Free Horsepower, but at what cost??

[71grande]

I am wanting to dump my Crank/Belt driven fan in favor of an electrick fan, but I have been warned that an electrick fan wont keep my engine running cool enough. It is a stock 351C 2V with an MSD6A as my only Mod so far. I plan on adding a Edelbrock performer RPM intake with a 650 4Barrrel. Up the cam a bit to Comp for my bigger carb and convert to Hydrolic lifters.

Will I be able to run an electric fan? And which ones are reccomended? What should I look for?

Thanks.

Mike

[Rev]

I tried running 2 16" electric fans to begin with to maybe save a few HP. I bought them from different places (Auto Zone and JC Whitney). After replacing 2 fans in less than a year, I swithced back to a mechanical 6 bladed primary Flex fan just for reliability. I finally bought a Hayden from O'reilly with a lifetime warranty to use as my auxillary pusher fan for $130 (my car needs the extra fan).

My point is to be careful in choosing after market electric fans. I've found most to be unreliable.

Rev

[71grande]

well that isnt exactly what I was hoping to hear, but that is what I wanted to know.

What about switching to an electric water pump? Is that not reccomended as well?

Mike

[mustangman65_79]

I ran a nice 16" fan for four years now, with not probs, execpt the thermostat burned out, so I hooked it up to a switch. After that, no probs. Flex-a-light makes a really good fan, look in the Sumit mag. Make sure u get a puller fan, they work better. Also look the BCU they pull(I think it's BCU) maybe it's cfm, don't remember, but the more, the better.

The fan I bought was a brand that Kreagan(shucks, Cheakers) has.

As for a electric water pump, U don't really need one of those till your looking at really high hp #'s. From what I've heard, it's mainly a hardcore racing part.

[71grande]

yea, the electric water pump might mainly be a hardcore racing part, but it is also the cool factor. I got one and you dont.

Mike

[Rev]

I don't even think the electric water pump is recommended for street use.

Rev

[mustangman65_79]

Originally posted by Rev
I don't even think the electric water pump is recommended for street use.

Rev

I think your right.

[PKRWUD]

LOL! It depends on which side of the parts counter you're standing, Rev!

Moroso makes 7 different completely electric water pumps. 3 for Chevy, 2 for Mopar, and 2 for Ford (289-351W & 429-460). They claim it "improves cooling efficiency during all driving conditions, especially while idling", and that it's "Clear anodized 6061-T6 billet aluminum pump housing and impeller and blue powder coated outer case will provide years of dependable, rust-free operation". There are no restrictions or recommendations regarding highway use versus racing. BUT, two pages over, they have electric water pump drive units, which are little 12 volt electric motors that drive, via a belt, a stock style water pump. These, however, are clearly marked "For Drag Racing applications only".

So, you want to be even MORE special than you are now??? Go get one.

Would I? Not for a vehicle I'm driving any farther than across town, twice a month, if someone else pays.

Electric fans are far more hype than anything else. A clutch fan only draws power away from the engine when the radiator is it's hottestg, which is at idle. Who cares if you're missing 3 horsepower in McDonalds drive through, or while going cruising on Main Street?

Take care,
~Chris

[gp001]

I run a Flex-a-Lite #475 fan (it is like the black magic, but thinner). The fan is a nice unit and cools my car fine.

Remember:
at idle an electric fan flows max, a mech flows min
at speed an electric fan wastes min power, a mech wastes max

[69fastback]

I like my electric fan. It don't work as well as my clutch fan did, but it has a huge advantge in the fact that i can cool of the car after i shut it off. It really helps alot between runs to keep my fan going and the car turned off.

[JaxTheDJ]

I run a permacool 18" electric fan on my stang and it runs very cool,and it mounts under the stock shroud.

[1972mustang]

I got a dual fan setup from a late model BMW that keeps my 351W cool. I'm also using the Moroso electric pump drive to push my water pump. I live in SC and on the interstate it runs 180 (which what my thermostat is) and 175 arounf town and in McDonalds Drive-thru. By the way, it gave me 2 tenths of a second on the strip!

[jim_howard_pdx]

MAN YOU GUYS CRACK ME UP

LOTS OF OPINIONS VERY LITTLE FACTS

Lets start with the water pump and then move on to the radiator fan issue. A water pump will suceed or fail on its flow capabilities. The water pump basically changes flow volume based upon engine RPM and this is NOT OPTIMUM. Worse, at high RPMs the water cannot flow optimally and then it CAVITATES. This means at upper RPMS your water pump may not be flowing water at all.

So why do people buy high flow water pumps, not because they push more volume. THEY TYPICALLY DO NOT. They simply CAVITATE less at higher RPMS.

An electric water pump, properly configured will provide ideal coolant flow at a continuous level that does not alter with RPM. This is why every serious racer uses one. THEY DO NOT CAVITATE EVER!

Why not use one on a street engine? If you are in colder climates you want your coolant to heat up and help with fuel atomization. An electric water pump might actually make cold weather performance suffer. If you are in a mild climate use the electric water pump.

Why do the manufacturer's stick on a label saying for racing only? Because electric engines are subject to lifetime service rating. They do not want to be sued by people putting these on a motor home diesel and running 800 miles per day.

Now for the radiator fan. All fans have pretty much the same issue. How much airflow do they provide at idle and in average traffic speeds. Most performance cars came with fans that engage at idle, and spin freely at higher RPM. These clutch fans can be very effective and use very little HP at high RPM.

All fans benefit from having a shrowd that maximizes the volume of air the fan can pull. Ideally, the fan blade should be 1 inch from the radiator NO CLOSER AND NO FURTHER. IT SHOULD BE AT LEAST 1 INCH DEEP INTO THE SHROWD.

If running an engine driven fan blade, go with a six blade flex unit. These are really great. They use up the least amount of HP, unless you are running an optimum clutch fan. If you are still hot, mount a single or double pusher fan in front of the radiator to encourage air flow at idle and low speeds.

If running only electric, run both pusher and puller fans. Run a single big puller and double pushers. THESE NEED TO BE SHROWDED OR YOU ARE JUST KIDDING YOURSELF. An unshrowded fan pulls air from the sides, not through the radiator.

Radiator configuration is also a big factor with cooling. The inlets and outlets should be at opposite corners. This forces the water to flow through the tubes where the cooling actually occurs. If your radiator has an inlet and outlet on the same side, the water pump will pull the water through the least path of resistance.

Now look at aluminum radiators. Why do they cool better? Aluminum allows us to run significantly higher water pressure levels than brass. A brass radiator should be using a 6-8 lb cap to eliminate radiator damage. An aluminum radiator will run a 11-17 lb cap. Double the water pressure and you reduce water temperature.

A proper aluminum radiator will run 30-35 degrees cooler than a non-optimized brass radiator. This is how we keep NASCAR engines happy.

Are you figuring this out now???????

Now you know the physics behind the B.S.
Go forth and beat on the poor Chevy guys!

[Rev]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by jim_howard_pdx
[B]MAN YOU GUYS CRACK ME UP

Now look at aluminum radiators. Why do they cool better? Aluminum allows us to run significantly higher water pressure levels than brass. A brass radiator should be using a 6-8 lb cap to eliminate radiator damage. An aluminum radiator will run a 11-17 lb cap. Double the water pressure and you reduce water temperature.



So aluminum radiators cool better because they can run higher cooling system pressure? Funny, I thought it was because they have a higher fin count that they cooled better. A 6-8 psi cap seems too low to me for a brass radiator. I use a 15 psi cap on my 4-row brass radiator with no problems.

Rev