Design me a combo...

cad614 · 09-14-2001, 10:56 AM

I'm closing in on the time to make my car run.

I finished up the Cervini's Stalker kit, subframe connectors will be installed soon, and Koni's (yellows) should be on within a month. Just a few more suspension components and then I'll be going after the engine and transmission.

Here's the goal: 12 second Daily Driver! Honestly low 13's would be fine, but I'd love to see 12s. I want to design a plan so that every dollar I spend will go towards my goal. I know I'll have to get a roll cage, but I figure I should get it out of the 15's before I get one.

Figure I'd start with a block. Which one should I get, 302 or 351? Only concern I have is having to replace my hood, I really like it.

I have a friend with a old Boss 302 that I can probally get for a good price, but besides it having a four bolt main I don't know much about these blocks, will it work for me?

I do plan on building an entirely new drivetrain but, if the stock 8.8 rear will support the final results should I consider getting 3.73's now? I imagine 4.10's, which would be ideal now, would be a bit much with a stronger engine.

I know this is going to take awhile, but someday I will accomplish it. Then when I'm finished and I have an article on pg 52 of MM&FF, I'll be proud to say, "I couldn't have done it without all the great advise from the members of MustangWorks.com"!

------------------
'95 GT Convertable

Smokedawg · 09-14-2001, 11:56 AM

If you go with a 351, you are going to run into many expensive changes.
I would stick with a fresh 302 and get a setup such as Skymans or Ricks91GT..They are deep into the 12's...

Good luck.

------------------
347 Stroker Motor: Balanced, Cobra Transmission, Extrude Ported and Polished Upper and ported Lower, GT40 Milled Ported and Polished Heads, B303 Cam, BBK 1 5/8 Headers, 30lb Bosch Injectors, Holley AFPR, March Underdrive Pulleys, Perma-Cool Fan, 3-Core Radiator, Accel Performance Coil, Accel 300+ Racing Wires, Ram Air, K&N Filter, 73mm Vortech MAF, 70mm TB, FlowMaster Exhaust w/BBK Offroad H-Pipe, Hurst Shifter, 3:55 Gears, Ram Clutch, Cross Drilled Rotors, AC and Smog del, rear seat del.

84LX89GT · 09-14-2001, 12:13 PM

I agree with smokedawg, changing to a 351 would require to begin with a new hood so i won't get into the specifics of that swap. Basically if you have a good induction/exhaust system matched for a higher rpm band and gears and add a supercharger to that you'll EASILY get at least into the 12's. I've heard that a holley systemax kit will get most vehicles anywhere between the mid-high 12's depending on the driving, but then again you have a convertible which is pretty heavy. If money is no object, then my limited opinion is a holley systemax II kit (because it's all flow/powerband matched as a kit), a 9 psi supercharger like a Vortech S-trim, Paxton NOVI2000, etc. at least 1 5/8" primary headers with 2 1/2" dual exhaust, maybe even 1 3/4" with 3" dual exhaust becuase i believe you'd be pushing close to 450 horsepower or even more.
You could also get a stroker short block setup to go with the systemax II (or whatever you choose) like a 331 or 347 to increase torque output for your heavy vehicle and having a supercharger would also greatly enhance your off the line launch.
To go with all the extra power i believe that you'd need things like 30# injectors with a calibrated MAF sensor, maybe even a larger fuel rail, 255lph fuel pump, i don't know but maybe you may need to swap to larger fuel lines in general as well. A custom burnt chip dyno tuned chip would also be a good investment.
These are just some ideas and i'm sure everyone will have something good to share. I hope this was inspiring or helpful somewhat

. Good luck,

-side note: unless you want to change to carburetion, a BOSS 302, which is has cleveland heads would probably not do very well in your daily driver criteria.

------------------
previous name: 84stangLX
'84 Mustang 5.0 LX
my LX
'89 Mustang GT
my GT

cad614 · 09-14-2001, 12:37 PM

Thanks guys, keep it coming.
84LX89GT - About the BOSS, what I was primarily concerned with was the block. I figured the heads would probally be replaced with something better than stock reguardless of how good they were. Thanks for the advise though, I learn somethin new everyday.

09-14-2001, 01:15 PM

Stick w/ the 302...the 351 is an awesome motor, but Smokedawgs right, it'll end up being way too expensive, just for a 12 second car. Check out the set ups of us w/ 12 second cars, and see which you like, don't like and possibly mix and match

. As far as your stock 8.8 rear, it should be just fine, so go for the 3.73's now.

------------------
'90 LX 5.0;12K original miles (no sh*&);3.55 gears; March pulleys;Edelbrock Performer Heads;BBK 1 5/8" equal length shorties;MSD 6AL ignition w/ blaster 2 coil;FMS E303 cam;Pro-M 75mm MAF;BBK 70mm TB; Eibach drag-launch spring kit;Southside welded subs;9" K&N cone filter charger;Hurst shifter;Cervini's 3" turbo hood;A/C delete; gutted cats;2 chamber Flomasters;Corbeau racing seats;FMS 30# injectors;JMS chip; Holley 190lb fp;TFS track heat Intake (12.299 @ 113 - 1.78 60')

fiveohpatrol · 09-14-2001, 03:52 PM

its fairy easy to take a fox LX into the 12's but you guys have to notice that he's got a SN95 vert. im hoping its not an automatic? cause that would make it even harder
if it were me, i'd go with a sportsman 302 block just for peace of mind, with a 331 stroker kit from DSS, AFR185's, GT40 intake (or holley intake if a supercharger is in mind) not sure what cam specs to tell ya, but im sure with these and some dragradials you'll be running well into the 12's

------------------
88 Notch, B&M Ripper, 3.73's, Ported E7's, Explorer int. w/ ported lower, pulleys, 1.7RR's, BBK headers, off-road H-pipe, flowmasters, subframes, 65mm TB, March ram air ,MSD coil, U/L control arms, 155lph f/p, Crane Adj.FPR, Nitto drag radials, best 1/4--> 13.76@101.4 on a 2.17 60ft

cad614 · 09-14-2001, 04:19 PM

Oh ya... this things a slug! Convertable and AODE!
That's why I'm looking for a little bit of help, there aren't many SN95 verts running that quick.

todd95GT · 09-14-2001, 11:59 PM

Make sure when you order a cam that you contact a company like JMS and provide them with the motor and cam specs so they can burn you a custom chip. 94-95 EEC-IV's don't like to idle with aftermarket cams unless the chip is burnt for your application. I have a 95 coupe, some bolt-ons, and eventually I will break the twelves. It feels like a 14 second car now, and I notice it really doesn't have much to offer once I slam third gear. But then again, I know I will need the entire upper half of the motor done up to run that quick in this car. It was so easy with my Chevelle, 350, 10:1, stock iron heads and cheap a$$ TRW flat tops. Ran easy 11.90's in a heavy car. Oh well, the stang is pretty damn easy on the eyes though.

------------------
Todd
1995 GT/T-5
Pulleys; 65 mm TB; Flowmaster cat-back; Mac off road H-pipe; FMS aluminum driveshaft; short-throw shifter; HD clutch; Cobra R's; Cobra front and wing

fiveohpatrol · 09-15-2001, 01:10 AM

your definately gonna need to either swap to a T-5 or get a Lentech (or equiv.) with about a 2800-3000 stall converter
oh yah i just read a post a couple weeks back of a naturally aspirated SN95 vert breaking into the 12's, i believe his name is killercanary

------------------
88 Notch, B&M Ripper, 3.73's, Ported E7's, Explorer int. w/ ported lower, pulleys, 1.7RR's, BBK headers, off-road H-pipe, flowmasters, subframes, 65mm TB, March ram air ,MSD coil, U/L control arms, 155lph f/p, Crane Adj.FPR, Nitto drag radials, best 1/4--> 13.76@101.4 on a 2.17 60ft

Skyman · 09-15-2001, 01:50 AM

You could copy my combo. Lots of lowend torque. Peaks about 5500rpm so its great for a daily driver. I get 23 mpg on the freeway at 70mph.

It goes mid 12's on motor, and 11's on the N20. (As soon as I get to spray it at the track)

Skyler

------------------
-1989 Saleen Mustang #406-
TFS TW Heads, E-303, Edelbrock intake, 70mm TB, 73mm MAF, 24lb injectors, 1 5/8 shorties, Off Road H, 3 Chamber flows, Jaz Race seats, Back seat removed, sub-frames, Roll Cage, and a 80 shot of N20.
12.54@107.4 Motor
332RWHP, 350rwtq

09-14-2001, 10:56 AM	#1
cad614 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 1999 Location: San Angelo, TX Posts: 377	Design me a combo... I'm closing in on the time to make my car run. I finished up the Cervini's Stalker kit, subframe connectors will be installed soon, and Koni's (yellows) should be on within a month. Just a few more suspension components and then I'll be going after the engine and transmission. Here's the goal: 12 second Daily Driver! Honestly low 13's would be fine, but I'd love to see 12s. I want to design a plan so that every dollar I spend will go towards my goal. I know I'll have to get a roll cage, but I figure I should get it out of the 15's before I get one. Figure I'd start with a block. Which one should I get, 302 or 351? Only concern I have is having to replace my hood, I really like it. I have a friend with a old Boss 302 that I can probally get for a good price, but besides it having a four bolt main I don't know much about these blocks, will it work for me? I do plan on building an entirely new drivetrain but, if the stock 8.8 rear will support the final results should I consider getting 3.73's now? I imagine 4.10's, which would be ideal now, would be a bit much with a stronger engine. I know this is going to take awhile, but someday I will accomplish it. Then when I'm finished and I have an article on pg 52 of MM&FF, I'll be proud to say, "I couldn't have done it without all the great advise from the members of MustangWorks.com"! ------------------ '95 GT Convertable

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09-14-2001, 11:56 AM	#2
Smokedawg Tires Fear Me... Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 867	If you go with a 351, you are going to run into many expensive changes. I would stick with a fresh 302 and get a setup such as Skymans or Ricks91GT..They are deep into the 12's... Good luck. ------------------ 347 Stroker Motor: Balanced, Cobra Transmission, Extrude Ported and Polished Upper and ported Lower, GT40 Milled Ported and Polished Heads, B303 Cam, BBK 1 5/8 Headers, 30lb Bosch Injectors, Holley AFPR, March Underdrive Pulleys, Perma-Cool Fan, 3-Core Radiator, Accel Performance Coil, Accel 300+ Racing Wires, Ram Air, K&N Filter, 73mm Vortech MAF, 70mm TB, FlowMaster Exhaust w/BBK Offroad H-Pipe, Hurst Shifter, 3:55 Gears, Ram Clutch, Cross Drilled Rotors, AC and Smog del, rear seat del.

09-14-2001, 12:13 PM	#3
84LX89GT Mustangs Join Date: Jul 2000 Posts: 1,938	I agree with smokedawg, changing to a 351 would require to begin with a new hood so i won't get into the specifics of that swap. Basically if you have a good induction/exhaust system matched for a higher rpm band and gears and add a supercharger to that you'll EASILY get at least into the 12's. I've heard that a holley systemax kit will get most vehicles anywhere between the mid-high 12's depending on the driving, but then again you have a convertible which is pretty heavy. If money is no object, then my limited opinion is a holley systemax II kit (because it's all flow/powerband matched as a kit), a 9 psi supercharger like a Vortech S-trim, Paxton NOVI2000, etc. at least 1 5/8" primary headers with 2 1/2" dual exhaust, maybe even 1 3/4" with 3" dual exhaust becuase i believe you'd be pushing close to 450 horsepower or even more. You could also get a stroker short block setup to go with the systemax II (or whatever you choose) like a 331 or 347 to increase torque output for your heavy vehicle and having a supercharger would also greatly enhance your off the line launch. To go with all the extra power i believe that you'd need things like 30# injectors with a calibrated MAF sensor, maybe even a larger fuel rail, 255lph fuel pump, i don't know but maybe you may need to swap to larger fuel lines in general as well. A custom burnt chip dyno tuned chip would also be a good investment. These are just some ideas and i'm sure everyone will have something good to share. I hope this was inspiring or helpful somewhat . Good luck, -side note: unless you want to change to carburetion, a BOSS 302, which is has cleveland heads would probably not do very well in your daily driver criteria. ------------------ previous name: 84stangLX '84 Mustang 5.0 LX my LX '89 Mustang GT my GT

09-14-2001, 12:37 PM	#4
cad614 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 1999 Location: San Angelo, TX Posts: 377	Thanks guys, keep it coming. 84LX89GT - About the BOSS, what I was primarily concerned with was the block. I figured the heads would probally be replaced with something better than stock reguardless of how good they were. Thanks for the advise though, I learn somethin new everyday.

09-14-2001, 01:15 PM	#5
bada$$lx Guest Posts: n/a	Stick w/ the 302...the 351 is an awesome motor, but Smokedawgs right, it'll end up being way too expensive, just for a 12 second car. Check out the set ups of us w/ 12 second cars, and see which you like, don't like and possibly mix and match . As far as your stock 8.8 rear, it should be just fine, so go for the 3.73's now. ------------------ '90 LX 5.0;12K original miles (no sh*&);3.55 gears; March pulleys;Edelbrock Performer Heads;BBK 1 5/8" equal length shorties;MSD 6AL ignition w/ blaster 2 coil;FMS E303 cam;Pro-M 75mm MAF;BBK 70mm TB; Eibach drag-launch spring kit;Southside welded subs;9" K&N cone filter charger;Hurst shifter;Cervini's 3" turbo hood;A/C delete; gutted cats;2 chamber Flomasters;Corbeau racing seats;FMS 30# injectors;JMS chip; Holley 190lb fp;TFS track heat Intake (12.299 @ 113 - 1.78 60')

09-14-2001, 03:52 PM	#6
fiveohpatrol I'd rather be basketweaving Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 2,551	its fairy easy to take a fox LX into the 12's but you guys have to notice that he's got a SN95 vert. im hoping its not an automatic? cause that would make it even harder if it were me, i'd go with a sportsman 302 block just for peace of mind, with a 331 stroker kit from DSS, AFR185's, GT40 intake (or holley intake if a supercharger is in mind) not sure what cam specs to tell ya, but im sure with these and some dragradials you'll be running well into the 12's ------------------ 88 Notch, B&M Ripper, 3.73's, Ported E7's, Explorer int. w/ ported lower, pulleys, 1.7RR's, BBK headers, off-road H-pipe, flowmasters, subframes, 65mm TB, March ram air ,MSD coil, U/L control arms, 155lph f/p, Crane Adj.FPR, Nitto drag radials, best 1/4--> 13.76@101.4 on a 2.17 60ft

09-14-2001, 04:19 PM	#7
cad614 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 1999 Location: San Angelo, TX Posts: 377	Oh ya... this things a slug! Convertable *and* AODE! That's why I'm looking for a little bit of help, there aren't many SN95 verts running that quick.

09-14-2001, 11:59 PM	#8
todd95GT Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Palm Beach Gardens, Florida, USA Posts: 191	Make sure when you order a cam that you contact a company like JMS and provide them with the motor and cam specs so they can burn you a custom chip. 94-95 EEC-IV's don't like to idle with aftermarket cams unless the chip is burnt for your application. I have a 95 coupe, some bolt-ons, and eventually I will break the twelves. It feels like a 14 second car now, and I notice it really doesn't have much to offer once I slam third gear. But then again, I know I will need the entire upper half of the motor done up to run that quick in this car. It was so easy with my Chevelle, 350, 10:1, stock iron heads and cheap a$$ TRW flat tops. Ran easy 11.90's in a heavy car. Oh well, the stang is pretty damn easy on the eyes though. ------------------ Todd 1995 GT/T-5 Pulleys; 65 mm TB; Flowmaster cat-back; Mac off road H-pipe; FMS aluminum driveshaft; short-throw shifter; HD clutch; Cobra R's; Cobra front and wing

09-15-2001, 01:10 AM	#9
fiveohpatrol I'd rather be basketweaving Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 2,551	your definately gonna need to either swap to a T-5 or get a Lentech (or equiv.) with about a 2800-3000 stall converter oh yah i just read a post a couple weeks back of a naturally aspirated SN95 vert breaking into the 12's, i believe his name is killercanary ------------------ 88 Notch, B&M Ripper, 3.73's, Ported E7's, Explorer int. w/ ported lower, pulleys, 1.7RR's, BBK headers, off-road H-pipe, flowmasters, subframes, 65mm TB, March ram air ,MSD coil, U/L control arms, 155lph f/p, Crane Adj.FPR, Nitto drag radials, best 1/4--> 13.76@101.4 on a 2.17 60ft

09-15-2001, 01:50 AM	#10
Skyman I need 110mph Trap Speed! Join Date: Feb 1999 Location: So, CA Posts: 4,315	You could copy my combo. Lots of lowend torque. Peaks about 5500rpm so its great for a daily driver. I get 23 mpg on the freeway at 70mph. It goes mid 12's on motor, and 11's on the N20. (As soon as I get to spray it at the track) Skyler ------------------ -1989 Saleen Mustang #406- TFS TW Heads, E-303, Edelbrock intake, 70mm TB, 73mm MAF, 24lb injectors, 1 5/8 shorties, Off Road H, 3 Chamber flows, Jaz Race seats, Back seat removed, sub-frames, Roll Cage, and a 80 shot of N20. 12.54@107.4 Motor *332RWHP, 350rwtq*