How can i get this off?

[66StangGuy]

Problem: Passenger shock is stuck. The thread on the 2 bolts on the bottom of the passenger shock is stripped so the bolt wont go up or down..its stuck near the botton so i have room to cut it out but what can i cut it with? is there any tool that will fit in the space thats there? also any tips on how i could get the bolt off. The problem started with the wrong bolt on for the thread so i just chewed it up and now it just spins either way. ben like this sice i bought it and it makes a lot of noise becuase its loose. I was planning on getting new shocks for the car.. any ideas how i can get this out? its only on the one bolt thats closer to the wheel. the inside one is fine and the drivers side shock is fine as far as i know. What shock( if i can get the old ones off) should i buy for my stang? the front was already lowered by the previous owner and i dont know what was done or what kind of shocks are there now. The back is raised. any tips guys?

[Clark Rodgers]

There is no easy answer to this but I will give you some options. First, you can wedge something under the nut while you are turning it, some kind of prybar. Second, cutting it off would be nice, but due to the location it will be tough to get a hacksaw or cutting wheel in there. Last, is there anyway you can hit either the nut or stud with a SHARP chisel. This way you could split the nut or cut the stud. It is a good thing it is the one facing the out side and you could also disconnect the upper bolts and then raise the car this will help let the suspension extend down further.

As far as the new shocks go, I recommend either the KYB gas adjust or the GR2 one's. Defintely the best shock for the money.

[jim_howard_pdx]

This is an easy one.....

First, remove the coil spring with a spring compressor tool. Use a proper tool since this spring can kill you if it were to suddenly release under pressure. A good spring compressor costs about 50 dollars or you can rent one for 20 dollars. I like the type that compress from the outside. Then you can use it for struts as well.

Second remove the nuts from the bottom side of the coil spring saddle mount and use a drift punch to push the threads up through the control arm. The upper bolt is actually pressed into the saddle, just like a wheel stud. So if you try to twist it, you will simply break off the bolt head! Only loosen the lower nuts, do not touch the top bolt heads. Use a hammer and drift pin and gently tap the saddle bolts up through the control arm. When they release, you shock will be free.

You can now mount it on a vice and saw or cut the nut. This whole procedure can be accomplished in less than 30 minutes. The Mustang front end is that easy to work on.

At this time you should replace the spring saddle mount with a new unit. I usually press out the shock bar and use a polyurethane bushing. If you do this, you need to wrap the poly bushing with 3 to 4 layers of teflon tape and press it in with a good clean surface and some grease so the teflon does not get pushed away. This prevents squeeks that are common on polyurethane bushings. I do this on my sway bar mounts as well.

I bet all the rubber will be shot on the old coil spring saddle.

I would consider changing front springs. Use the 620 coils if you want to drop the front end a bit. You will corner much flatter, and your car will handle more like a new car. You can also try the Eibach progressive springs. I am using their 460-640 rate springs. You get the stock cushy ride when on the highway, and it corners just as flat as my old 620 springs.

Carroll Shelby spent some time on Ford's computer to analyze how to get a Mustang to corner. He found that by drilling a hole exactly one inch under the stock upper A arm holes he could get much more neutral camber under cornering loads. You simply drill the hole down one inch and move the hole 1/8 inch closer to the back of the car. This improves the caster angle which gives you high speed steering stability A GOOD THING ON ANY MUSTANG. You do not need to go back 1/8 inch for 69 and newer Mustangs since the factory improved the caster angle in the 69 model year.

You should DEFINITELY change the spring perch mount and coil springs at this time. Stock springs are flat out dangerous. High speed wobbling is common, and the positive camber changes when you corner drastically reduce tire contact. If you are on wet or sandy ground, fast maneuvers can bite you bad with the stock configuration.

Hope this helps.

By the way, using a monte carlo bar and export brace are absolutely essential to maintaining proper alignment on your Mustang. The shock towers actually bend in about 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch which makes your tires wear really funky. When you are driving under load these shock towers are constantly flexing in and out. Imagine what the tires do as these shock towers flex?

Use the monte carlo bar and the export brace along with the shelby one inch drop. Your car will now handle ver similar to the current vehicles on the road. You will be glad you did these very simple modifications. The first time you need to make a fast move to avoid an accident, you will know that the modifications are a life saver. Only someone looking for the Shelby drop will notice the extra holes where the factory A arm holes were drilled.

[Clark Rodgers]

Jim,
This is a great explanation of how to help him but how is he going to remove the coil spring with the shock still attached?
I guess he could try and remove the whole saddle, with the shock using an external spring compressor.

[Jeff65]

First, I'd try using a chisel and sledge or better yet air chisel to break the nut off. Go straight into the nut from the bottom side. I'll bet the nut cracks fairly easily with an air chisel. If you don't like this approach, I would drill it out from the bottom. Center punch the ends of the shock, use a hardened drill bit then drill right up the center of nut. Even if the drill drifts off center it doesn't matter much because you're neither trying to save the shock or the nut.

[gofastmercury]

Carroll Shelby spent some time on Ford's computer to analyze how to get a Mustang to corner. He found that by drilling a hole exactly one inch under the stock upper A arm holes he could get much more neutral camber under cornering loads. You simply drill the hole down one inch and....

Your right this will improve the camber curve. But there is a trade off, the upper balljoint is no longer in the center of its range of motion, and bottoming out the car could wreck it, not a good thing, as I mean it could pop it out. It was a risk CS was willing to take. There is a kit out there with a angled spacer for the ball joint that will allow you to move it even further, about a inch and a half, and do it safely.

[jim_howard_pdx]

The negative wedge plate allows you to dial in more negative chamber. This is ok for racing but is DANGEROUS on the street or highway.

The roads are purposely angled so that water will run off the pavement.

The angle of that drainage is pretty much standardized throughout the nation. WHY? Because every car is aligned so that it will drive straight on the road at speed, without pulling right or left.

So most street and highway cars would simply scrub the edge right off their tires in 20-30 thousand miles if they dialed in negative chamber. You must align the car. That means that the chamber will be different for the right and left tire.

So if you are aligned, you will have approximately 2/3 degree positive chamber on the driver side, and 1 1/2 degree POSITIVE chamber on the passenger tire.

SO WHAT DID THAT NEGATIVE WEDGE PLATE DO FOR YOU?

NOTHING!!!! You would literally have to have the car loaded all the way over on the suspension to get ANY benefit from the wedge plates!

The proper way to get negative chamber while cornering, and still have neutral chamber while running straight is to use unequal length A arms. Back in the 70's Global West Suspension began selling a shortened upper A arm with properly tuned ball joint geometry. These arms work very well on the street.

Now Global West arms and Total Control Product arms are the right way to go. The negative wedge plates work basically ONLY at the track, and you have to dial in the negative chamber on the tire because it does not shorten the A-arm. Even with the additional 1/2 inch drop, the shortening of the A arm is extremely minor.

So why does anyone use the wedges? Because several racing brackets prohibit you from using NON STOCK A-arms. So we run the wedge plates in these classifications. Not because they are good, simply because they are the only way to dial in negative chamber using the stock A-arm with a Shelby drop.

Hope this helps. If you have the money, buy those Global West arms. They are absolutely the finest way to improve the handling on an early Mustang.

The TCP stuff is nice, especially for racing. With the Global West arms you get Delrin bushings and synthetic grease to eliminate bind and wear. The Global West arms are the right way to deal with maintenance.

Unless you are racing a car on a track, and have the desire to dial in negative chamber, the negative wedge plate will offer you almost zero difference over the Shelby drop.

I have run the Shelby drop on my car since 1979. My car has 290,000 miles on it, and 180,000 miles WITH THE DROP.

My ball joints are ORIGINAL and they measure NO WEAR simply because I grease them with moly grease every 5,000 miles.

I have bottomed the car out hundreds of times. NO PROBLEMS. PLEASE do not scare people about the 1 inch drop. Simply make sure your parts are in good shape and go for it.

Actually, the concern over the Shelby 1 inch drop is that during very heavy cornering loads, the ball joint is at a drastic angle. It is possible to bind the joint, in which case you now have a skate board instead of a suspension. This has never happened to me. I have no desire to put the car on the very edge of its handling capability. .

For the street, do the drop and run the factory alignment. This will give you safe driving, good tire wear, and a big grin on your face.

[Lou Lyman]

I read with much interest this thread concerning the drop. Can someone provide step by step directions to accomplish this? Perhaps a link to a website.

I own a 1966 coupe but have never worked on the front suspension. Looking behind the wheels I notice covers or plates bolted around the top portion of the coil springs. Would assume these should be removed to apply the spring compressors.

"Reposition the hole 1 inch down & 1/8 inch to the rear" This would be 2 holes per side?

I do grease the car and cannot find grease fitting on driver side ball joint (think it is origional). Passenger side has been replaced and gets lubed.

When complete vehicle should be aligned?

Thanks for any advice or info.

Lou

[jim_howard_pdx]

When I decided to do the drop, I purchased a 1" sway bar with polyurethane bushings, and a polyurethane bushing kit, and front 620 shelby rate springs from TMC (traction master company) in Los Angeles. They were supplying Shelby for a time.

They gave me the paper template that I layed over the two upper control arm holes to properly locate and drill the bottom holes. I used a punch and hammer to make a dent so the small drill would not walk. I then drilled the hole to the exact size specified. That was it for that.

The polyurethane bushing kit included bushings for the link end of the sway bar, for the lower control arm bushing, and for the spring saddle perch. I had a shop press the old bushings out. The new ones go in without pressing. I used synthetic grease to help eliminate squeeks.

Your upper A arm uses solid bushings. You need to make sure the solid bushings and the ball joints are good. you can drill the ball joint without the zerk fitting and add one. This would be what I would do. Also, when you move the upper A arms back 1/8 inch it makes it hard to lube the driver rear upper A arm fitting. I have seen long zerks for sale in the NPD or Mustangs Plus catalog. Buy these. It will make routine greasing really easy.

Shelby American Auto Club will also have the template for the 1" drop. Seems that some of the 65 and 66 Shelby's left the lot in Long Beach without the drop. Guess they had deadlines to meet.

Hope this helps. You can email me at jim_howard_pdx@yahoo.com if you have additional questions or concerns.

Jim

[Lou Lyman]

Thanks Jim,

Now can you provide the basics to remove the spring?
(1) Remove wheel
(2) Remove shock
(3) Remove plate covering top portion of spring ??
(4) Compress spring [details??]
(5) Remove spring [details??]
(6) Unbolt upper control arm - 2 bolts?
(7) Mark and drill new holes - as per your previous message
(8) Replace spring saddles, bushings, shocks, etc, as needed

Have I got this in correct order? Advise any steps I have missed. Excuse my ignorance on this subject.

Lou

[gofastmercury]

Hey jim I think you have your camber mixed up. Putting 1.5 deg pos itive on right side and 2/3 pos on left will make that car to the right, bad. your wheels would look like this: / / ( from behind) If you rember on a bike, if you lean that way it will turn that way. The road also tilts to the right, so a car set up like that will have a hard time keeping out of the ditch.

The relocated holes don't make it have more camber, it makes so when the spring compresses it changes the camber curve. factory it will go positive, with the mod it will go negative. So when you turn hard right(for example) the left side compresses, and instead of the tire trying to out at the top and giving a smaller contact patch the harder you turn, it goes the other way and keaps the tire flat.

I have only seen a handfull of cars with positive camber as a spec. And those tend to front drivers that grandma might drive.

[jim_howard_pdx]

I did not mean to say two or three degrees positive chamber on the drivers side. Sorry I put down 2/3 which means two thirds of one degree on the driver side, and 1 and 1/2 degrees on the passenger side. The tires need to ride flat to the angle of the roads built in curvature or the car will pull. The drivers side is always less than the passenger side. Neither side is negative chamber.

For the 1" drop, it will not produce negative chamber during cornering because the stock A arm is just too long. All the Shelby drop will do is create neutral chamber.

If you look at any early mustang cornering at speed you will see that the wheels are still excessively positive in chamber. Usually the inside tire will have nearly no road contact at all. Most of this is due to the torque of the unibody. I use subframe connectors to improve stability. A 10 point roll cage will put the car at 1.0 G with the Global West negative chamber arm. This arm really will get you negative chamber when you load.

Shelby had his team dial in about 1.5 to 2.0 degrees of negative chamber at the alignment end, so his cars would corner better. Remember that the Shelby 1 inch drop creates neutral chamber during cornering not negative chamber. By alignment, he dialed in the negative chamber he needed by the track he raced. This preload allowed him to scoot around the Corvettes and Jaguars.

The negative wedge plates allow you to get 3-4 degrees preset negative chamber on the race track. This is outstanding, but tire wear will be hard. They do provide a little more negative chamber in cornering, but the body flex of the unibody usually counteracts that slight improvement.

The Global West arms or the Total Control Product arms will give you true negative chamber. But you still need the monte carlo bar and export brace. Then consider welding in front torque boxes and running a sub frame connector. Some racing classes forbid running non stock A-arms in order to make things fair--so the early year Corvettes won't look so BAD.

A good 6 point roll bar system can then tie the front frame, and both ends of the rear subframe all together. This will be optimum for handling.

[Rev]

My '66 Ford shop manual shows for V-8 Mustang applications the following specs:

1.) Camber max. +1 1/4 deg, min. -1/4 deg, max variation between wheels 1/2 deg., ideal is +1/2 deg.

2.) Caster max. +1 deg., min. -1 deg., max. variation between wheels 1/2 deg., ideal is +1/2 deg.

3.) Toe in max. 3/8", min. 1/8", ideal is 1/4"

Doesn't say one side should be different from the other, in fact it implies that the adjustments should be as close to the same as possible.

I adjust mine with 0 deg of camber, about 2 deg of + caster, and only 1/8" of toe in. That's with a tight front end though. The car handles well on the street with 620 1" drop front coils with 1/4 coil removed. This lowers the front about all I can stand with no tire rub. I also use a 1 1/8" sway bar and Gabriel Strider adjustable front shocks. Even with out the Shelby drop, the car handles well with 215/60/15 BFG radial TA's front and 235/60/15's at the rear. I use 5 leaf rear springs with the mid eye option and a 3/4" sway bar. Same Gabriel Strider adjustable shocks. Works well for me on a street driven performance car.

Rev