating race motor oil which has unparalleled wear characteristics. '21' is and has been used in USAC, WoO, NHRA, IHRA, NASCAR and many other sanctions of car and motorcycle engines. Available in quart bottles and 5-gallon pails. Viscosity typical of a 5W30 Oil.

ROYAL PURPLE "41" RACING OIL - 41' is designed for marine inboard, endurance car racing and street hot rod motors. Capable of withstanding long intervals of extreme heat. The high performance motor oil of choice for the uncompromising street rod enthusiast. Available in quart bottles and 5 gallon pails Viscosity typical of a 10W40 Oil.

ROYAL PURPLE "NITRO PLUS" RACING OIL - NITRO PLUS formulated to withstand the stripping, shearing and emulsificabon effect Nitro-Methane fuel has on other oils. The Ultimate racing motor oil for exotic fuels. NITRO PLUS - Don't Stage Without It. Available in 5-gallon pails.

ROYAL PURPLE "2-CYCLE" RACING OIL - A clean burning, horsepower making two-cycle racing oil. For high-powered injected racing engines. Outstanding performance qualities, including better wear characteristics, cleaner motors and more power. Available in quart bottles and 5-gallon pails.

ROYAL PURPLE "2-CYCLE" OEM OIL - A clean burning, TCWIII two-cycle premix or injector oil. a recreational two-cycle oil with exceptional film strength. Using Royal Purple 2-C TCWIII Oil results in cleaner motors, more power, and less fuel consumption. Available in quart bottles and 5-gallon pails.

"MAX-GEAR" GEAR OIL - MAX-GEAR reduces frictional wear and subsequent heat using an impact absorbing, non-shearing molecular structure suitable for both high performance and OEM applications. MAX-GEAR will withstand the high temperatures experienced in race and cross country driving environments. Available in quart bottles and 5-gallon pails.

~The Jester~ · 08-24-2004, 09:19 PM

And now, a brief word from our sponsor Royal Purple. hehehehe

Anyways, we all know oil pressure is a good thing. I was running Castrol 20w-50 in my car, and it carried about 80 psi down the track at 13.45 I was happy, the engine was "protected" I thought, with the good "racing" oil.

Then, a friend explained to me that TOO MUCH oil pressure is a BAD thing. Think of all that oil pressure trying to keep your cam, crank, pistons from moving. All the engine internals actually have to work AGAINST the oil pressure.

Did NOTHING else to the car except switched to Castrol Syntec 10w-30 and presto! 13.20 all ******* day long at about 45 psi oil pressure. Eventually I switched to synthetic in the whole car, tranny, rear end, the whole bit. Synthetic oil. It just works better. Plain and simple.

andy669 · 08-24-2004, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 88fivepointoh
A racing motor requires a thicker oil...

Depends on the type of racing. In a drag racing engine, I want the thinnest oil possible that will still maintain 'the wedge'. I also want my oil as hot as I can get it.

Going through the traps at about 8000 rpm I have about 5 pounds of oil pressure.

Andy

88fivepointoh · 08-24-2004, 10:23 PM

isn't that bad though? I mean 5 pounds is nothing... maybe i don't understand that but the thought makes me crindge...

rwhite65 · 08-25-2004, 03:07 AM

ok, now u got me curious...why do u want the oil as hot as possible....and 5 pounds? I had always heard the general rule of thumb was 10 psi for every 1,000 rpms.
Ryan

andy669 · 08-25-2004, 07:49 AM

Running the engine out of oil at the end of the track is worth a solid 5 hundredths. Thats not much for a bracket car or a street car, but for a heads-up or index racing car, its a huge amount.

Thin oil makes horsepower, er I guess I should say thick oil robs horsepower. The hotter it is, the thinner it is. Obviously if it gets too hot it will break down, but even with 2 oil pan heaters I have not found that point.

When NASCAR starts thier qualifying, they heat their oil up to over 320 degrees. By the time they are done, it has cooled off substantially.

Andy

crazypete · 08-25-2004, 08:08 AM

So if you put 0w10 into a street engine, it would grind itself into a pulp, right? All this talk is for track engines I assume.

andy669 · 08-25-2004, 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by crazypete
So if you put 0w10 into a street engine, it would grind itself into a pulp, right?

Why would it? Theres a couple reasons I can offer not to put it in a street car. Your oil might see more abuse in 1 hot day of driving than mine would in 4 or 5 races. Another reason not to run that thin of oil is that it will find every possible place to leak. If you have a drip or 2 now with 10w30, you will have huge spots with the thin stuff. Also, its 8 bucks a quart.

Andy

Stang_ROTY · 08-25-2004, 08:28 AM

I can't find anyone around here who sells the stuff....what about Mobil 1 or Castrol Syntec?? I want to fill this engine with oil today and get over to the strip for Wed's street night, and I can't wait for Summitt to deliver the Royal Purple. I was hoping that they'd have it in stock @ my local shops but no such luck.

rwhite65 · 08-25-2004, 01:43 PM

thanks 4 the explanation, seems like a valid reason.....but 5 pounds at high rpms...would make me cry!!! But that could be one of the reasons u r fast at the strip and I am a slow poke on the street.
Ryan

88fivepointoh · 08-25-2004, 02:40 PM

Castrol is good i used that and Mobil one i used that too.. There all good as far as i am concerned.. Yea any good performance shop has royal Purple... regular stores won't.

As for the pressure analysis, sounds good to me i guess, I won't run 5psi anytime soon.. Makes me uneasy.. hehehe...

Stang_ROTY · 08-25-2004, 05:40 PM

So what is a good Mobil 1/Syntec weight for a street/strip car?

Quote:

Originally posted by 88fivepointoh
Castrol is good i used that and Mobil one i used that too.. There all good as far as i am concerned.. Yea any good performance shop has royal Purple... regular stores won't.

As for the pressure analysis, sounds good to me i guess, I won't run 5psi anytime soon.. Makes me uneasy.. hehehe...

88fivepointoh · 08-25-2004, 06:46 PM

10w40 would be good for street and strip usuage

Stang_ROTY · 08-26-2004, 07:33 AM

Wow...I just went to buy some oil and the only good synthetic they had was Redline. I was going to buy it for 8 bucks a qt. then I looked on the bottle and it said "For engine's with over 3000 miles - This is not a break-in motor oil". I guess I'll have to wait a while before I put in the synthetic.

andy669 · 08-26-2004, 07:45 AM

Unless you have some really hard rings like stainless or tool steel, you will be fine. 1500 miles is plenty of break time for regular chrom moly rings. The only thing you are worried about is how the rings have seated.

Get some 5W30 synthetic.

Andy

08-24-2004, 07:02 PM	#1
Stang_ROTY Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Berkshire County - Massachusetts Posts: 735	When is it time to change to synthetic oil? I have about 1500 miles on the engine and I this is a street/drag the car. The last time I changed the oil was in early spring and I've more than 10 passes since. Should I change from to a synthetic oil?? If so, what oil weight?? __________________ Red 1993 GT Street Machine Best E.T. - 12.41/Best MPH = 108 Engine is a 1969 351 block w/393 stroker kit. Dynamic Roller Myte C4, 8 pt cage. Edlebrock Performer heads and Victor Jr. EFI, FRPP 30lb injectors & Cartech fuel system. MSD ignition. Sothside Machine bars & Sub-frames, adj. upper's, 3.73's, Koni rear shocks, much more

08-24-2004, 08:30 PM	#3
andy669 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Moline Il Posts: 901	You dont need to put that molasses in your engine. I use Royal Purple Racing 9. Its equivalent to 0W10. Andy __________________ 88 coupe 91 LX NMRA Pure Street 5120

08-24-2004, 09:19 PM	#6
~The Jester~ Rat Killer Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Cold ass Ohio Posts: 1,143	And now, a brief word from our sponsor Royal Purple. hehehehe Anyways, we all know oil pressure is a good thing. I was running Castrol 20w-50 in my car, and it carried about 80 psi down the track at 13.45 I was happy, the engine was "protected" I thought, with the good "racing" oil. Then, a friend explained to me that TOO MUCH oil pressure is a BAD thing. Think of all that oil pressure trying to keep your cam, crank, pistons from moving. All the engine internals actually have to work AGAINST the oil pressure. Did NOTHING else to the car except switched to Castrol Syntec 10w-30 and presto! 13.20 all ******* day long at about 45 psi oil pressure. Eventually I switched to synthetic in the whole car, tranny, rear end, the whole bit. Synthetic oil. It just works better. Plain and simple. __________________ d-Con Racing "Nothing fancy, just 347 inches of RAT POISON!" MICE need not apply.....

08-25-2004, 03:07 AM	#9
rwhite65 Ride Hard Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Wyoming IL Posts: 1,094	ok, now u got me curious...why do u want the oil as hot as possible....and 5 pounds? I had always heard the general rule of thumb was 10 psi for every 1,000 rpms. Ryan __________________ 65 Fastback 91 roller 306, H/C/I AOD-Bauman, PI Stallion, 4.10's and traction loc 04 Grand Cherokee Freedom Edition 79 Ford F-250 4x4 - Restored

08-25-2004, 07:49 AM	#10
andy669 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Moline Il Posts: 901	Running the engine out of oil at the end of the track is worth a solid 5 hundredths. Thats not much for a bracket car or a street car, but for a heads-up or index racing car, its a huge amount. Thin oil makes horsepower, er I guess I should say thick oil robs horsepower. The hotter it is, the thinner it is. Obviously if it gets too hot it will break down, but even with 2 oil pan heaters I have not found that point. When NASCAR starts thier qualifying, they heat their oil up to over 320 degrees. By the time they are done, it has cooled off substantially. Andy __________________ 88 coupe 91 LX NMRA Pure Street 5120

08-24-2004, 08:10 PM	#2
88fivepointoh Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Rochester Posts: 553	well using 3 months 3000 miles, I would change it.. I like that royal purple that just came out... It seems to quiet noisy lifters on some cars, its pretty neat, purple oil, all synthetic. if your hard on the motor change it often, i mean they say sythetic you can go to 5000miles, I would never do that.. i used to change mine every 1500 as well. if you race it on the track 10W40 or 20W50 is best.. I would go 20W50 just becuase Synthetic oils are generaly thinner then conventinal oils so a 20w50 synthetic is more or less, a 10w40 weight oil. I used 20w50 and it works great.

08-24-2004, 08:43 PM	#4
88fivepointoh Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Rochester Posts: 553	10 weight motor oil? That is the thinest oil out there.. why would you run such a thin oil in a racing motor? I think we need some explination on oil weights and viscosities... the lower the numbers the thinner the oil, a stock motor uses 10W30 .. A racing motor requires a thicker oil...

08-24-2004, 08:48 PM	#5
88fivepointoh Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Rochester Posts: 553	Here is the Information on oils from http://www.hawayaracing.com/Lubricants.htm ROYAL PURPLE "9" RACING OIL - 9' is an ultra-light viscosity racing motor oil formulated for motorcycle and small to medium displacement car engines. An excellent drag racing motor oil and performance proven in road race motorcycle engines. A Drag Racers Oil of Choice. Don't pre-stage without it! Available in quart bottles and 5-gallon pails Viscosity typical of a OW10 Oil. ROYAL PURPLE "11" RACING OIL - 11' is a light viscosity racing motor oil formulated to withstand exotic fuels including NO2. Designed for the small displacement motors. Performs wellin a methanol environment. A versatile race oil. Available in quart bottles and 5-gallon pails. Viscosity typical of a 5W30 Oil. ROYAL PURPLE "21" RACING OIL - 21' is the choice of NASCAR and late model dirt car teams. A horsepower and torque generating race motor oil which has unparalleled wear characteristics. '21' is and has been used in USAC, WoO, NHRA, IHRA, NASCAR and many other sanctions of car and motorcycle engines. Available in quart bottles and 5-gallon pails. Viscosity typical of a 5W30 Oil. ROYAL PURPLE "41" RACING OIL - 41' is designed for marine inboard, endurance car racing and street hot rod motors. Capable of withstanding long intervals of extreme heat. The high performance motor oil of choice for the uncompromising street rod enthusiast. Available in quart bottles and 5 gallon pails Viscosity typical of a 10W40 Oil. ROYAL PURPLE "NITRO PLUS" RACING OIL - NITRO PLUS formulated to withstand the stripping, shearing and emulsificabon effect Nitro-Methane fuel has on other oils. The Ultimate racing motor oil for exotic fuels. NITRO PLUS - Don't Stage Without It. Available in 5-gallon pails. ROYAL PURPLE "2-CYCLE" RACING OIL - A clean burning, horsepower making two-cycle racing oil. For high-powered injected racing engines. Outstanding performance qualities, including better wear characteristics, cleaner motors and more power. Available in quart bottles and 5-gallon pails. ROYAL PURPLE "2-CYCLE" OEM OIL - A clean burning, TCWIII two-cycle premix or injector oil. a recreational two-cycle oil with exceptional film strength. Using Royal Purple 2-C TCWIII Oil results in cleaner motors, more power, and less fuel consumption. Available in quart bottles and 5-gallon pails. "MAX-GEAR" GEAR OIL - MAX-GEAR reduces frictional wear and subsequent heat using an impact absorbing, non-shearing molecular structure suitable for both high performance and OEM applications. MAX-GEAR will withstand the high temperatures experienced in race and cross country driving environments. Available in quart bottles and 5-gallon pails.

08-24-2004, 10:23 PM	#8
88fivepointoh Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Rochester Posts: 553	isn't that bad though? I mean 5 pounds is nothing... maybe i don't understand that but the thought makes me crindge...

08-25-2004, 08:08 AM	#11
crazypete Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Boston Posts: 592	So if you put 0w10 into a street engine, it would grind itself into a pulp, right? All this talk is for track engines I assume. __________________ 91 GT Carb conversion, holley 600 double pumper, edelbrock performer intake, FMS "C" drop springs, march 1000 underdrive pullies, crane 1.7 roller rockers, GT-40P headers, bassani x pipe, american thunder catback, FMS 4.56's, msd aL6, trunkmount battery, A/C eliminator kit, 3000 stall tci streetfighter, AOD with transgo kit, A+ servo, 300M hardened lockup shaft, kevlar bands and 28,000 gvw trans cooler, 3 core radiator, 300 lbs stripped with a full interior

08-25-2004, 08:28 AM	#13
Stang_ROTY Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Berkshire County - Massachusetts Posts: 735	I can't find anyone around here who sells the stuff....what about Mobil 1 or Castrol Syntec?? I want to fill this engine with oil today and get over to the strip for Wed's street night, and I can't wait for Summitt to deliver the Royal Purple. I was hoping that they'd have it in stock @ my local shops but no such luck. __________________ Red 1993 GT Street Machine Best E.T. - 12.41/Best MPH = 108 Engine is a 1969 351 block w/393 stroker kit. Dynamic Roller Myte C4, 8 pt cage. Edlebrock Performer heads and Victor Jr. EFI, FRPP 30lb injectors & Cartech fuel system. MSD ignition. Sothside Machine bars & Sub-frames, adj. upper's, 3.73's, Koni rear shocks, much more

08-25-2004, 01:43 PM	#14
rwhite65 Ride Hard Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Wyoming IL Posts: 1,094	thanks 4 the explanation, seems like a valid reason.....but 5 pounds at high rpms...would make me cry!!! But that could be one of the reasons u r fast at the strip and I am a slow poke on the street. Ryan __________________ 65 Fastback 91 roller 306, H/C/I AOD-Bauman, PI Stallion, 4.10's and traction loc 04 Grand Cherokee Freedom Edition 79 Ford F-250 4x4 - Restored

08-25-2004, 02:40 PM	#15
88fivepointoh Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Rochester Posts: 553	Castrol is good i used that and Mobil one i used that too.. There all good as far as i am concerned.. Yea any good performance shop has royal Purple... regular stores won't. As for the pressure analysis, sounds good to me i guess, I won't run 5psi anytime soon.. Makes me uneasy.. hehehe...

08-25-2004, 06:46 PM	#17
88fivepointoh Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Rochester Posts: 553	10w40 would be good for street and strip usuage

08-26-2004, 07:33 AM	#18
Stang_ROTY Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Berkshire County - Massachusetts Posts: 735	Wow...I just went to buy some oil and the only good synthetic they had was Redline. I was going to buy it for 8 bucks a qt. then I looked on the bottle and it said "For engine's with over 3000 miles - This is not a break-in motor oil". I guess I'll have to wait a while before I put in the synthetic. __________________ Red 1993 GT Street Machine Best E.T. - 12.41/Best MPH = 108 Engine is a 1969 351 block w/393 stroker kit. Dynamic Roller Myte C4, 8 pt cage. Edlebrock Performer heads and Victor Jr. EFI, FRPP 30lb injectors & Cartech fuel system. MSD ignition. Sothside Machine bars & Sub-frames, adj. upper's, 3.73's, Koni rear shocks, much more

08-26-2004, 07:45 AM	#19
andy669 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Moline Il Posts: 901	Unless you have some really hard rings like stainless or tool steel, you will be fine. 1500 miles is plenty of break time for regular chrom moly rings. The only thing you are worried about is how the rings have seated. Get some 5W30 synthetic. Andy __________________ 88 coupe 91 LX NMRA Pure Street 5120

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